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Old 02-18-2008, 08:10 PM   #646
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Originally Posted by AdrianM View Post
I was being nice. All things being equal the Type-R and E4 will never be as good as a mass centralized, cells down the side car...and even they could be better.
I guess all the Formula 1 teams should go back to the drawing boards.
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Old 02-18-2008, 08:36 PM   #647
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I guess all the Formula 1 teams should go back to the drawing boards.
Jesus Schreff, you are killing me. I could write a book about how nothing from F1 applies to r/c cars. F1 cars don't even have properly functioning suspension. They rely on their aero package for 90% of their grip.

Thats said...F1 cars totally support what I said before. If you were to weigh every component on your Type-R and calculate the relative position of each part as a percentage of weight fore and aft of the car's center point (the intersection of lines drawn diagonally from the center of the contact patch of each tire) then do the same for an F1 car you would find the weight on your cars is much more spread out along the lenght of your than on an F1 car. The engine and the driver are the two heavist parts in an F1 car and even if you look at the transmission, electronics, radiators, etc... nothing of any significant weight on an F1 car is more than 25% away from the center point of the chassis.

Next....
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Old 02-18-2008, 08:57 PM   #648
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AdrianM View Post
I was being nice. All things being equal the Type-R and E4 will never be as good as a mass centralized, cells down the side car...and even they could be better.

Think of it this way...grab a broomstick in the middle and try to spin it back and forth. Then cut it into 4 equal lengths, bundle them up, grab them in the middle and spin them. You will be able to spin the bundle faster even though it weighs the same since the mass of the object is more centered.

This manifests itself in the Type-R and E4 has resistance to initiate turns and stop turning.

Can a Type-R or E4 win races, sure...any car and win a race sooner or later. Are drivers of these cars startiung out with a disadvantage, yes...its simple physics.
Your idea about the broom stick is right on. This is best seen with weights. Imagine a bar with weights out on the end very difficult to turn move the weights in and this becomes much easier. So I agree with that idea but the idea that the E4 and JRXS are bad I will not agree with.

These two cars are the best in this idea as the weight is very centralized. I will agree with the fact that the weight is spread out front to back compared to other cars which means it will transfer weight fore and aft slower. In my mind this is better. BUT left and right these cars have the closest center mass compared to anything on the market. Which means they can transfer left and right incredibly fast. I can agree with this statement as the car transfer from one way to another lightning fast.

I would also like to comment on the F1 comment. Those cars as well as indy cars have the most advance suspension setup in the world. They are able to reduce all sprung weight by using push rods and rocker arms instead of direct mounted shocks. By doing this they also gain the ability to adjust ride height seperate from spring preload and spring stiffness. RC Cars are still using the very basic type of shock set-up its not a bad thing because we are dealing with minimal weight but it would be nice to have ride height and springs seperate from each other.

With all of that I will get off the soap box and just say that the E4 is a great car to drive. And very well thought out.
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Old 02-18-2008, 08:58 PM   #649
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Hi Guys:

Thanks for all the kind words!!!!! I've been out of it for a few days (bad reaction to pain pills... rotator cuff issue, not recreational...don't do drugs) and my wife wouldn't even let me turn the computer on for the last few days or until I looked better (could be a long wait with those constraints).

I admit that I came off a bit strong at first. Sorry. Some took it as (he's just trying to blow smoke so that we will buy his cars) but in all honesty it was just that I was actually enthusiastic about something new in R/C. We were out of R/C for almost 3 years and everything was still S.S. different day and then we got to see the new TM stuff and wow!!! This really is different and best of all it's making me look like I know how to drive. But I learned my lesson. From now on its just the facts and the actual owners can be enthusiastic for us. The TM snowball in the USA and Canada is growing (and we continue to support anyone in the world that doesn't have a local dealer and asks for help). We are averaging about one new dealer / day. A lot of them are tracks. What we all want is great attendance at all the events so that they are there when we want to play. The number pure hobby shops is also growing. Both of these are our #2 priority. Priority #1 is getting parts to current owners. I blew it on our last order (that flying impaired thing again) and forgot to order a few common items so we are cutting open kits to keep everyone running. The good news is that we placed another order and are springing for the airfreight and free shipping on back ordered items. If you ordered 4 or 6 of the 2 parts were short on then you will get 2 to get you going and a spare. If you ordered 1 you will not see a dreaded back order on your packing list. We are also getting a great response on our "Club Program". If you haven't heard it's pretty simple. If you belong to a club we will offer a discount on the order of three or more kits. If you order more than $250 in parts on 1 order then we knock off 25% off the top. There are some exceptions as there are things that we sell that we don't make that much on. One other important condition is that if you have a local dealer (one that normally stocks the type of items you are purchasing and that we supply)the order HAS to go through them. We are TOTALLY committed to making Team Magic owners the best supported group in R/C.

