R/C Tech Forums

Go Back   R/C Tech Forums > General Forums > Electric On-Road

    Hide Wikipost
Old 10-28-2016, 12:43 PM   -   Wikipost
R/C Tech Forums Thread Wiki: 1/12 forum
Please read: This is a community-maintained wiki post containing the most important information from this thread. You may edit the Wiki once you have been a member for 90 days and have made 90 posts.
 
Last edit by: fenton06
This is a place to share knowledge related to 1/12th scale racing. It is not to be used for conversations.

KITS:
Click links to go to manufacturer product page. If any are missing please add them!

TIRES:
Pre-mounted tires readily available in the US:
Pre-mounted tires readily available in the Europe:
  • Hot Race ??

Gluing your own donuts:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hm7z1rz-74s - Special thanks to Edward Pickering!
Truing tires:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8wqHOLWq6Uc - Special thanks to Edward Pickering!

The following information came from HERE, with some editing and information added. Thanks Christian!

THIS MAY NEED UPDATING FOR THE NEW BLACK CRC CARPET

Brands:
BSR, CRC, Jaco:
Pro One is no longer selling to the public, but it and the brands above are all mounted by BSR and use the same foam. The nomenclature of the BSR vs Jaco/CRC is a little different in a few instances but is otherwise the same. The BSR foam consists of three families, and can be identifed as synthetics, naturals, and blends.

Synthetics - The old school, light weight, easy to true "dry feeling" tires. These include tires like CRC/Jaco Yellow (BSR White), Black, Gray, etc. These tires offer the highest wear rate and lowest grip. Many racers continue to use these nder high bite conditions.

Naturals - These tires are usually the best alternative for low bite and asphalt. They include Pink, Magenta, Double Pink, Lilac (BSR Team Purple), Purple, and other tires. These tires provide a ton of grip, but tend to get sticky in high bite conditions. This rubber does not wear as easily, and the cars will pick up gunk and fibers from the carpet under most high bite conditions. This is especially bad if the humidity is high.

Blends - These are the tires most people run today. They were initially called "JFT foam" by some, as it was believed that the tires were the same as the JFT tires. We can divide the blends further into two groups: high rubber and low rubber content. The high rubber would be the new rear Orange and Red from the BSR family, and the low rubber would be the Green and Blue varieties. When, asked about the difference, John Foister from BSR Tires said they came from the same "family" of foam, but they offered different grip. According to John, the Green/Blue has more bite than Orange/Red, but from track testing Oranges offer more bite than Green (being equivalent to in hardness) when the grip is high and absolutely no grip when it is lower. The Orange foam has a denser pore structure and the tire is not as prone to chunking. It is also important to note is that BSR Blue rears are not the same as the BSR Blue fronts!

JFT:
JFT stands for Japan Foam Tire. They started the new wave of foam tires we are all using now (Blue/Blu, Green/Greene, Dbl Blue, etc). These tires are a little different than the BSR tire family, but work in very similar conditions. They offers four varieties A (asphalt), C (carpet), S (???), and R (???). This does not mean that those types only work on that surface, but this is what they recommend.

JFT uses the same foam for fronts and rears if the color is the same.

A: Used on asphalt, considered close to the natural rubber variety and are named consistently with other natural tires.
C: Used on carpet, considered a blend.
S: Used on carpet?, tires are ???
R: Used on carpet?, tires are ???

For setup, the JFT foam seem to generate more bite than the BSR, therefore the car tends to be a little more aggressive.

Ulti:
Ulti is another Japanese brand that offers an array of compounds. They have their own way of rating tires, and are difficult to equate to other brands. They have 4 different varieties, each in varying degrees of hardness.

J: High rubber content tire, similar to Pink/ Magenta. Soft would be close to a pink. These offer the most bite and are great for asphalt/carpet front tire. (J hard being very popular)
X: "Balanced" blend, similar to JFT Blue/ Green. Soft is equivalent to Green, medium to Blue in hardness. Great for carpet!
Y: High synthetic blend with lower grip, and is not a very popular variety.
Z: A very expensive "special" foam that is supposed to be magic on asphalt. Only make it in soft shore.
European tires:
There are many great European foam tire brands that use their own types of foam, as well as traditional foams. SOmeone with more knowledge about them will need to fill this in!

