Go Back  R/C Tech Forums > General Forums > Radio and Electronics
How to solder correctly (a not so brief lesson) >

How to solder correctly (a not so brief lesson)

Like Tree31Likes

How to solder correctly (a not so brief lesson)

Old 12-09-2011, 01:52 AM
  #226  
Tech Regular
Thread Starter
iTrader: (2)
 
marine6680's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2009
Posts: 479
Trader Rating: 2 (100%+)
Default

Originally Posted by JPG View Post
I'm new to soldering and am curious why so much info I find out there says to stay away from using flux and also recommends using the silver solder, when you recommend the opposite? Opinions?
Not knowing the exact articles/info you are referring to, I can venture some guesses at best.

Flux... Well lets be honest. Most people can be lazy about things and not clean the residue well, simply do not know the best way to clean flux, or how to know if it is clean. Couple that with the fact that people can get over zealous and use too much, and you can have potential issues.

There is also the possibility that they were never taught to use flux, and/or never used it themselves. This can lead to the "I got along fine without it so far, why would I need it now?" thing. Which can be related to the amateur trap of "I am just as good as a trained pro".

Silver solder... Hype... pure and simple. They get caught up thinking that the superior electrical properties of silver solder vs lead (and other) solders actually means something to us in the RC world.

To put it bluntly, yes silver solder is better electrically but the difference is not enough to be any help to us. For a highly sensitive IC circuit yes, those IC chips in some precision equipment might actually benefit from silver solder if they are sensitive enough. For the uses that we in the RC world will use it for, it make no discernible difference, but people believe there is a difference and they then think they can tell a difference when using it... (self delusion, its common for situations like this, its similar to the placebo effect)

Here is the deal... The military aviation specs are very tough (well they was when I was in) They changed them just before I got out to make them more in line with the industry standards. This actually relaxed the standards. NASA standards for space flight are extremely tough. (the standards I was trained to are equivalent) They are tough because reliability is paramount on a space mission. Lives may be on the line, and even if they are not, it is practically impossible to send a repair crew to some space probe out orbiting Jupiter.

So if lead solder is good enough for them, then its definitively good enough for us. On top of that, it is many times easier to work with and get good results with.

If someone can provide hard data showing significant gains between lead solder and silver solder on the same system (not identical systems, as manufacturing variances between them can actually cause a difference measurable with equipment) then I will gladly provide instruction on its use. (I will need to brush up first, as it has been years since I used any)
marine6680 is offline  
Old 12-09-2011, 02:36 AM
  #227  
JPG
Tech Adept
iTrader: (1)
 
JPG's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2011
Location: Lower Alabama-ROLL TIDE!
Posts: 103
Trader Rating: 1 (100%+)
Default

I'm not saying your wrong, I'm just saying if you look around other RC sites, YouTube, etc....It seems that most don't like using flux. Some mention using the silver solder.

Randy from Tekin doesn't seem to be using flux in the video but I'm not sure. He certainly doesn't mention it.

Also, in Gary's video he actually uses silver solder and also is not using flux.

Hence my questions as to what is right or wrong. I guess I will do a little experimenting for myself.
JPG is offline  
Old 12-12-2011, 10:57 AM
  #228  
Tech Rookie
 
Join Date: Dec 2011
Posts: 13
Default

Quick question for ya. I need just a little bit more info on the flux. Iread your whole post.great info btw I thank u for that. I clicked on the links for the rma flux. What do u prefer? Paste or liquid? Also all I see are bigger liquid jugs/refills. How do u apply it? Is their a smaller liquid flux bottle and brush u can buy or do u just get your own bottle etc? If u don't mind could u give me a link on what u would buy? Including what u use to apply it? Thanks. Because of this article im gonna finally buy the hakko fx888. I fig it would be good for my small rc jobs here and there making batts/esc tie ins etc
c.rod is offline  
Old 12-13-2011, 12:01 AM
  #229  
Tech Regular
Thread Starter
iTrader: (2)
 
marine6680's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2009
Posts: 479
Trader Rating: 2 (100%+)
Default

Originally Posted by JPG View Post
I'm not saying your wrong, I'm just saying if you look around other RC sites, YouTube, etc....It seems that most don't like using flux. Some mention using the silver solder.

