369LikesSeattle RC Racers/Hangar 30
06-26-2013, 08:46 PM
The big issue is there isn't anything faster than the D3.5 17.5. Nothing new has come out that is as fast. Nothing. Even the new Kill Shot motor, for all of it's awesomeness is not as fast as the D3.5. The D4 will not be as fast, either.
So what ROAR, and this settlement are saying is we're to allow this motor for 80% of our racing season, then once again ban it. Track records will fall, races will be won, basically with a illegitimate motor.
Easiest solution, in my opinion and mind, is to NOT allow it back. That's the position I am taking, that is my vote. If you still have one, you have a window of opportunity to sell it - and that's my suggestion.
Racing has been better, and closer, without the D3.5.
It's true, we do use ROAR as a guideline for our rules, for the most part. But this is still OUR club to do with what we want, and we cannot be forced to do something we do not want to do.
What they are doing makes sense from the settlement stand point, but it really isn't helping anyone. We already banned the motor, many people already got rid of theirs, let's just walk away from it and put it to rest where it belongs.
I'd also like to point out I am not anti-Trinity in anyway, very much the opposite, I am a team driver.
Please notice also, Trinity is not arguing that the motor is legal. The argument is how it was removed from the list. Otherwise they would just re-issue the D3.5 for approval, it cannot get approved - it fails tech.
In the end: What's best for the club?
So what ROAR, and this settlement are saying is we're to allow this motor for 80% of our racing season, then once again ban it. Track records will fall, races will be won, basically with a illegitimate motor.
Easiest solution, in my opinion and mind, is to NOT allow it back. That's the position I am taking, that is my vote. If you still have one, you have a window of opportunity to sell it - and that's my suggestion.
Racing has been better, and closer, without the D3.5.
It's true, we do use ROAR as a guideline for our rules, for the most part. But this is still OUR club to do with what we want, and we cannot be forced to do something we do not want to do.
What they are doing makes sense from the settlement stand point, but it really isn't helping anyone. We already banned the motor, many people already got rid of theirs, let's just walk away from it and put it to rest where it belongs.
I'd also like to point out I am not anti-Trinity in anyway, very much the opposite, I am a team driver.
Please notice also, Trinity is not arguing that the motor is legal. The argument is how it was removed from the list. Otherwise they would just re-issue the D3.5 for approval, it cannot get approved - it fails tech.
In the end: What's best for the club?
I was enforce not to use the D3.5..because it isn't Roar legal..NO big deal I brought new motor...what the big deal about D3.5 ,it's only for short time before it become Non Roar legal next year..give the racers fair chance to run their D3.5 for what it paid for ,instead of paper weight..
Win win win ..still it doesn't put food on your table
just an Hobby sport
Last edited by OVA; 06-26-2013 at 09:13 PM.
06-26-2013, 09:39 PM
The decision by Roar and Trinity to settle appears to be a monetary decision ( to avoid the losses due to a court case where the lawyers will ultimately only win.) Roar, a non profit org funded by us racers, made the only logical financial decision by settling.
It is apparent the motor does not meet Roar's specifications because it will be banned again.
It seems to me, that allowing the D3.5 17.5 *at our club* would force more people to make the same bad investment again ( to be competitive ) but this time we don't need a crystal ball because we know on March 31, 2014 it becomes a paper weight, again !
Jake D.
It is apparent the motor does not meet Roar's specifications because it will be banned again.
It seems to me, that allowing the D3.5 17.5 *at our club* would force more people to make the same bad investment again ( to be competitive ) but this time we don't need a crystal ball because we know on March 31, 2014 it becomes a paper weight, again !
Jake D.
Last edited by Magnet Top; 06-26-2013 at 09:51 PM.
06-26-2013, 10:00 PM
The decision by Roar and Trinity to settle appears to be a monetary decision ( to avoid the losses due to a court case where the lawyers will ultimately only win.) Roar, a non profit org funded by us racers, made the only logical financial decision by settling.
It is apparent the motor does not meet Roar's specifications because it will be banned again.
It seems to me, that allowing the D3.5 17.5 *at our club* would force more people to make the same bad investment again ( to be competitive ) but this time we don't need a crystal ball because we know on March 31, 2014 it becomes a paper weight, again !
Jake D.
It is apparent the motor does not meet Roar's specifications because it will be banned again.
It seems to me, that allowing the D3.5 17.5 *at our club* would force more people to make the same bad investment again ( to be competitive ) but this time we don't need a crystal ball because we know on March 31, 2014 it becomes a paper weight, again !
Jake D.
06-26-2013, 10:01 PM
The decision by Roar and Trinity to settle appears to be a monetary decision ( to avoid the losses due to a court case where the lawyers will ultimately only win.) Roar, a non profit org funded by us racers, made the only logical financial decision by settling.
