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This is a place to share knowledge related to 1/12th scale racing. It is not to be used for conversations.

KITS:
Click links to go to manufacturer product page. If any are missing please add them!

TIRES:
Pre-mounted tires readily available in the US:
Pre-mounted tires readily available in the Europe:
  • Hot Race ??

Gluing your own donuts:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hm7z1rz-74s - Special thanks to Edward Pickering!
Truing tires:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8wqHOLWq6Uc - Special thanks to Edward Pickering!

The following information came from HERE, with some editing and information added. Thanks Christian!

THIS MAY NEED UPDATING FOR THE NEW BLACK CRC CARPET

Brands:
BSR, CRC, Jaco:
Pro One is no longer selling to the public, but it and the brands above are all mounted by BSR and use the same foam. The nomenclature of the BSR vs Jaco/CRC is a little different in a few instances but is otherwise the same. The BSR foam consists of three families, and can be identifed as synthetics, naturals, and blends.

Synthetics - The old school, light weight, easy to true "dry feeling" tires. These include tires like CRC/Jaco Yellow (BSR White), Black, Gray, etc. These tires offer the highest wear rate and lowest grip. Many racers continue to use these nder high bite conditions.

Naturals - These tires are usually the best alternative for low bite and asphalt. They include Pink, Magenta, Double Pink, Lilac (BSR Team Purple), Purple, and other tires. These tires provide a ton of grip, but tend to get sticky in high bite conditions. This rubber does not wear as easily, and the cars will pick up gunk and fibers from the carpet under most high bite conditions. This is especially bad if the humidity is high.

Blends - These are the tires most people run today. They were initially called "JFT foam" by some, as it was believed that the tires were the same as the JFT tires. We can divide the blends further into two groups: high rubber and low rubber content. The high rubber would be the new rear Orange and Red from the BSR family, and the low rubber would be the Green and Blue varieties. When, asked about the difference, John Foister from BSR Tires said they came from the same "family" of foam, but they offered different grip. According to John, the Green/Blue has more bite than Orange/Red, but from track testing Oranges offer more bite than Green (being equivalent to in hardness) when the grip is high and absolutely no grip when it is lower. The Orange foam has a denser pore structure and the tire is not as prone to chunking. It is also important to note is that BSR Blue rears are not the same as the BSR Blue fronts!

JFT:
JFT stands for Japan Foam Tire. They started the new wave of foam tires we are all using now (Blue/Blu, Green/Greene, Dbl Blue, etc). These tires are a little different than the BSR tire family, but work in very similar conditions. They offers four varieties A (asphalt), C (carpet), S (???), and R (???). This does not mean that those types only work on that surface, but this is what they recommend.

JFT uses the same foam for fronts and rears if the color is the same.

A: Used on asphalt, considered close to the natural rubber variety and are named consistently with other natural tires.
C: Used on carpet, considered a blend.
S: Used on carpet?, tires are ???
R: Used on carpet?, tires are ???

For setup, the JFT foam seem to generate more bite than the BSR, therefore the car tends to be a little more aggressive.

Ulti:
Ulti is another Japanese brand that offers an array of compounds. They have their own way of rating tires, and are difficult to equate to other brands. They have 4 different varieties, each in varying degrees of hardness.

J: High rubber content tire, similar to Pink/ Magenta. Soft would be close to a pink. These offer the most bite and are great for asphalt/carpet front tire. (J hard being very popular)
X: "Balanced" blend, similar to JFT Blue/ Green. Soft is equivalent to Green, medium to Blue in hardness. Great for carpet!
Y: High synthetic blend with lower grip, and is not a very popular variety.
Z: A very expensive "special" foam that is supposed to be magic on asphalt. Only make it in soft shore.
European tires:
There are many great European foam tire brands that use their own types of foam, as well as traditional foams. SOmeone with more knowledge about them will need to fill this in!

Tire Diameter:
If you are racing on carpet, you have to evaluate how much grip your track has. If your track is low to medium grip, you can run bigger tires. If you are on higher bite you have to cut them smaller, there is simply no way around it. Bigger tires are needed for asphalt, especially in the rear. The larger tires provide much needed lateral bite.

Carpet (mm):
Low - Medium Bite
Front: 42.0 - 42.5
Rear: 42.5 - 43.00
Medium - High Bite
Front: 40.5 - 41.0
Rear: 41.5 - 42.0
Big Race
Front: 39.5 - 40.0
Rear: 40.5 - 41.0
Asphalt (mm):
Parking Lot
Front: 43.0 - 44.0
Rear: 44.0 - 45.0
Prepped High Bite
Front: 42.0 - 43.0
Rear: 43.0 - 44.0

Tire Saucing:
Most facilities have moved towards odorless traction additives such as SXT. Some of additives evaporate very quickly and some do not. This seems to be something that is also dependent on tire compound and ambient temperature. For example, saucing a Green compound seems like it never dries, especially when tjhe temperature is lower. We have found that wiping the tires off 15 minutes before we go run allows the sauce to cure, which makes the car come in much quicker with Green rears. Blue compounds on the other hand, do fine when wiped off right before hitting the track.