Randy from Tekin doesn't seem to be using flux in the video but I'm not sure. He certainly doesn't mention it.

Also, in Gary's video he actually uses silver solder and also is not using flux.

Hence my questions as to what is right or wrong. I guess I will do a little experimenting for myself.
Use flux... Always

Silver solder is harder to work with, needs higher temps, (increasing potential damage) and is more toxic. So I say it should be used by more experienced solderers only. Besides, it doesn't provide any real benefit for us in this hobby anyway.

Originally Posted by c.rod View Post
Quick question for ya. I need just a little bit more info on the flux. Iread your whole post.great info btw I thank u for that. I clicked on the links for the rma flux. What do u prefer? Paste or liquid? Also all I see are bigger liquid jugs/refills. How do u apply it? Is their a smaller liquid flux bottle and brush u can buy or do u just get your own bottle etc? If u don't mind could u give me a link on what u would buy? Including what u use to apply it? Thanks. Because of this article im gonna finally buy the hakko fx888. I fig it would be good for my small rc jobs here and there making batts/esc tie ins etc
Here is a bottle like I use to apply flux. You do not need ESD dissipative, but it won't hurt.

Radio shack and similar places usually have flux. a google shopping search should give you plenty of online options.

Either works as far as liquid vs paste. Paste drips less and stays in place better than liquid, making it good for times when liquid would spread and create too much mess. I use both, like I said, I make my own paste style by letting the liquid dry out. Use whatever is easiest for you to obtain. No need in buying a gallon jug, one bottle like I linked will last a long time. Just stick with RMA in a manageable amount.
marine6680 is offline  
Old 12-13-2011, 02:41 PM
  #230  
Tech Rookie
 
Join Date: Dec 2011
Posts: 13
Default

Cool thanks a lot. Your guide is gonna bring my solder skills to the next level. Lol

Would u recommend the hakko fx888?
c.rod is offline  
Old 12-13-2011, 10:31 PM
  #231  
Tech Regular
Thread Starter
iTrader: (2)
 
marine6680's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2009
Posts: 479
Trader Rating: 2 (100%+)
Default

Originally Posted by c.rod View Post
Cool thanks a lot. Your guide is gonna bring my solder skills to the next level. Lol

Would u recommend the hakko fx888?
It looks like it will be good. I have never used it personally. You may need to get a bigger tip than what it comes with.
marine6680 is offline  
Old 12-14-2011, 06:33 AM
  #232  
Tech Rookie
 
Join Date: Dec 2011
Posts: 13
Default

I thought the trak power etc that everyone was recommending was just an older version of the hakko 950 I believe? The one I linked is just the newer/replacement model for hakko is what I understood. If I plan on getting that model can u recommend some tips etc that I would need? Possibly with some links? Thanks
c.rod is offline  
Old 12-14-2011, 11:27 PM
  #233  
Tech Regular
Thread Starter
iTrader: (2)
 
marine6680's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2009
Posts: 479
Trader Rating: 2 (100%+)
Default

Originally Posted by c.rod View Post
I thought the trak power etc that everyone was recommending was just an older version of the hakko 950 I believe? The one I linked is just the newer/replacement model for hakko is what I understood. If I plan on getting that model can u recommend some tips etc that I would need? Possibly with some links? Thanks
The one it comes with is fine for smaller jobs.

3.2mm tip, good for medium jobs like 20ga to 12ga wire

5.2mm tip, good for larger jobs like 10ga to 6ga wire

As far as the different models of solder stations, I don't follow it much, as I am not in the market for one often. I just know what I am looking for in a soldering iron and find a reputable brand within my budget.
marine6680 is offline  
Old 12-15-2011, 06:49 AM
  #234  
Tech Rookie
 
Join Date: Dec 2011
Posts: 13
Default

So your saying a chisel tip should do mostly everything were doin? Is their any time I will need a pencil tip or pointed tip?
c.rod is offline  
Old 12-17-2011, 01:33 AM
  #235  
Tech Regular
Thread Starter
iTrader: (2)
 
marine6680's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2009
Posts: 479
Trader Rating: 2 (100%+)
Default

Originally Posted by c.rod View Post
So your saying a chisel tip should do mostly everything were doin? Is their any time I will need a pencil tip or pointed tip?
Honestly, I do not like them much, I just use smaller chisel tips. They are for very cramped and small areas, usually not a problem for us.