Tire Diameter:
If you are racing on carpet, you have to evaluate how much grip your track has. If your track is low to medium grip, you can run bigger tires. If you are on higher bite you have to cut them smaller, there is simply no way around it. Bigger tires are needed for asphalt, especially in the rear. The larger tires provide much needed lateral bite.

Carpet (mm):
Low - Medium Bite
Front: 42.0 - 42.5
Rear: 42.5 - 43.00
Medium - High Bite
Front: 40.5 - 41.0
Rear: 41.5 - 42.0
Big Race
Front: 39.5 - 40.0
Rear: 40.5 - 41.0
Asphalt (mm):
Parking Lot
Front: 43.0 - 44.0
Rear: 44.0 - 45.0
Prepped High Bite
Front: 42.0 - 43.0
Rear: 43.0 - 44.0

Tire Saucing:
Most facilities have moved towards odorless traction additives such as SXT. Some of additives evaporate very quickly and some do not. This seems to be something that is also dependent on tire compound and ambient temperature. For example, saucing a Green compound seems like it never dries, especially when tjhe temperature is lower. We have found that wiping the tires off 15 minutes before we go run allows the sauce to cure, which makes the car come in much quicker with Green rears. Blue compounds on the other hand, do fine when wiped off right before hitting the track.

Saucing half front and full rear is a good initial starting point. If the front of the car is too agressive you can sauce les than half, or for a shorter amount of time.
Tire Fuzzing:
In conditions of increasing grip, foam tires will somewtimes get sticky and pick up fuzz and debris from the track. This is highly dependent on the rubber sedan tire that is being run at your local track and the compound/ type of foam you are running on you car. The softer the sedan tire and the harder/higher rubber content in your foam tire, trouble with fuzzing seems more likely to occur.

There are ways to get around fuzzing under most conditions, and usually involves the selection of the correct foam compound. The more fuzz you get, the softer/lower rubber content you want to run.

Examples:
Problem: Car fuzzes with Lilac/Team Purple fronts and car starts pushing.
Solution: Use a softer front tire and or different family of foam. Replace it with Blue or Double Blue front.

Problem: Car loses rear bite 6 minutes into the run. Blue rear tires look almost clean but have small carpet hairs.
Solution: Use Green rear tires. The softer compound wears instead of getting sticky, minimizing fuzz.

Tire Selection:
Starting out, pick 2 tire compounds for the front and rear. The following should have you covered 99% of the time.

Front - Green and Blue (BSR) or Green and Light Blue (JFT)
Rear - Blue and Double Blue (BSR) or Blue and Dark Blue (JFT)

You may wonder about other compounds out there and if they might be better, trust me, they probably won't be. Even if there are other tires that can be as fast, the synthetic family wears out really fast and the high natural rubber will probably fuzz on you over an 8 minute run. The blends family seems to be the most versatile foam type available today. They last awhile, and sticking to them will make your process of tire selection simpler.
Tire Charts:
BSR/CRC/Jaco



Contact



Corally



JFT (Japan Foam Tire)



Ulti



Enneti (Xceed)



ELECTRONICS:
ESC:
As of now, ROAR is staying 1S (3.7V nominal; 4.2V fully charged) for 1/12. There are many 1S ESC's with a built in BEC so nothing else is required to power the receiver and servo.

If you don't want to lock yourself into a 1S specific ESC, you do have other options! It is possible to use your 2S ESC without a booster or receiver pack, and the ESC simply supplies the lower voltage. If that does not appeal to you, you will need to use an Rx pack or booster. The Rx pack and booster will both supply the receiver with a higher voltage than the 1S pack.

If you decide to use an Rx pack, MAKE SURE TO REMOVE THE RED WIRE FROM THE ESC PLUG THAT GOES INTO THE RECEIVER!!!

If you choose to use a voltage booster, it works exactly how it sounds. Instead of plugging the ESC into the receiver, it plugs into the booster, and the booster plug goes to the ESC, supplying the higher voltage.

1S ESC:
If there are any missing please add them!!

