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This is a place to share knowledge related to 1/12th scale racing. It is not to be used for conversations.

KITS:
Click links to go to manufacturer product page. If any are missing please add them!

TIRES:
Pre-mounted tires readily available in the US:
Pre-mounted tires readily available in the Europe:
  • Hot Race ??

Gluing your own donuts:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hm7z1rz-74s - Special thanks to Edward Pickering!
Truing tires:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8wqHOLWq6Uc - Special thanks to Edward Pickering!

The following information came from HERE, with some editing and information added. Thanks Christian!

THIS MAY NEED UPDATING FOR THE NEW BLACK CRC CARPET

Brands:
BSR, CRC, Jaco:
Pro One is no longer selling to the public, but it and the brands above are all mounted by BSR and use the same foam. The nomenclature of the BSR vs Jaco/CRC is a little different in a few instances but is otherwise the same. The BSR foam consists of three families, and can be identifed as synthetics, naturals, and blends.

Synthetics - The old school, light weight, easy to true "dry feeling" tires. These include tires like CRC/Jaco Yellow (BSR White), Black, Gray, etc. These tires offer the highest wear rate and lowest grip. Many racers continue to use these nder high bite conditions.

Naturals - These tires are usually the best alternative for low bite and asphalt. They include Pink, Magenta, Double Pink, Lilac (BSR Team Purple), Purple, and other tires. These tires provide a ton of grip, but tend to get sticky in high bite conditions. This rubber does not wear as easily, and the cars will pick up gunk and fibers from the carpet under most high bite conditions. This is especially bad if the humidity is high.

Blends - These are the tires most people run today. They were initially called "JFT foam" by some, as it was believed that the tires were the same as the JFT tires. We can divide the blends further into two groups: high rubber and low rubber content. The high rubber would be the new rear Orange and Red from the BSR family, and the low rubber would be the Green and Blue varieties. When, asked about the difference, John Foister from BSR Tires said they came from the same "family" of foam, but they offered different grip. According to John, the Green/Blue has more bite than Orange/Red, but from track testing Oranges offer more bite than Green (being equivalent to in hardness) when the grip is high and absolutely no grip when it is lower. The Orange foam has a denser pore structure and the tire is not as prone to chunking. It is also important to note is that BSR Blue rears are not the same as the BSR Blue fronts!

JFT:
JFT stands for Japan Foam Tire. They started the new wave of foam tires we are all using now (Blue/Blu, Green/Greene, Dbl Blue, etc). These tires are a little different than the BSR tire family, but work in very similar conditions. They offers four varieties A (asphalt), C (carpet), S (???), and R (???). This does not mean that those types only work on that surface, but this is what they recommend.

JFT uses the same foam for fronts and rears if the color is the same.

A: Used on asphalt, considered close to the natural rubber variety and are named consistently with other natural tires.
C: Used on carpet, considered a blend.
S: Used on carpet?, tires are ???
R: Used on carpet?, tires are ???

For setup, the JFT foam seem to generate more bite than the BSR, therefore the car tends to be a little more aggressive.

Ulti:
Ulti is another Japanese brand that offers an array of compounds. They have their own way of rating tires, and are difficult to equate to other brands. They have 4 different varieties, each in varying degrees of hardness.

J: High rubber content tire, similar to Pink/ Magenta. Soft would be close to a pink. These offer the most bite and are great for asphalt/carpet front tire. (J hard being very popular)
X: "Balanced" blend, similar to JFT Blue/ Green. Soft is equivalent to Green, medium to Blue in hardness. Great for carpet!
Y: High synthetic blend with lower grip, and is not a very popular variety.
Z: A very expensive "special" foam that is supposed to be magic on asphalt. Only make it in soft shore.
European tires:
There are many great European foam tire brands that use their own types of foam, as well as traditional foams. SOmeone with more knowledge about them will need to fill this in!

Tire Diameter:
If you are racing on carpet, you have to evaluate how much grip your track has. If your track is low to medium grip, you can run bigger tires. If you are on higher bite you have to cut them smaller, there is simply no way around it. Bigger tires are needed for asphalt, especially in the rear. The larger tires provide much needed lateral bite.

Carpet (mm):
Low - Medium Bite
Front: 42.0 - 42.5
Rear: 42.5 - 43.00
Medium - High Bite
Front: 40.5 - 41.0
Rear: 41.5 - 42.0
Big Race
Front: 39.5 - 40.0
Rear: 40.5 - 41.0
Asphalt (mm):
Parking Lot
Front: 43.0 - 44.0
Rear: 44.0 - 45.0
Prepped High Bite
Front: 42.0 - 43.0
Rear: 43.0 - 44.0

Tire Saucing:
Most facilities have moved towards odorless traction additives such as SXT. Some of additives evaporate very quickly and some do not. This seems to be something that is also dependent on tire compound and ambient temperature. For example, saucing a Green compound seems like it never dries, especially when tjhe temperature is lower. We have found that wiping the tires off 15 minutes before we go run allows the sauce to cure, which makes the car come in much quicker with Green rears. Blue compounds on the other hand, do fine when wiped off right before hitting the track.

