Can not remove battery tray!
 

https://cimg8.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.rct...17b363af0c.jpg
Anyone else have this problem? The battery tray that came in the radio is wider than the opening with the cover off. There is no room to rotate it out sideways either. The batteries are facing the wrong way for me to remove them while in the radio. The only solution I can think of is to split the case at the bottom to try and get it out. I even tried pushing through the top panel, but the tray is just too wide. Any ideas?

I think you are forcing the battery box into the wrong position.
Removal is not difficult at all if you set it in the correct position as shown in the figure below.

https://cimg3.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.rct...435d84db1f.jpg

I think this is the correct direction to install it.

https://cimg4.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.rct...8cd0041f65.jpg

Thank you for the quick reply! I didn't force anything, this is how I received the radio. I can't push or slide the battery tray in the direction you indicated (towards the connector). It is hooked on something in there. It almost acts as if one of the cells has partially come out of the tray, and is keeping it from moving. I'm thinking the only way will be to unscrew the two screws on the base and flex it apart slightly, drop the tray, and see what went wrong. Thanks again!

If that's the way you received the radio, then there can't be any cells in the battery holder because it doesn't come with any.

I think he bought a set with batteries provided by the shop.
I suspect that the shop staff may have installed the battery roughly and shipped it.

If not, he should complain to the manufacturer.

How's this radio after 12+ months on the market? Reading through the pages it seems people either love it or hate it?
I looked at one in my local hobby shop yesterday and it felt good in my hands. I have a TX16S v2 as well (for RC helis) and zero complaints.

Is this thing recommendable or should I spend a bit more and get a spektrum?

Don't buy Spektrum, even top paid guys that run horizon brands wont run their laggy over priced radios.

If you are already use to edge/open its a great value, the UI is the hardest part for people and why I am hesitant to recommend it to people that aren't already using edge. Still kind of a beta phase radio with a few things and since you can't use companion with it.
I'm still trying to get it fast enough to replace my NB4 Pro, but I've won a few races with it while testing, so speed isn't holding it back , much.
If it was spektrum vs Mt12 , MT12 every time.

That's anything in this hobby.

Ok thanks I have an old DX3S with about 6 cars bound to it, was thinking about the 4-1 MT12 as (hopefully) I can bind it to the old Spektrum receivers (DSM2). Yes the Spektrum response time is not that impressive.

I don't have DSM2, but I have a new Kraton 6s with an DSMR receiver and I'm able to bind successfully. Problem is the telemetry is very unstable and cuts in and out. Not a problem with controlling the vehicle though.

I was even able to emulate the AVC functionality with steering gain, throttle gain, and priority. I wrote a tutorial (on another forum), but I don't know if the rules here allow linking to another forum.

As I said previously in this thread, the ELRS receivers suffer from full throttle runaway failures under abnormal (but likely enough to be a concern) electrical faults. Even cheap junk radios I tested did not exhibit the same full throttle runaway problems.

The pwm range when operating in the ELRS 1000Hz mode is not as wide as other radios. One thing I noticed going from my NB4 to the MT12 is I could not achieve the same steering endpoints on my 2wd buggy with the MT12 where I had travel to spare with the NB4. I brought this up as an issue on the ELRS github and got dismissed because basically "that's just the way it is, it's not supposed to be able to do that. go to a slower response rate if you want the extended limits."

And that brings me to my last frustration - it's not one product controlled by one entity. It's 3 products controlled by 3 different entities who will just point fingers at each other when something goes wrong and results in a hodge podge experience as you learn the ins and outs of 3 different systems. This is the most notable when you need to update ELRS firmwares. With my NB4, I could flash receivers or just change settings from my transmitter. EdgeTX is nowhere near integrated enough with ELRS to do that, and I suspect ELRS isn't capable of doing that anyway.

I have yet to find anything I can do with the "infinitely programmable" EdgeTX software that makes its complexity worth using over a simpler, more intuitive/familiar radio like the NB4 I used to have, and I don't need the uber extended range of ELRS (99% of surface users never will). While the latency/response is top notch, the rest of the issues I outlined really have me thinking I should sell my MT12 and get an NB4+. And ultimately that would be my advice to anyone considering this radio - look elsewhere (but as others said, not spektrum lol). Only consider this radio if your budget is limited and your tolerance for frustration is high.

I'm interested in this, so please tell me the github issue number.

Here you go. It was like pulling teeth with these guys to get a direct answer, and because nobody else cared about it, it got closed with no action.

https://github.com/ExpressLRS/ExpressLRS/issues/2635

To me, it's a sign that the devs are more concerned with fancy features than the core functionality of what a radio is supposed to do.

I just read the issue on github, and you came across as extremely combative... I think what they are trying to tell you is clearly written in that Switch Configs link they sent you. This link: https://www.expresslrs.org/software/switch-config/

That page explains all the possible modes. Sure, they (or someone else that controls CRSF) can add more modes, but there are already a ton to choose from and I think you are asking for something that you don't need because what you need already exists. I feel that last part is most important. They repeatedly tried to tell you how to achieve the extended range and how it is not available in F1000, but they didn't articulate why you didn't need extended range in 1000Hz.