My favorite tip is for Pace brand soldering stations. (One of the best and the price matches that ranking) The Miniwave tip. Is is a single beveled design, but it has a concave shaped bevel rather than just a flat bevel. It is very difficult to apply to much solder to a connection with that tip if you are following the rules. The concave shape actually holds onto the liquid solder and helps pull excess away.
marine6680 is offline  
Old 12-17-2011, 07:17 AM
  #236  
Tech Rookie
 
Join Date: Dec 2011
Posts: 13
Default

Which pace model would u recommend?

Something like the pace wjs 100? ( the site won't let me link yet)

I understand this one is probably a lot better than the hakko fx-888 I referenced. I'm just wondering if it's necessary for a casual solderer like myself?
Probably once a month or so?

I just don't want I waste the money on the hakko if it's not going to work right when I want to use it.....
c.rod is offline  
Old 12-18-2011, 10:41 PM
  #237  
Tech Regular
Thread Starter
iTrader: (2)
 
marine6680's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2009
Posts: 479
Trader Rating: 2 (100%+)
Default

Originally Posted by c.rod View Post
Which pace model would u recommend?

Something like the pace wjs 100? ( the site won't let me link yet)

I understand this one is probably a lot better than the hakko fx-888 I referenced. I'm just wondering if it's necessary for a casual solderer like myself?
Probably once a month or so?

I just don't want I waste the money on the hakko if it's not going to work right when I want to use it.....
That is a $400 iron... way more than you need to spend!

If you want a Pace the ST-25 is good enough, and the PS-90 iron is better for R/C. The TD-100 iron is a design that uses a combined heating element and tip in one. Those will cost a lot more to replace.

The Hakko is all you really need. If you can find the Trakpower it is cheaper and has 2 tips in the box.
marine6680 is offline  
Old 01-23-2012, 04:33 PM
  #238  
Tech Master
 
Taylorm's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: Monclova, Ohio
Posts: 1,659
Default

Originally Posted by marine6680 View Post
The Hakko is all you really need. If you can find the Trakpower it is cheaper and has 2 tips in the box.
http://www.heliproz.com/prodinfo.asp?number=157489 59 BONES!!!!.great posts Marine.........awesome info
Taylorm is offline  
Old 01-24-2012, 02:32 AM
  #239  
Tech Regular
Thread Starter
iTrader: (2)
 
marine6680's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2009
Posts: 479
Trader Rating: 2 (100%+)
Default

Originally Posted by Taylorm View Post
http://www.heliproz.com/prodinfo.asp?number=157489 59 BONES!!!!.great posts Marine.........awesome info
Thanks... I think mine cost 60+ tax... It is a good iron.
marine6680 is offline  
Old 01-24-2012, 05:36 PM
  #240  
Tech Master
iTrader: (2)
 
Soviet's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2004
Location: Littleton, CO - USA
Posts: 1,708
Trader Rating: 2 (100%+)
Default

I worked on avionics in the Marine Corps and to this day:

1. Use flux.
2. Use silver-bearing solder 62/36/2 being my favorite.
3. Always solder at about 775F, sometimes 800F.
4. Pre-flux all connections, then pre-tin, then dip in flux again and solder the connection with minimal additional solder.
5. Each iron to object connection time is less than 1/2 second.
6. 91% isopropyl alcohol cleans all flux residue squeaky clean.


ALL of my joints are hot (shiny) and ultra-strong.

Note, I use a Weller WES 51D station. Folks do a lot better buying a name-brand station / iron as opposed to re-badged 'RC' products.

http://www.amazon.com/Weller-WESD51-.../dp/B000ARU9PO
Soviet is offline  

Thread Tools
Search this Thread

Contact Us - Archive - Advertising - Cookie Policy - Privacy Statement - Terms of Service - Do Not Sell My Personal Information -

Copyright 2018 MH Sub I, LLC dba Internet Brands. All rights reserved. Use of this site indicates your consent to the Terms of Use.