If anyone would like a need for a chart comparing the ESC's specs PM fenton06 and I'll get one made and put in here!
Voltage Boosters:
If there are any missing please add them!
Servos:
BODIES:
Black Art (CRC - US Dist):
  • Audi R8C - BA002 - .020 Thick



  • Black Market (Mohawk 12) - BA005 - .020



  • Lola B10 - BA006 - .020 thick
  • Toyota TS030 - BA008 - .020 thick

    Lola - black/red, TS030 - green/pink


PROTOForm:

Reflex Racing/RSD:

SUSPENSION ADJUSTMENTS:

Print Wikipost

Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Old 04-10-2002, 09:59 PM   #841
Tech Regular
 
vthondaboi's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2002
Location: Arlington, TX
Posts: 253
Send a message via AIM to vthondaboi Send a message via Yahoo to vthondaboi
Default advice on 1/12

Hey guys I'm just switching over from nitro to electric and wanted some opinions on 1/12 scale kits. So far I've had recommendations for the CRC Carpet Knife, Associated 12L3, and the Trinity Switchbalde. Parts isn't a real concern for me. Performance and durability is though. Also Would a Novak Atom be a good enough ESC for racing stock class or shoud I get something like the Cyclone. One last thing, mini servos. My friend recommended me get something in the $100 range so that it won't break and etc. Is it really that necessary on these electric cars? Like a $50 dollar servo for Nitro's were great but this $100 wow. Also any brand and model number recommendations for these mini servos.

Thanks a lot guys.
vthondaboi is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-11-2002, 07:27 AM   #842
Tech Fanatic
 
Join Date: Mar 2002
Location: Indianapolis, IN
Posts: 864
Default

vthondaboi
Your first question is in regards to the car. Don't pass on the Speedmerchant REV3. Past records show this car to be very fast on all surfaces and as reliable as any. I mean any driver can destroy any car. You will not be disappointed with the REV3.

Your second question is for the ESC. Don't rule out the LRP Quantum. It is the smallest and lightest. Perfect for a 1/12 scale car. Excellent performance as well. Adjustments are easy and they don't require an additional computing device to achieve.

Your third question is about a servo. Many of the pro drivers use the 94145 by Airtronics. It is the fastest in response of any of the small top level servos on the market.

Good luck


Dennis
I suggest you consider grey or white rear tires. I am assuming the platinum is on the rear of your car. The purple fronts are fine, but you can also try pink or magenta.

I run 29 to 31 pinions on a 100 tooth spur in 64 pitch. You can compare that to the 48 pitch gears you are using. Switching to 64 pitch is up to you. They are a little more efficient in the smaller cars. The type of stock motor is important here too. The GM3 and the MVP usually require a couple teeth smaller pinion.

The rest of the stuff you ask about is a personal preference type setup. A lot of it is driven by the track you race on. That means the type surface, the strength of the groove and so on. The thick t-bar is very popular because it provides quick response for track features that require quick changes in direction. Removing the center mounting screw to the motor pod will give you a softer feel from front to back, providing a little more rear traction. The spring and oil fit into that equation as well. It depends what the car needs. Work with 30 wt. oil and the green spring that comes with the shock. If the surface in very flat and very smooth, you might be able to use the chrome colored spring that is a little stiffer than the green.

On the front suspension, the 10 deg caster blocks are for drivers that want the car to continually tighten the turning radius as they roll around the corner. The 0 deg blocks are for a constant turning radius as the car rolls around the corner. It becomes driver preference again. And different track surfaces may require a different approach.

The bottom line is to practice and test a lot. Make these changes to get an idea of what they do for you. Once you are comfortable with all of those combinations, you can use them to your advantage when you travel to different locations to race. This is most of the fun of racing these cars, ie getting the car to fit the driver, the track and the natural conditions of the day.

Good luck and I hope I helped
davidl is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-11-2002, 04:29 PM   #843
Tech Apprentice
 
Join Date: Jan 2002
Location: so. st. paul, mn
Posts: 80
Default

darnold- hey man, sorry about your grandma. Dave S is my older brother, and will probably run stock for the Nats, as far as I know. I'll probably be around the track for the big race, but won't be racing. Even if I did have the cash to go I would only get one qualifyer since I have school on friday. But I'll do everything in my power to make my brother faster. Even if that does mean burning up my insanly fast p2k! I'll have to find you so I can see you get your win on with your bad self (sorry I had to say it). Well good luck to you and everyone else here, so I'm off to go get a job with my bad self!