Saucing half front and full rear is a good initial starting point. If the front of the car is too agressive you can sauce les than half, or for a shorter amount of time.
Tire Fuzzing:
In conditions of increasing grip, foam tires will somewtimes get sticky and pick up fuzz and debris from the track. This is highly dependent on the rubber sedan tire that is being run at your local track and the compound/ type of foam you are running on you car. The softer the sedan tire and the harder/higher rubber content in your foam tire, trouble with fuzzing seems more likely to occur.

There are ways to get around fuzzing under most conditions, and usually involves the selection of the correct foam compound. The more fuzz you get, the softer/lower rubber content you want to run.

Examples:
Problem: Car fuzzes with Lilac/Team Purple fronts and car starts pushing.
Solution: Use a softer front tire and or different family of foam. Replace it with Blue or Double Blue front.

Problem: Car loses rear bite 6 minutes into the run. Blue rear tires look almost clean but have small carpet hairs.
Solution: Use Green rear tires. The softer compound wears instead of getting sticky, minimizing fuzz.

Tire Selection:
Starting out, pick 2 tire compounds for the front and rear. The following should have you covered 99% of the time.

Front - Green and Blue (BSR) or Green and Light Blue (JFT)
Rear - Blue and Double Blue (BSR) or Blue and Dark Blue (JFT)

You may wonder about other compounds out there and if they might be better, trust me, they probably won't be. Even if there are other tires that can be as fast, the synthetic family wears out really fast and the high natural rubber will probably fuzz on you over an 8 minute run. The blends family seems to be the most versatile foam type available today. They last awhile, and sticking to them will make your process of tire selection simpler.
Tire Charts:
BSR/CRC/Jaco



Contact



Corally



JFT (Japan Foam Tire)



Ulti



Enneti (Xceed)



ELECTRONICS:
ESC:
As of now, ROAR is staying 1S (3.7V nominal; 4.2V fully charged) for 1/12. There are many 1S ESC's with a built in BEC so nothing else is required to power the receiver and servo.

If you don't want to lock yourself into a 1S specific ESC, you do have other options! It is possible to use your 2S ESC without a booster or receiver pack, and the ESC simply supplies the lower voltage. If that does not appeal to you, you will need to use an Rx pack or booster. The Rx pack and booster will both supply the receiver with a higher voltage than the 1S pack.

If you decide to use an Rx pack, MAKE SURE TO REMOVE THE RED WIRE FROM THE ESC PLUG THAT GOES INTO THE RECEIVER!!!

If you choose to use a voltage booster, it works exactly how it sounds. Instead of plugging the ESC into the receiver, it plugs into the booster, and the booster plug goes to the ESC, supplying the higher voltage.

1S ESC:
If there are any missing please add them!!

If anyone would like a need for a chart comparing the ESC's specs PM fenton06 and I'll get one made and put in here!
Voltage Boosters:
If there are any missing please add them!
Servos:
BODIES:
Black Art (CRC - US Dist):
  • Audi R8C - BA002 - .020 Thick



  • Black Market (Mohawk 12) - BA005 - .020



  • Lola B10 - BA006 - .020 thick
  • Toyota TS030 - BA008 - .020 thick

    Lola - black/red, TS030 - green/pink


PROTOForm:

Reflex Racing/RSD:

SUSPENSION ADJUSTMENTS:

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Old 11-27-2006, 11:27 AM   #22051
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I believe 2nd in 19-T was a Darkside which is a link car. IIR, he was about a half-second behind.

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Old 11-27-2006, 11:35 AM   #22052
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Quote:
Originally Posted by fast-ho-cars
what type car did the winner use in mod? masters?

are the final results posted anywhere?

as for discussion...there was alot of talk about the track last year favoring link cars (bumps, etc.) and from the talk/posts in the 2006 Indoor Champ Thead, it appeared that the track was sub-par.....? i am now surprized to see your post....i thought the links would rule again.

anyone know out of the 40 cars used in the 4 different class a-mains what the car type/brand choice breakdown was? Tires? Motors? Batterys?
Baker and Easton in Mod with Rev 4.5s. Dumas would have won if his car hadn't failed at 7:30 and it would have been 1-2-3. Cyrul 3rd.