It is apparent the motor does not meet Roar's specifications because it will be banned again.
It seems to me, that allowing the D3.5 17.5 *at our club* would force more people to make the same bad investment again ( to be competitive ) but this time we don't need a crystal ball because we know on March 31, 2014 it becomes a paper weight, again !
Jake D.
It is apparent the motor does not meet Roar's specifications because it will be banned again.
It seems to me, that allowing the D3.5 17.5 *at our club* would force more people to make the same bad investment again ( to be competitive ) but this time we don't need a crystal ball because we know on March 31, 2014 it becomes a paper weight, again !
Jake D.
it doesn't hurt to use up your d 3.5 ,why not you already paid for it..
This how I see it ,ROAR screwed up..why shall we suffer
06-26-2013, 10:10 PM
Tech Initiate
06-26-2013, 10:14 PM
First, let me say that I think it totally sucks for some of our racers to spend their hard-earned money on a motor they're told is ROAR approved, then learn it has been banned 10 months after the initial approval. ROAR screwed-up and more importantly, they screwed their members. It seems a series of other mistakes (also ROAR's doing, based on my understanding) led to their decision and they have made other changes to ensure they don't screw their members in the same way again. So while they totally screwed-up, they seem to have made the right changes to keep it from happening again.
That said....if we (the club members) believe the D3 was reinstated for legal reasons, and not because it's equal to the other 17.5 motors on the market, then I don't think we should allow it. It's a technical loophole and this is one of the rare occasions where we get to make the call. Plus there's the potential inclination - after a D3 guy beats you - to dismiss the result because his motor "isn't really ROAR approved."
So why would we re-open the loophole and allow our club members to blow their money on a motor that will be "unapproved" for the second time and call into question their results? Races should be won on the carpet, not in the rulebooks.
Mic drop. Peace out.
That said....if we (the club members) believe the D3 was reinstated for legal reasons, and not because it's equal to the other 17.5 motors on the market, then I don't think we should allow it. It's a technical loophole and this is one of the rare occasions where we get to make the call. Plus there's the potential inclination - after a D3 guy beats you - to dismiss the result because his motor "isn't really ROAR approved."
So why would we re-open the loophole and allow our club members to blow their money on a motor that will be "unapproved" for the second time and call into question their results? Races should be won on the carpet, not in the rulebooks.
Mic drop. Peace out.
06-26-2013, 10:19 PM
06-26-2013, 10:31 PM
Well when they banned it the answer for why was roar track roar rules, so now that it's legal again, even tho it may not be legal to some, u need to honor the first decision that pretty much screwed me and a few other people, and let us run the motors we have sitting in our boxes, I still haven't found a decent motor to replace it, I don't have the cash laying around to find another fast motor.. Let us run them and then when they are made illegal again no one will have any surprises and we will gracefully let them go.. I wasn't ready last time!
06-26-2013, 10:38 PM
I think last year it was pretty clear that the A-Main podium regulars were still up there, in pretty much the same order, after the D3.5 was banned. In fact, I think they still got faster after Jake starting posting videos regularly.
So while I don't expect allowing it to make a difference in who wins or loses on a given race night, I still don't think we should allow it. The club adjusted to the change, everyone who raced last year should still have a motor, some people have probably already bought Kill Shots, and we should not encourage anyone who hasn't yet bought a motor to buy something that won't even see them through the season.
All that being said, I want to see some Mod TC B-mains this year!
Kody
Sean
Jake
Alex
Swadener
Brett
Kuney
Lem
Cartwright (if he can stop melting his gear)
Jenkins (you know he can't stay away...)
Curry (raced more last season than the last 3 put together!)
Harbke (if he gets the sand out of his manties and sorts out that Hot Potties car)
Forbes (he's hooked)
Me
Not to mention the out-of-towner wildcards, who I don't remember all of them...
Malkinson, Panoz....
And if entries at the NWAC are any indication.... Look out for Scale Spec! It went huge last season, and looks like it's still growing!
-Mike
So while I don't expect allowing it to make a difference in who wins or loses on a given race night, I still don't think we should allow it. The club adjusted to the change, everyone who raced last year should still have a motor, some people have probably already bought Kill Shots, and we should not encourage anyone who hasn't yet bought a motor to buy something that won't even see them through the season.
All that being said, I want to see some Mod TC B-mains this year!
Kody
Sean
Jake
Alex
Swadener
Brett
Kuney
Lem
Cartwright (if he can stop melting his gear)
Jenkins (you know he can't stay away...)
Curry (raced more last season than the last 3 put together!)
Harbke (if he gets the sand out of his manties and sorts out that Hot Potties car)
Forbes (he's hooked)
Me
Not to mention the out-of-towner wildcards, who I don't remember all of them...
Malkinson, Panoz....