Saucing half front and full rear is a good initial starting point. If the front of the car is too agressive you can sauce les than half, or for a shorter amount of time.
Tire Fuzzing:
In conditions of increasing grip, foam tires will somewtimes get sticky and pick up fuzz and debris from the track. This is highly dependent on the rubber sedan tire that is being run at your local track and the compound/ type of foam you are running on you car. The softer the sedan tire and the harder/higher rubber content in your foam tire, trouble with fuzzing seems more likely to occur.

There are ways to get around fuzzing under most conditions, and usually involves the selection of the correct foam compound. The more fuzz you get, the softer/lower rubber content you want to run.

Examples:
Problem: Car fuzzes with Lilac/Team Purple fronts and car starts pushing.
Solution: Use a softer front tire and or different family of foam. Replace it with Blue or Double Blue front.

Problem: Car loses rear bite 6 minutes into the run. Blue rear tires look almost clean but have small carpet hairs.
Solution: Use Green rear tires. The softer compound wears instead of getting sticky, minimizing fuzz.

Tire Selection:
Starting out, pick 2 tire compounds for the front and rear. The following should have you covered 99% of the time.

Front - Green and Blue (BSR) or Green and Light Blue (JFT)
Rear - Blue and Double Blue (BSR) or Blue and Dark Blue (JFT)

You may wonder about other compounds out there and if they might be better, trust me, they probably won't be. Even if there are other tires that can be as fast, the synthetic family wears out really fast and the high natural rubber will probably fuzz on you over an 8 minute run. The blends family seems to be the most versatile foam type available today. They last awhile, and sticking to them will make your process of tire selection simpler.
Tire Charts:
BSR/CRC/Jaco



Contact



Corally



JFT (Japan Foam Tire)



Ulti



Enneti (Xceed)



ELECTRONICS:
ESC:
As of now, ROAR is staying 1S (3.7V nominal; 4.2V fully charged) for 1/12. There are many 1S ESC's with a built in BEC so nothing else is required to power the receiver and servo.

If you don't want to lock yourself into a 1S specific ESC, you do have other options! It is possible to use your 2S ESC without a booster or receiver pack, and the ESC simply supplies the lower voltage. If that does not appeal to you, you will need to use an Rx pack or booster. The Rx pack and booster will both supply the receiver with a higher voltage than the 1S pack.

If you decide to use an Rx pack, MAKE SURE TO REMOVE THE RED WIRE FROM THE ESC PLUG THAT GOES INTO THE RECEIVER!!!

If you choose to use a voltage booster, it works exactly how it sounds. Instead of plugging the ESC into the receiver, it plugs into the booster, and the booster plug goes to the ESC, supplying the higher voltage.

1S ESC:
If there are any missing please add them!!

If anyone would like a need for a chart comparing the ESC's specs PM fenton06 and I'll get one made and put in here!
Voltage Boosters:
If there are any missing please add them!
Servos:
BODIES:
Black Art (CRC - US Dist):
  • Audi R8C - BA002 - .020 Thick



  • Black Market (Mohawk 12) - BA005 - .020



  • Lola B10 - BA006 - .020 thick
  • Toyota TS030 - BA008 - .020 thick

    Lola - black/red, TS030 - green/pink


PROTOForm:

Reflex Racing/RSD:

SUSPENSION ADJUSTMENTS:

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Old 09-21-2003, 08:37 PM   #4036
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A couple people have asked for another picture of the Quad12 or one from another angle. This picture better shows the Cell Retention System that eliminates the need for tape or o-rings to hold the batteries in place.

D.P.
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Old 09-22-2003, 01:44 AM   #4037
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Hello, Does somebody know were i can get a Yokomo Worlds car cheepest?? I am going to put a IRS chassi on it thou... but thinks its cheeper to get a kit to get all the outher stuff... Is IRS going to release a complete kit?? The new front end looks great hope he will release it soon.
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Old 09-22-2003, 07:27 AM   #4038
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I think we sould wait for the new CRC parts......
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Old 09-22-2003, 08:33 AM   #4039
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Quote:
Originally posted by Ec1
Hello, Does somebody know were i can get a Yokomo Worlds car cheepest?? I am going to put a IRS chassi on it thou... but thinks its cheeper to get a kit to get all the outher stuff... Is IRS going to release a complete kit?? The new front end looks great hope he will release it soon.
If I were you, I'd buy a 12L3 and order some lowered pod plates from IRS when I ordered the conversion. The Yokomo is outrageously overpriced. You can get a 12L kit for around $140 and the pod plates are are around $40, the cheapest I've seen the Yok was around $220.
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Old 09-22-2003, 08:37 AM   #4040
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Mike D: I over looked the roll center post you made earlier. To be honest with you, I've never run the lowered roll center because I've never seen the need to alter the rear-end geometry. I am going to try it in the coming weeks because I wanna learn a little more.
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Old 09-22-2003, 09:22 AM   #4041
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Cypress:

could you post your detailed set up for the Rev 3 please

thanks

Casey
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Old 09-22-2003, 09:26 AM   #4042
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Give me a few minutes and I'll slap it up casey.
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Old 09-22-2003, 09:41 AM   #4043
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Casey - I can address your problem with the center shock and spring. You can't run the black spring on all surfaces. The old carpet we had at Mimi's had so many ripples that it was a bad choice. I back off from the black spring to the Associated copper colored spring or the red spring and move to 50 to 60 weight oil in the shock. This is to get the rear of the car to go over the ripples without making the car skitterish, as you said. Once you have that covered, you can then move to the side springs/dampers and the front suspension to get the car to perform as you need.
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Old 09-22-2003, 09:51 AM   #4044
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Okay,

Front End: OLD SKOOL

2-4 degrees caster (depends on how fast the track is, lots of big fast sweeping turns=lots of caster). .020 springs, camber set so front tires wear flat (this will vary from suspension arm to suspension arm). Servo mounted flat on the chassis, ball studs spaced forward 1/8" to increase Ackerman. Toe set at 0.
Tires will depend on the particular track, generally purple, occasionally double pink if I really need steering.

Battery position: rear

Rear-end: Blue Springs, (Oranges if bite is low), Black center spring, (CRC copper if track is bumpy), 80 wt oil in the shock (60 wt. if using the copper on a bumpy track) Medium Hydradrive fluid in the damper tubes (light hydra if the track has alot of switchbacks). On HIGH-bite tracks I also run a CRC 1/10th shock mount which gives the shock a little more progression throughout
it's range of travel by lowering the front mounting point. This seems to really help get the car off the corner, without sacrificing any rear-end stability.

This set-up is VERY AGGRESSIVE, just wanted to warn you in advance. If it's too much, try going to an .022 front spring that'll smooth it out slightly.
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Old 09-22-2003, 09:52 AM   #4045
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What's up DL?
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Old 09-22-2003, 09:56 AM   #4046
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Quote:
Originally posted by CypressMidWest
...This set-up is VERY AGGRESSIVE, just wanted to warn you in advance....
That setup should match Casey's driving style very well.
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Old 09-22-2003, 10:11 AM   #4047
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MikeD - I ran the REV2 a lot with the lowered roll center at Mimi's when I first got the car. That old carpet had a lot of issues that made me go that way. I never liked the traction level that was available on that carpet. In retro-spect, the best thing I could have done was change tires. I should have run what we now know as double pink on the front and white rear. That is even in stock.

I had gray rear tires, and that wasn't enough traction for the modified motors we ran that year, even with the low roll center. I also had radio glitches, but that is another story. I understand the carpet that Mimi now has and here is what I think is the way to look at it.

You can use the copper spring and 60 weight oil in the shock if you use white rears. That is what I did at the Orion race. I also used the blue side spring with no pre-load. That supported the need for rear traction that resulted in forward bite. It helped acceleration a lot. Medium Losi Hydradrive fluid in the damper tubes was adequate, and all of this was with the high roll center combination offered by Speedmerchant.

The next part was to get the front to respond. I started with the V-force suspension, but changed to the IRS version of the dynamic strut. That way I could get some reactive caster to handle that little esses on the right side of the track. The 10 degree reactive caster setup was the best. I stayed with .020 front suspension springs. Purple front tires where adequate. And you might have noticed looking at the lap times in the main that I was within .1 seconds of you for the first 5 laps.

So now to your questions. The roll center is very important, but takes different approaches based on the one you select. The Speedmerchant system applies a standoff type shim under the pivot ball to set the roll center. The higher version is .050 inches higher than the the lower version. But these pivot balls are different than the ones you use on your RugRat. There isn't any flange, so they are at different heights from the top of the chassis, all of them higher than the ones you use.

I have not taken the approach of using the low roll center for low "weekly racing traction" versus the higher, "big race traction." My approach is as I described to Casey in the previous post. The guys that ran the ROAR Carpet Nats used the low roll center and it was high traction. I haven't done that, but will be testing it this year. I think the biggest thing is tire selection, but I am not concinced, yet, that the low roll center will allow you to run grey, when you must run white with the high roll center.

I can get the low roll center to run well through a combination of sweep turns and 180's. It can change your setup from the high roll center, but it is just using the same approach to the problem that I have discussed above.

I hope all that answers the gist of your questions. Sorry, I was so wordy by adding examples that should relate to you.
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Old 09-22-2003, 10:17 AM   #4048
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Aggressive + too aggressive = OUCH!
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Old 09-22-2003, 10:18 AM   #4049
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CMW - how did your trip go Sunday?
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Old 09-22-2003, 10:29 AM   #4050
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davidl - Thanks for the info
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