Pete Simons
petenis is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-12-2002, 06:37 PM   #844
Tech Fanatic
 
Join Date: Mar 2002
Location: Indianapolis, IN
Posts: 864
Default

Something must be up. Darnold hasn't posted in 3 days. I have even posted 2 real big ones without him posting in between. Maybe he is doing his taxes.
davidl is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-12-2002, 08:37 PM   #845
Tech Champion
 
Kevin K's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2001
Location: In a land of mini-mighty mental giants
Posts: 8,754
Trader Rating: 32 (100%+)
Send a message via AIM to Kevin K Send a message via Yahoo to Kevin K
Default

Dave doesn't pay his taxes..... .....hes got to be out at the track getting ready to beat Josh and David at Cleveland next year.
__________________
2013 USVTA World Champion of the World
MOTIV RC presents the Midwest All-Star Carpet Series....14th year running 2016/17!!!
USVTA National Championship....check it out!!!
Im only responsible for what I say NOT what you understand.
Kevin K is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-12-2002, 11:00 PM   #846
Tech Fanatic
 
darnold's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: Bolingbrook, IL
Posts: 906
Trader Rating: 2 (100%+)
Default

Hey guys- Just got in from the office last night around 12midnight and spent the day with family. Tomorrow is the funeral for my grandma and I've been selected it seems as one of the pall bearers.

DL- I do agree with you DL that the Assoc. T-bar seems to be the right length for 12th scale cars as I remember when the first Revolvers came out that they had multiple length T-bars which alters both the wheel base and the flex point. Even though I was out of racing by this point James Arnold ran one for a while and he showed me his stuff at the time. The Trinity T-bars now are actually the same as an Assoc. but they seem to only range around .072-.074" for their thick whereas an Assoc. can range up to a .078" and they seem to be more readily available depending on where you are.

Kev- what's up dude, how are things going? Stop telling people my secrects! hehehehehe

Petenis- Look forward to seeing you next Thursday. I should make it up there around 4pm in time for the club race. If I can make it earlier that will be great but I'm not sure because I will be leaving from the office coming there.

VTH- I'm a very big fan of the Quantum Competition whether for 12th mod/stock or TC Mod/Stock. It is as durable as a Novak and I love the feel and adjustments on it. There is some debate concerning whether the engine management profiles actually are just different types of "minimum drive" equivalents like on the Novak or if they are actually changes in the drive frequency. In either case the LRP Quantum changes are VERY different in feel say from number 2 to number 4 with number 4 being Very Punchy and almost too much so for modified. I have had Excellent reliability but since it is only in 12th mod I am not pulling the same amps as a TC Mod would. It seems that as long as you use the heat sink from the worlds kit on it then it is fine for TC Mod but some question this. Novak's are great but like any other ESC they can and do have their problems. I have seen them go up in smoke just as Quantums have and I have experienced what many people last year commented on which is the "slow and dump" mode like a fet or two was going bad but the unit still operated. When I put a Quantum in I immediately noticed the differences in my motors and my 10turns whent faster than my 11's and my 9turns where ballastic. Both speedos along with some of the others are really good so you can't go wrong with either. The LRP's now come with a "Lifetime Warranty" so you may want to take that into consideration.

My 12th car of choice is obviously the Trinity Switchblade 02 although the 12l3, SpeedMerchant, 6pack, and others are all very competetive. I like the easy alterations to roll center, reactive caster and camber gain that the front end offers along with the very stiff construction. On high to very high bite tracks like Cleveland, Snowbirds, usually the Carpet Nats and other U.S. Triple crown series races this adjustability and stiffness really can help in the corner speed area while keeping the car easy to drive. But don't be fooled, these other cars can win to.
darnold is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-14-2002, 07:26 PM   #847
Tech Fanatic
 
darnold's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: Bolingbrook, IL
Posts: 906
Trader Rating: 2 (100%+)
Default

Hey everyone- look forward to hearing about your race day. Grandma had a great send off (funeral) and everyone here is recovering. Go to practice tomorrow and then will be at the Norrca Nats on Thursday. ('')
. Have fun and let's hear from people.
darnold is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-14-2002, 08:11 PM   #848
Tech Elite
 
Rick Vessell's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2002
Location: Mars
Posts: 2,239
Trader Rating: 8 (100%+)
Default

Attention K-Mart shoppers!