And if entries at the NWAC are any indication.... Look out for Scale Spec! It went huge last season, and looks like it's still growing!
-Mike
06-26-2013, 11:10 PM
Garret, Trinity screwed you by pushing an questionable motor through. Let's face it, this is a goofy ruling. You want to use a motor that was "out of spec" but slipped through? So you can claim a Seattle RC Racers track record with a motor that is out of spec? Just to have it erased the end of March? Just so you can justify your purchase? Who cares at this point? Trinity already made it's money. We are left hanging onto the shitty end of the poop bag. I see no reason to bring illegal motors back into our club for a short period of time just to make those that got suckered into Trinity's marketing scheme just to "feel good" about their purchase. There are plenty of motor manufactures out there that followed the specs and released great products. Argue all you want about legality of motor, it's going off line in March..... that says it all. It aint right.
bb
bb
06-26-2013, 11:18 PM
i didnt take scale spec seriously last year..... a motor i abused the hell out of, a neglected car, not sure if all the shocks had oil in them, and still had alot of fun with it.. easy driving.. some close racing.. but i am wanting to step it up a lil bit!
going to be running a 6.1 on d compound tires with a AMC Javelin body. as i have not used the vintage wheels.. im not sure if i should use slicks or the treaded tires... as they are about $40 a set, I dont wanna buy both..
let the flaming and the advice begin
going to be running a 6.1 on d compound tires with a AMC Javelin body. as i have not used the vintage wheels.. im not sure if i should use slicks or the treaded tires... as they are about $40 a set, I dont wanna buy both..
let the flaming and the advice begin
06-26-2013, 11:38 PM
Tech Regular
iTrader: (6)
i didnt take scale spec seriously last year..... a motor i abused the hell out of, a neglected car, not sure if all the shocks had oil in them, and still had alot of fun with it.. easy driving.. some close racing.. but i am wanting to step it up a lil bit!
going to be running a 6.1 on d compound tires with a AMC Javelin body. as i have not used the vintage wheels.. im not sure if i should use slicks or the treaded tires... as they are about $40 a set, I dont wanna buy both..
let the flaming and the advice begin
going to be running a 6.1 on d compound tires with a AMC Javelin body. as i have not used the vintage wheels.. im not sure if i should use slicks or the treaded tires... as they are about $40 a set, I dont wanna buy both..
let the flaming and the advice begin
Is the hanger going to run vta as 21.5 or 25.5? Will novice 12th scale use 25.5 again this year or would it be better to start in 17.5? I would like t try carpet racing. What days are going to be race nights?
06-26-2013, 11:44 PM
i didnt take scale spec seriously last year..... a motor i abused the hell out of, a neglected car, not sure if all the shocks had oil in them, and still had alot of fun with it.. easy driving.. some close racing.. but i am wanting to step it up a lil bit!
going to be running a 6.1 on d compound tires with a AMC Javelin body. as i have not used the vintage wheels.. im not sure if i should use slicks or the treaded tires... as they are about $40 a set, I dont wanna buy both..
let the flaming and the advice begin
going to be running a 6.1 on d compound tires with a AMC Javelin body. as i have not used the vintage wheels.. im not sure if i should use slicks or the treaded tires... as they are about $40 a set, I dont wanna buy both..
let the flaming and the advice begin
06-27-2013, 12:03 AM
Garret, Trinity screwed you by pushing an questionable motor through. Let's face it, this is a goofy ruling. You want to use a motor that was "out of spec" but slipped through? So you can claim a Seattle RC Racers track record with a motor that is out of spec? Just to have it erased the end of March? Just so you can justify your purchase? Who cares at this point? Trinity already made it's money. We are left hanging onto the shitty end of the poop bag. I see no reason to bring illegal motors back into our club for a short period of time just to make those that got suckered into Trinity's marketing scheme just to "feel good" about their purchase. There are plenty of motor manufactures out there that followed the specs and released great products. Argue all you want about legality of motor, it's going off line in March..... that says it all. It aint right.
bb
bb
Me set a track record? Yeah right haha
06-27-2013, 12:45 AM
I haven't run VTA tires on carpet in a long time (I'm a GT kinda guy) but all the fast guys on VTA tires are using the treaded ones.
I actually liked the slicks on asphalt. I've had some great races with Pat Plueard where my slicks would start off slow, and his treads would start off fast, and I'd be struggling to stay with him for the first half, and then my slicks would come in and his treads would fade, and he'd struggle to hold me off... Ahhh, Scale Spec is so awesome.
-Mike
I actually liked the slicks on asphalt. I've had some great races with Pat Plueard where my slicks would start off slow, and his treads would start off fast, and I'd be struggling to stay with him for the first half, and then my slicks would come in and his treads would fade, and he'd struggle to hold me off... Ahhh, Scale Spec is so awesome.
-Mike