On the track condition I read that it was very bumpy at first but they worked on it and it got lots better, then later it got bumpy again. Just heresay, of course.
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Old 11-27-2006, 12:15 PM   #22053
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JayBee
I have a couple of pics for you gurus out there of my electronics layout on a car I ran at a big 2-day'r a weekend ago. The car was good but I couldn't overcome the glitchin' problems all weekend (I did try a few things to remedy this). The car is fine with a fresh pack but about 5-6min into the run, I would gun the throttle and nothing; a sec later the car would take off. As long as I was on throttle somewhat the car 'seemed' okay but trying to go full-off to full-on was a no-no. The car was freshly built for this race series w/ new electronics so maybe you guys can point out something I'm not seeing. I'm almost at the point of taking everything out and replacing with fresh gear
I just noticed this problem the other day...i was practicing and as soon as my voltage went down, the car went all wonky...

I'm running a g11pro and never seen this before either...
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Old 11-27-2006, 12:33 PM   #22054
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Hi guys,
Maybe you can help me out a bit.
This weekend i was racing my 12L4 for the first time this season, on carpet.

Everything was fine except getting consistent traction trough whole 8 minutes.
At beginning i used pink rear/double pink front - first 5 minutes rear traction and steering was ok, but after that i got massive understeer.

Then i changed to purple front - with this i had way too much steering, it was very hard to drive without mistakes.

I used LRP carpet additive, full rear and 1-2/3 front

Setup is quite standard - Olive center spring, 30wt oil, trinity red stuff on damper disc, 0.18 front springs, 1.5 camber, 10 upper arm mounts, 0.63 t bar, 1mm shim under front T bar ball, mod motor.

I hope you can help me out with this,
As i mostly drive touring, im bit confused with those trillion foam tire compounds
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Old 11-27-2006, 12:39 PM   #22055
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@ Mark Payne:
I read on your excellent 12th scale Blog you now run brushless. How did you compensate the unbalance in the rear pod caused by the brushless motor?
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Old 11-27-2006, 03:48 PM   #22056
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Arh... good question. The answer is that I dont.

Actually to try is counter productive I think. I made the mistake (also on a 3.2R) of tring to balance out the error in the rear pod by compensating with weight distribution in the "main" part of the chassis.

Dont do that, balance the main part of the chassis in issolation to the rear. Forget about the rear pod inbalance and dont try to correct it in the front.

I have a full discussion of this subject here http://www.rcracechat.com/vb/showthread.php?t=23696

Some of my UK friends are of the opinion that I think about this stuff too much ;-) For background in the argument in the thread above, "PDW" (Pete Winton) is a very intelligent, articulate and experienced 1/12th racer who in my opionion has it wrong on this subject, however, he is not often wrong. On the other hand "Viking" is Mick Farrell who makes me look average in the racing dept!

Mick is from the "chuck it in and race it" school. That is what he says but when you look closely at his car, he is doing all the stuff I try to think about and document, partly by (years of) experience and partly by instinct.

Hope this helps sir!

Been there, done that, bought the wrong teeshirt!

Mark

Quote:
Originally Posted by Pro ten Holland
@ Mark Payne:
I read on your excellent 12th scale Blog you now run brushless. How did you compensate the unbalance in the rear pod caused by the brushless motor?
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Old 11-27-2006, 04:08 PM   #22057
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NashRacer,,, any chance you got pics of Josh's and Drew's CEFX car's????
Thanks


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Old 11-27-2006, 05:58 PM   #22058
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JayBee
I have a couple of pics for you gurus out there of my electronics layout on a car I ran at a big 2-day'r a weekend ago. The car was good but I couldn't overcome the glitchin' problems all weekend (I did try a few things to remedy this). The car is fine with a fresh pack but about 5-6min into the run, I would gun the throttle and nothing; a sec later the car would take off. As long as I was on throttle somewhat the car 'seemed' okay but trying to go full-off to full-on was a no-no. The car was freshly built for this race series w/ new electronics so maybe you guys can point out something I'm not seeing. I'm almost at the point of taking everything out and replacing with fresh gear
try another seedo,i trow that ting out
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Old 11-27-2006, 06:55 PM   #22059
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Quote:
Originally Posted by odpurple
Mr B
I'm sure, from our conversation, that you are experiencing a voltage drop upon acceleration. Why this is I am not sure. Maybe someone on the thread has seen this before and can help. I would try a different reciever and/or esc to see if one or the other is out of spec. I've built maybe fifteen cars with Spektum without this problem, so I don't think its endemic.
Voltage drop is exactly the reason why the Spektrums need a capacitor in 4 cell racing. Given that he is running the internal and external capacitors that should be more then enough to compensate for when the BEC runs low.
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Old 11-27-2006, 10:36 PM   #22060
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mark Payne
Arh... good question. The answer is that I dont.