There is also another issue that needs to be brought up and that is the "Most brushless motors will fit" issue. It turns out that one popular type is not included in that list. We've received notice that TOP and Peak Racing motors are at issue. I have not seen one but hope to buy one so that I can see the issue myself. The reports from users (thank you for sharing that info by the way) is that the rear brace needs to be removed to get the motor in and then there is almost no room for pinion choices. There is a "Dremmel" work around and we hope that the photos will be forthcoming. Going to a smaller Spur is also an option. But rather than sweep this under a rug, what we were hoping is that E4 owners will send us feedback as to how big of a problem is this let's say 1 - 10. A "1" would be like no big deal I expect to do a little rework on a serious race machine to "10": This is awful I will never buy one of these again. Most importantly it is an opportunity for the Tech elite to shine and come up with a solution for those that need a little guidance. One thing I like about R/C is that when the buzzer goes off it's everyone for themselves but until that moment almost everyone in the pits is related and willing to help those that need it. If you feel that your input is a little harsh for public consumption feel free to send it to us directly ([email protected]) We might still suggest that you post but we do appreciate the opportunity to vet some of the "emotion". When we are done we'll forward the best and most constructive input to Team Magic. I am planning a personal visit to the factory in the (hopefully) near future and this would be an excellent topic for discussion on improving the breed.

We're working hard at making sure that orders go out on time so we don't monitor the threads constantly. Besides that this is a very sophisticated bunch and you guys are doing a great job of answering your own questions. But if an issue arises that needs immediate public response please feel free to email us. We will be checking in about the motor fit issue and fix too.

Thanks

Wolf
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Old 02-18-2008, 09:23 PM   #650
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Wolf Hobbies View Post
Hi Guys:

Thanks for all the kind words!!!!! I've been out of it for a few days (bad reaction to pain pills... rotator cuff issue, not recreational...don't do drugs) and my wife wouldn't even let me turn the computer on for the last few days or until I looked better (could be a long wait with those constraints).

I admit that I came off a bit strong at first. Sorry. Some took it as (he's just trying to blow smoke so that we will buy his cars) but in all honesty it was just that I was actually enthusiastic about something new in R/C. We were out of R/C for almost 3 years and everything was still S.S. different day and then we got to see the new TM stuff and wow!!! This really is different and best of all it's making me look like I know how to drive. But I learned my lesson. From now on its just the facts and the actual owners can be enthusiastic for us. The TM snowball in the USA and Canada is growing (and we continue to support anyone in the world that doesn't have a local dealer and asks for help). We are averaging about one new dealer / day. A lot of them are tracks. What we all want is great attendance at all the events so that they are there when we want to play. The number pure hobby shops is also growing. Both of these are our #2 priority. Priority #1 is getting parts to current owners. I blew it on our last order (that flying impaired thing again) and forgot to order a few common items so we are cutting open kits to keep everyone running. The good news is that we placed another order and are springing for the airfreight and free shipping on back ordered items. If you ordered 4 or 6 of the 2 parts were short on then you will get 2 to get you going and a spare. If you ordered 1 you will not see a dreaded back order on your packing list. We are also getting a great response on our "Club Program". If you haven't heard it's pretty simple. If you belong to a club we will offer a discount on the order of three or more kits. If you order more than $250 in parts on 1 order then we knock off 25% off the top. There are some exceptions as there are things that we sell that we don't make that much on. One other important condition is that if you have a local dealer (one that normally stocks the type of items you are purchasing and that we supply)the order HAS to go through them. We are TOTALLY committed to making Team Magic owners the best supported group in R/C.