I am a newbie to ELRS (I just learned of it a few months ago) and all of this, but I will try to explain it to you here, if you don't mind. I don't know your level of technical understanding, so if I sound like I'm talking down to you, please forgive me, because I'm going to assume a very low-level of technical understanding just in case.. Or it could be helpful to others.

So the modes are all pre-defined. What's not explained in that page is the reasoning behind it. And that could be why you got frustrated with the answer. ExpressLRS and CRSF protocol are defined to send bits of data a certain way. And with that definition, they physically don't have enough time to fit every channel at higher packet rates. It's a physical time limitation that makes it so that certain modes need to be defined to limit the number of channels, or the resolution of the channels, or the frequency of the channels to fit everything in a fixed amount of time. The different modes allow the user to decide what trade-offs to make.

You'll see on your radio, you get to select Packet Rate and Switch Mode. Let's talk about each one:

For example, if you have selected the Wide Switch Mode, the transmitter is sending Channels 1 through 4 in 10-bit full-resolution (normal range), 1-bit for Channel 5, and 6- or 7-bit (depending on telemetry ratio setting) for Channels 6 through 12 in a round-robin scheme (The "RR" note). Full-resolution normal range is defined as 10-bits of data for every channel. That's 4×10 = 40 bits. Channel 6 through 12, assuming 6-bits. Total is 40+1+6=47 bits of data.

https://cimg1.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.rct...c835d9a539.png

See on the bottom of that column, it says this Wide switch mode is available from 50Hz to 1000Hz. For example, if you are set at a packet rate of 1kHz (1000Hz), that means a packet of data is transmitted from the transmitter to the receiver 1,000 times each second. That means it only has 1ms (1 millisecond) to finish transferring all the bits of data it needs to (assuming no overhead or idle time between packets, which is also unreasonable because there will be some idle time and also time for return telemetry). The time you have matters because the more time you have, the more time you have to send each bit. And the more time you have to send each bit, the easier it is for the receiver to receive it error free. This is why the range of ExpressLRS can be measured in miles. and latency in single-digit milliseconds. You have this control because you get to choose how much time you spend sending out each bit of data by selecting the frequency (packet rate) and the number of bits (the switch mode, or the number of channels and their resolution).

If it's not clear already, then let me point this out: Everything is a trade-off. Want higher packet rate? Then use fewer channels, use fewer bits for those upper-channels, and/or update those upper-channels less frequently (round robin). Want better range? Reduce the packet rate to give each bit more time, and again reduce the channels, channel resolution, and channel frequency. Want more channels? Reduce your packet rate, or reduce channel resolution.

Now, specifically for the PWM range, it's defined as normal and extended. Both are using 10-bit, so it can be one of 2¹⁰ = 1,024 possibilities. Assuming a center PWM pulse of 1,500μsec, each one of the 1,024 possibilities in Normal Range is representing 1μs (microsecond). 1,024/2 = 512 below 1,500μsec and 512 above 1,500μsec. That gives you the standard range of 988-2,012μsec. (1,500-512 = 988 and 1,500+512 = 2012). In Extended range, each one of those 1,024 possibilities represents 1.23046875μsec, so your range is now from 885μsec to 2115μsec. The tradeoff? the steps aren't as granular (not as smooth), as each step is now a larger step. But this is not something you would likely feel.

Looking at the table above, you have three Switch Modes to choose from that all offer this extended range. You'll notice on the bottom, that none of these three Switch Modes work with F1000 packet rate. You are limited to 100 & 333 Hz. And the Full Res 16 Rate/2 Switch Mode is only half-the frequency. But this shouldn't be a problem for you, because your Savox SC1257TG that you are trying to control clearly lists it's refresh rate at 333Hz.

My suggestion to you: Choose Full-res 8CH @ 333Hz assuming you don't need more than 8 channels. This way, you will have your extended range PWM on Channels 1-4 at 333Hz and channels 6-9 at 333Hz and those can drive your servo's full range at it's maximum refresh rate. You'll also get much greater reliability and range on your ExpressLRS link over F1000.

https://cimg9.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.rct...b58e601ea3.png

Just look at how much you needed to write - it's way too much info and presumes I'm too dumb to understand why I shouldn't want what I want. And here's the thing, from a UX perspective the whole system is terrible. Give me a prompt to select what channels I want to transmit, give me an option for "fastest packet rate based on selections" and let the software figure out the max packet rate it can do. then give me a little readout that tells me packet rate based on what I selected.

Beyond that, here's the thing - if the ELRS community wants to expand more into the surface world, they shouldn't kneecap packet rate because the system is trying to send 4 channels worth of data when it only needs to send 2, or force me to send 8 channels because I want extended limits.

And I've tried 333hz vs 1000hz and 1000hz still feels just that tinniest bit smoother. Likely because the max possible delay between my most recent input on the radio and the start of the next pwm period is smaller in F1000 mode than F333 mode.

And not every surface user uses the same servo I do - lots of people use sanwa servos that do have much higher pwm refresh rates and it's likely more servo and esc mfgs are going to offer servos that can operate at those higher refresh rates.

So yeah, I want what I want, I have reasons to want what I want, and rather than try to listen or have an open mind about it I'm just getting brushed aside and talked down to.

Not a great experience.