Actually to try is counter productive I think. I made the mistake (also on a 3.2R) of tring to balance out the error in the rear pod by compensating with weight distribution in the "main" part of the chassis.

Dont do that, balance the main part of the chassis in issolation to the rear. Forget about the rear pod inbalance and dont try to correct it in the front.

I have a full discussion of this subject here http://www.rcracechat.com/vb/showthread.php?t=23696

Some of my UK friends are of the opinion that I think about this stuff too much ;-) For background in the argument in the thread above, "PDW" (Pete Winton) is a very intelligent, articulate and experienced 1/12th racer who in my opionion has it wrong on this subject, however, he is not often wrong. On the other hand "Viking" is Mick Farrell who makes me look average in the racing dept!

Mick is from the "chuck it in and race it" school. That is what he says but when you look closely at his car, he is doing all the stuff I try to think about and document, partly by (years of) experience and partly by instinct.

Hope this helps sir!

Been there, done that, bought the wrong teeshirt!

Mark
Thanks for the reply and link!

I tried balancing the rear pod of my 10th scale pancar by adding lead weight. It seemed to work, but when I removed the lead weights, I couldn't really notice any difference. It should be more noticeable on a 12th scale car, but apparantly not!
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Old 11-27-2006, 10:44 PM   #22061
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr. Shookie
Hey Jay......

I had the same issue runnig four cells with my KO VFS.
I had to go into the program and set the voltage differently to allow for the lower voltage of the 4 cells. Not sure if that makes much since but since I put in a receiver pack in I haven't had a problem.
I got a sweet ultra light lipo receiver pack but roar hasn't made up their minds about that yet...Still holding my breath..LOL

Hope your killa em Jay....
-Shookie <><
What up Shook, thanx for the intel; I'm gonna have to look into that

Quote:
Originally Posted by Thraex
About the voltage drop OD spoke about.
Maybe you could try a capacitor on the esc to smooth out the voltage ripple.
The capacitor should be a 'High frequency Low impedance' version with a working voltage greater than 10v and a capacitance of about 2200uF.
You can buy it at your local electronics store.
In case you don't know how to connect it, the leg nearest the grey stripe is the cathode and should be soldered to the - from the battery, the other leg should be soldered to the + from the battery.
I have no experience with Keyence esc's so I don't know if it works, but it should work with every esc. And it's worth to try since they are so cheap.
Thanx Thraex, I'll try that too
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Old 11-27-2006, 10:55 PM   #22062
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Quote:
Originally Posted by InspGadgt
Voltage drop is exactly the reason why the Spektrums need a capacitor in 4 cell racing. Given that he is running the internal and external capacitors that should be more then enough to compensate for when the BEC runs low.
I wouldn't say that the Spektum system needes a cap for four cell. I've heard of isolated instances where the cap solved a problem, but I've never used one on any car I've built, both with the SR3000 and the SR3500. I don't know anyone who runs one, for that matter.
Jay Bee's problem is still there with a cap anyway, so he's got a problem with something in the system.

Mr B
plug a reciever pack into that car and run it, see what happens.
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Old 11-27-2006, 11:06 PM   #22063
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Quote:
Originally Posted by odpurple
I wouldn't say that the Spektum system needes a cap for four cell. I've heard of isolated instances where the cap solved a problem, but I've never used one on any car I've built, both with the SR3000 and the SR3500. I don't know anyone who runs one, for that matter.
Jay Bee's problem is still there with a cap anyway, so he's got a problem with something in the system.

Mr B
plug a reciever pack into that car and run it, see what happens.
Will do... have any suggestions on 1 in particular?
Like I mentioned earlier, I've ran 5-6 SR3000's & 5-6 SR3500's with no problems before so this is weird so I do think the problem is in the system. AdrianM is on speed dial so I'll hit 'em up tomorrow
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Old 11-27-2006, 11:34 PM   #22064
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JB, I emailed Anderson at Horizon about your question. Let's see if we can find a sollution for you. He's super sharp with the Skeptrum equipment. A rx pack is a certian cure, but it would be nice to know if you could run without it and the extra effort that goes along with a rx pack.

I am running LRP with my Spektrum mini pro rx. I can honestly say that I have only knowly taken one glitch since installing that rx in the past 6 weeks. My KO rx was also very reliable. But come on.... no more crystals or pulling out that really tall 3 foot antenna. Life is good.
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Old 11-27-2006, 11:39 PM   #22065
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Brian,

Scottrik says your old and slow, what's the deal with that?
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