There is also another issue that needs to be brought up and that is the "Most brushless motors will fit" issue. It turns out that one popular type is not included in that list. We've received notice that TOP and Peak Racing motors are at issue. I have not seen one but hope to buy one so that I can see the issue myself. The reports from users (thank you for sharing that info by the way) is that the rear brace needs to be removed to get the motor in and then there is almost no room for pinion choices. There is a "Dremmel" work around and we hope that the photos will be forthcoming. Going to a smaller Spur is also an option. But rather than sweep this under a rug, what we were hoping is that E4 owners will send us feedback as to how big of a problem is this let's say 1 - 10. A "1" would be like no big deal I expect to do a little rework on a serious race machine to "10": This is awful I will never buy one of these again. Most importantly it is an opportunity for the Tech elite to shine and come up with a solution for those that need a little guidance. One thing I like about R/C is that when the buzzer goes off it's everyone for themselves but until that moment almost everyone in the pits is related and willing to help those that need it. If you feel that your input is a little harsh for public consumption feel free to send it to us directly ([email protected]) We might still suggest that you post but we do appreciate the opportunity to vet some of the "emotion". When we are done we'll forward the best and most constructive input to Team Magic. I am planning a personal visit to the factory in the (hopefully) near future and this would be an excellent topic for discussion on improving the breed.

We're working hard at making sure that orders go out on time so we don't monitor the threads constantly. Besides that this is a very sophisticated bunch and you guys are doing a great job of answering your own questions. But if an issue arises that needs immediate public response please feel free to email us. We will be checking in about the motor fit issue and fix too.

Thanks

Wolf
glad you are back Wolf, as far as the brushless motor issue is not bad at all ,a few minutes worth of dremel work and i can get gear ratios from the 13.5 speedpassion motor to the 2.5 speedpassion motor , i also run the Orion/peak motors with no issues. I do have to take the side brace to get the motor out,(about 3 minutes tops!) but its worth it , the car just handles great!!!. Ill try to get pictures up in a few. Got to get the car ready for the weekend
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Old 02-18-2008, 09:36 PM   #651
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I also got a variety of different spurs to get the gear ratios that i need with the limited amount of motor movement , so far i have no problems getting the gear ratios that i need.
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Old 02-18-2008, 09:59 PM   #652
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Enjoy it while you can. Some things only happen once.
or twice
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Old 02-18-2008, 10:03 PM   #653
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AdrianM View Post
Jesus Schreff, you are killing me. I could write a book about how nothing from F1 applies to r/c cars. F1 cars don't even have properly functioning suspension. They rely on their aero package for 90% of their grip.

Thats said...F1 cars totally support what I said before. If you were to weigh every component on your Type-R and calculate the relative position of each part as a percentage of weight fore and aft of the car's center point (the intersection of lines drawn diagonally from the center of the contact patch of each tire) then do the same for an F1 car you would find the weight on your cars is much more spread out along the lenght of your than on an F1 car. The engine and the driver are the two heavist parts in an F1 car and even if you look at the transmission, electronics, radiators, etc... nothing of any significant weight on an F1 car is more than 25% away from the center point of the chassis.

Next....

lets leave this for another thread
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Old 02-18-2008, 10:35 PM   #654
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Can anyone tell me do you have to shim the top deck(on the RS) to fit a core 5000 lipo in it?

Thanks
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Old 02-19-2008, 05:00 AM   #655
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Marcos,

I am so going to stomp a mudhole in you next race Man, i knew i shouldnt have raced TC until i got all the right gear. Its on now beotch.
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Old 02-19-2008, 05:11 AM   #656
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AdrianM View Post

Can a Type-R or E4 win races, sure...any car and win a race sooner or later. Are drivers of these cars startiung out with a disadvantage, yes...its simple physics.
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Old 02-19-2008, 06:08 AM   #657
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Last edited by John Tag; 02-19-2008 at 06:19 AM.
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Old 02-19-2008, 06:50 AM   #658
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Marcos,

I am so going to stomp a mudhole in you next race Man, i knew i shouldnt have raced TC until i got all the right gear. Its on now beotch.

i need to get bigger pinions too i ran out of gears myself
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Old 02-19-2008, 06:52 AM   #659
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Can anyone tell me do you have to shim the top deck(on the RS) to fit a core 5000 lipo in it?

Thanks
i can answer that very soon but non the regular E4 i only had to shim it about 2.5mm or so.
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Old 02-19-2008, 07:04 AM   #660
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Wow, no wonder winning feels so good, overcoming an inherent disadvantage and all.
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