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R/C Tech Forums Thread Wiki: TLR 22 3.0 Race Kit Thread!
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Cub86 posted the question: Hi. I'm struggling to understand the lay down situation. I run on high bite damp smooth clay and think the conversation would help on my surface but from what I'm reading I need to buy the lay down kit tlr338004. And the dirt gear case tlr332063. But do I really need both from what I've read the dirt case is 1-2mm higher anyway and u don't use the +3mm hubs or the front pivot hrc or Hrc mod. So is the dirt lay down kit tlr332063 is all that's needed to get me a lay down set up that's suited for clay With the components and car I already have. And if I only get the dirt case is there any problems that will need to be addressed IE.. bone plunge . I do know I'll need 1mm spacers on the waterfall to clear the battery. Thanks guys really trying to get my head around this.

Franks response:
Laydown Conversion will work great by itself. You run the aluminum +3mm hubs, the diff is +3.5mm, and you run the HRC front setup. Just follow a setup sheet from tlracing.com (Frank Root).

Dirt Tranny has the diff at the same height as the standard tranny case, and works with the standard plastic hubs. Both are +/- 0mm from stock. When you run this, no need to run the HRC front mod either.

I've found the stock laydown conversion parts to work great for most tracks. The dirt tranny is a great tuning option, but definitely not 'required'.

K.King
Something I made, pretty basic. Just to give people an idea.

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Old 05-16-2016, 12:30 PM   #2851
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Arrow pointing up=higher roll center=more chassis roll.
Arrow pointing down= lower roll center=less chassis roll.

Is this correct Frank?
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Old 05-16-2016, 12:33 PM   #2852
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Arrow pointing up=higher roll center=more chassis roll.
Arrow pointing down= lower roll center=less chassis roll.

Is this correct Frank?
I assume you are talking about the anti-squat pills? They always point up.
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Old 05-16-2016, 12:35 PM   #2853
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I assume you are talking about the anti-squat pills? They always point up.
I was talking about the plastic insert in the rear inner ball stud mount.
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Old 05-16-2016, 12:40 PM   #2854
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I was talking about the plastic insert in the rear inner ball stud mount.
The camber gain is more important on most tracks than the roll center, IMO. More camber gain (1 down), will roll more, and often have more side bite, and more rear grip on throttle while still cornering. Less camber gain (1 up), will roll less, have less rear side bite, and have more grip on throttle once the car is straight/squared up.
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Old 05-16-2016, 12:51 PM   #2855
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My understanding has always been ball stud height effects roll center and camber link length effects camber gain. Is this not correct? Never want to miss an opportunity to learn.
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Old 05-16-2016, 01:00 PM   #2856
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What I am reading is you should take some time out and test the different settings on the track and experience it for yourself if you can.
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Old 05-16-2016, 01:09 PM   #2857
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My understanding has always been ball stud height effects roll center and camber link length effects camber gain. Is this not correct? Never want to miss an opportunity to learn.
Moving the ball stud height affects roll center and camber gain. Camber links affect both too, but the roll center to a smaller degree.
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Old 05-16-2016, 01:09 PM   #2858
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EFFECTS OF REAR ROLL CENTER ADJUSTMENT
REAR ROLL CENTER CHARACTERISTICS
Higher
• Increases on-power traction
• Use to avoid traction rolling at corner entry
• Use under low-traction conditions
Lower
• Decreases rear traction into corner
• Increases steering into corner
• Use to avoid traction rolling mid-corner and corner exit
REAR UPPER CAMBER LINK -
LENGTH
CHARACTERISTICS
Shorter link (outer hole on tower and/
or inner hole on hub)
• Increases steering and decreases
stability into corner
• Increases on-power traction slightly
Longer link (inner hole on tower and/or
outer hole on hub)
• Decreases rear camber gain
• Increases stability
• Slows down the car‘s responsiveness
REAR UPPER CAMBER LINK -
SHOCKTOWER
EFFECT ON REAR ROLL CENTER

This has always been my bible on the subject and has always felt spot on as far as what the changes have felt like for me. My interpretation of the above post have me re thinking it. I just want to know if it is wrong.
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Old 05-17-2016, 09:38 AM   #2859
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Will there ever be a standard-thickness body compatible with the new laydown transmission?

While I understand it's rather counter-productive to drop the COG and then add weight to the body but, at least for practice, I'm looking for something with a higher durability factor.
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Old 05-17-2016, 09:50 AM   #2860
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Will there ever be a standard-thickness body compatible with the new laydown transmission?

While I understand it's rather counter-productive to drop the COG and then add weight to the body but, at least for practice, I'm looking for something with a higher durability factor.
You can run the standard body on it. You just won't have a covered spur.
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Old 05-17-2016, 10:12 AM   #2861
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You can run the standard body on it. You just won't have a covered spur.
Is there a good way to cover it in that case? Personally I'm fine with it but the local track owner is not.
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Old 05-17-2016, 10:31 AM   #2862
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MNiceGuy View Post
Is there a good way to cover it in that case? Personally I'm fine with it but the local track owner is not.
Cover it with extra lexan I suppose. It can be done.
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Old 05-17-2016, 10:34 AM   #2863
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Use the yokomo yz2 body. It fits quite nicely on the 3.0 i use it on my car, small gaps near the front but if your using the laydown then it wont really matter as clay tracks dont kick up much if any dirt.
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Old 05-17-2016, 10:37 AM   #2864
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Honestly, the body is pretty well protected by being so low. The shock towers / wing are going to take the brunt of any impacts. Just don't rip it off when taking the body off the chassis.
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Old 05-17-2016, 10:50 AM   #2865
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These are what I've gone off for roll center.

https://youtu.be/Wl1qcwe_ATU

https://youtu.be/tWdRQaz_Xq8
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