Hello everyone, I'm back on the air. Got meself moved and settled in to the new job. Now to just get out and do some racing. I unfortunately will not be able to attend the Norrca Nats. These guys I work for actually want me to work for a while before I take off to race, can you believe that! Oh well, I'll just have to come up to Venture and run with Darnold and Jucha. Dave, e-m me some directions. I'll be coming up 57 so give me directions from say Champaign or somewhere like that. You can send them to GreatSocko@netscape.net. Thanks!

That's all for now,
__________________
Futaba, O.S. Engines, Tornado Fuel, Schumacher Racing, SpeedPassion USA, Eggroll Inc., Desoto Racing, Vesselli Racing
Rick Vessell is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-15-2002, 01:05 AM   #849
Tech Fanatic
 
darnold's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: Bolingbrook, IL
Posts: 906
Trader Rating: 2 (100%+)
Default

Jonhnny Soko- Great to hear from you. You have mail. Too bad you can't make the Norrca Nats.
darnold is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-15-2002, 05:34 PM   #850
Tech Regular
 
Dragon Slayer's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2001
Location: tx
Posts: 358
Send a message via Yahoo to Dragon Slayer
Default

Hey all....no racing for me this weekend

Darnold......I'll be picking up a new car soon (1/12)....and wanted your opinion....I am looking at the Assoc. 12L3 vs. the new Trinity 2002......I'm running an older 12LW and really like it.....thanks for any opinions.

Socko.......welcome back......No 65 lapper.....you know...cause i wasnt there.....lolol
Dragon Slayer is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-16-2002, 01:17 AM   #851
Tech Fanatic
 
darnold's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: Bolingbrook, IL
Posts: 906
Trader Rating: 2 (100%+)
Default

Johnny Socko- Glad to hear it. As you know I'm a big fan of the Trinity 02. What do you think?
darnold is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-16-2002, 04:24 PM   #852
Tech Elite
 
Rick Vessell's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2002
Location: Mars
Posts: 2,239
Trader Rating: 8 (100%+)
Default

Well, I run an L3 and I like it. Very consistent and easy to drive. The Trinity car is good as well I just don't think with all the "lumberjacking" that Dragon does that the link front end is for him. No offense Dave, but I know you like a car that is lower maintenance so you can just go out and drive. You could also hit TR up for a Knife, you know that those work at your track.
__________________
Futaba, O.S. Engines, Tornado Fuel, Schumacher Racing, SpeedPassion USA, Eggroll Inc., Desoto Racing, Vesselli Racing
Rick Vessell is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-16-2002, 04:28 PM   #853
Tech Regular
 
Dragon Slayer's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2001
Location: tx
Posts: 358
Send a message via Yahoo to Dragon Slayer
Default

Socko....is that a "SLAM"...........ouch...lolol
Dragon Slayer is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-16-2002, 09:29 PM   #854
Tech Elite
 
Rick Vessell's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2002
Location: Mars
Posts: 2,239
Trader Rating: 8 (100%+)
Default

Nah, not a slam, you know there's no hate here! Just wouldn't want to see you get into a car that would frustrate you more than it would be fun.
__________________
Futaba, O.S. Engines, Tornado Fuel, Schumacher Racing, SpeedPassion USA, Eggroll Inc., Desoto Racing, Vesselli Racing
Rick Vessell is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-16-2002, 11:41 PM   #855
Tech Fanatic
 
darnold's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: Bolingbrook, IL
Posts: 906
Trader Rating: 2 (100%+)
Default

No slam taken. I do like a low maintenance car because there are a lot of other things to focus in on at big races but on the Trinity car I think that parameter comes more from it's solid graphite construction on the front end and its really stiff rear pod section.

The Trinity car does have a lot of steering and corner speed which I like but I don't think you can go wrong with much out there for 12th scale because they are all pretty good.
darnold is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
New to the forum mig rod Electric Off-Road 1 01-05-2008 05:23 PM
hi i need help and im new to the forum racer4 Rookie Zone 4 01-21-2007 02:37 PM
Why is this forum listed under the On Road Forum? sport10 Onroad Nitro Engine Zone 0 01-11-2007 08:06 AM
Forum Changes... futureal Wisconsin & Illinois Racing 3 10-28-2002 09:26 PM



Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 3 (2 members and 1 guests)
antlockyer, robk
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are Off



All times are GMT -7. It is currently 05:34 AM.


Powered By: vBulletin v3.9.2.1
Privacy Policy | Terms of Use | Advertise Content © 2001-2011 RCTech.net

SEO by vBSEO 3.5.0