Awesome , hopefully it does but I wouldnt say its a definite based off of a cg drawing of an exploded view

When they reach us and we can physically teardown the engine , then we will see

First race with the Keep off 4
 

Yesterday was my first race with the Keep off 4. After i got it in race tune i was pleased with the power and speed. With it being as cold as it was I cant wait for the summer to get here.

Now do any of you who used the keep off used the werks 2058 pipe and the nova 9901 pipe which did you like better?

Kevin for me I like the 2096, 2058, then the 9901 in that order. The 2058 has a little softer bottom end then the 9901 but defiantly more top end. And it sounds pretty good too. :tire:

Thanks Nick
I will have my name on one of the new mbx7t and will be ordering the Keep off 7 for it. I cant wait for the month of May now lol

dam rights it fuel related ..don't kid yourself otherwise.......worn crankpins and spun rod bushing..why do you think I ask everyone the same question about what fuel they use, and why do you think they all answer the same thing, same brands, same trouble over and over


All guys have to do is start measuring their crankpins, they will see right away which brands of fuel protect, and which brands do not......I have been tracking worn cranks for 2 seasons now, there is a definite relationship to the fuel being used and the rate of wear of the internals, anyways its almost always the same two brands of fuel at the source of the trouble...

In the end I have not seen a single worn crankpin on either Bones or Werks ..

Last year I had multiple racers challenge me on this same fuel issue....nobody believed this was possible.........I challenged them back to keep track of their crankpins..... Sure as shit is brown each and every one of them ended up finding rapid crankpin wear like i said they would, then each and every one swapped fuel brands and the wear stopped.......In the end not all fuel is equal, and just because a brands is popular or promoted by popular people does not mean its a great product............

You also have stated that dirt can get in through the front bearing, especially on Nova's. That and poor filter maintenance can wear crank pins also. I am not saying there arent plenty of bad fuels but I feel dirt is the major problem.

Rex

i have seen the same things happen with the brands that you favor also (busted rods anyway)

i prefer a certain fuel and recommend a certain fuel , especially for run in period

lubrication is a very tricky thing with these engines , most manufacturers are tailoring their oil pkgs to performance over engine longevity , guys want "fast" engines , you of all people should know that ;) there is a downside to a fuel with less oil and internal wear is it

tip : klotz techniplate kl-100 :D

Byron fuel
 

I'm 100% certain, Byron's 30-11 does not rapidly wear crank pin like that. That's a fact. Which is why it is the fuel I always reccomend. I see crank pins ast well over 10 gallons using the 30/11 blend. I consider the crank toast when it gets down to the 4.90-4.92 range.

Edit: 4.90-4.92 in the .21 engines. They start @ ~4.99-5.0

Wear is based on user, fuel and how your treat your motor. You cannot base wear on a single characteristic its a combination. I've used Byrons for years, never had issues with performance or premature failures. You can have the best fuel but if someone is cranking their needles & not maintaining their filters than your asking for issues. Break-in is HUGE especially if your using a low oil content without preheating this sets the tune for longevity especially on high pinch motors.

Jay, in my experience, the quality of the oil pkg in Byron's 30/11 is so good, you can run the engines way lean and still not have to worry about excessive crank pin wear. The piston and sleeve fitment suffers the most when running lean with this fuel but a resize is only $25. But your right, there are many many variables to consider.

yep
 

I clean and rebuild engines for myself and others and I find three factors involved in engine wear and performance.

1. Fuel. crappy fuel is crappy.

2. Dirt. dirt messes things up.

3. Abuse. Treating engines poorly from break in, to startup, to racing to maintenance always yields junk.

I have had great luck with Bones Brew break in fuel. One quart and a few extra tanks of race fuel with a little extra oil added to the race fuel works flawless for Novarossi, RB, and the FX engines I've used it in. The break in fuel has plenty of oil in it. You can see it all over the rear a arm etc...

After coming from using Byrons 25% 11% to Byrons I would say I have had less internal wear and more consistent tune and less flameouts. Byrons was really good fuel I just think after using Bones brew for the last 9 months or so it's better overall. Just my opinion and I did not do any lab tests or anything I'm just voicing my experience after keeping an eye on the engines and cleaning them fairly often for the last 4 years using both fuels. VP is probably the worst overall in my experience, based on the engines I've rebuilt. I got lots of arguments over the VP comments for the last 2 years or so and now guys are beginning to agree. I am not sponsored by any fuel company either. perhaps that is important to make clear.

I'm not sure what "two" brands of fuel are being discussed but I have excellent results with nitrotane. As do my none sponsored friends. My one friend is absolutely the most neglectful person when it comes to maintaining his equipment and he got 8+ gallons from his last nitrotec engine!. Original bearings and never put after run oil in his motor. It's actually still running now.

I too never use after run oil with nitrotane and get great life and power from nitrotane.

i'm not buying that it's the fuels I'm using...My P5 has been using the exact same fuel for 8-9 gallons now.

I would take a minute an measure the crankpin on your P5.......... you may never know till you look for it....

typically I am looking for both the overall diameter, but more importantly how round or out of round the crankpin is......vertical vs horizontal....As usually they don't wear evenly but rather turn oval or egg shaped....

I work on quite a few engines and I am very thorough in what I do..I clean ,inspect and measure each and every one... And Whenever I have find a wear issue I contact the client and take notes of what they run , what fuels they run, etc etc..and I also take pictures of the crankshafts for dirt, and flush the bearings for dirt etc etc..So needless to say I have a pretty well documented library of engines and engine issues that I have collected over the years....And it is my very strong opinion that the fuels you use will play a huge role in how fast or how slow your crankpin and rod bushing will wear......The harder and faster you run, the more and more of an issue this will become...... A previously mentioned example being a stock timed Nova 3 port Nitrotec which most basic fuels should provide adequate lubrication for...But keep in mind this is a relatively low powered, low RPM 3 port engine so its not going to be overly demanding of he fuel its being run on... the engine doesn't rev overly higher and it doesn't spool out overly fast......

However when we start stepping it up to higher timed, higher powered and higher RPM engines some of these fuels start falling quite short and causing wear issues..I see it all the time ........And when the lubrication fails, it happens very fast and over a relatively narrow performance threshold....Meaning you can go from well protected, to smoking your crankpin quite quickly... At 40 000 RPM it happens fast and nasty when the lubrication fails......

In the end some fuels have much stronger oils in then then other fuels, some oils will break down very rapidly and some oils will not break down nearly as readily ...and obviously fuels that use higher grade oils will protect your engines far better then fuels that use lower grade oils....But how much this matters to you is directly related to how hard you run and how fast and how how lean you intend to push your engines .. The harder you run the better the fuel your going to want to use.....

I have never seen crankpin wear issues with Byron's 30/11 ! :nod:

Just figured i would put that out there for Byrons guys supporting this blend