651LikesSeattle RC Racers/North SeaTac Racing Center
02-13-2023, 04:39 PM
#2492
Tech Apprentice
I'm not sure how the BC RRR schedules and your schedule will work out but I can say that one major turnoff for coming to visit in the summer was the tire choice made last year. I am not sure what or if any impact this will have on your decision but I thought an outside perspective may be of some use.
Mihai
Mihai
02-13-2023, 06:04 PM
#2493
Tech Apprentice
Setup Help for SeaTac/T4 '19, Stock?
Hi, all! I'm looking towards getting back on the track this summer at SeaTac and would really appreciate some help with a setup for my Xray T4 2019. I'd like to run the "1/10th scale that's not mod or USGT", which outdoors I think is 17.5 Super Stock...?
I've never been very successful with my tire/traction program outdoors. The main issue (other than the guy behind the wheel!) is that I'll get some semblance of a setup during morning practice and it will be good for the first qualifying heat. Then by the second qual heat my traction is heading south and I start swapping ends. By the main the car is just junk and I wind up pulling off the track (or not even starting) so I'm not ruining everyone else's race. I don't feel like I do a good job of anticipating track changes and wind up behind the traction over the course of the day.
I'd really like to get out and turn laps and want to have a car/setup that I can use focus on improving my driving, not chasing traction throughout the day. Rather than reinvent the wheel I'm hoping one of the fast guys will share some setups/advice with me.
I get that making adjustments throughout the day is a necessary evil, but some help on starting setups and most effective changes would be really appreciated!
Thanks, and hope to see you out there this summer!
Robert
I've never been very successful with my tire/traction program outdoors. The main issue (other than the guy behind the wheel!) is that I'll get some semblance of a setup during morning practice and it will be good for the first qualifying heat. Then by the second qual heat my traction is heading south and I start swapping ends. By the main the car is just junk and I wind up pulling off the track (or not even starting) so I'm not ruining everyone else's race. I don't feel like I do a good job of anticipating track changes and wind up behind the traction over the course of the day.
I'd really like to get out and turn laps and want to have a car/setup that I can use focus on improving my driving, not chasing traction throughout the day. Rather than reinvent the wheel I'm hoping one of the fast guys will share some setups/advice with me.
I get that making adjustments throughout the day is a necessary evil, but some help on starting setups and most effective changes would be really appreciated!Thanks, and hope to see you out there this summer!
Robert
02-13-2023, 10:06 PM
#2494
Hi Robert,
It'll be great to see you out there running again.
We no longer use sugar water, or soda track preparation which has helped reduce the change of traction through the day. On a side note, the main reason we moved away from prepping the track surface is because on marginal weather days it doesn't take as long for any moisture to dry to allow a race day. In the past we usually had to cancel because the track had to dry twice and with cloud cover, that's usually not going to happen quickly. There are other benefits too, which include allowing people to test during the week in similar conditions to what we race in. Also its less work, which is nice too. We still blow off the track as best we can, and suggest you do the same on practice days to have very similar conditions. A leaf blower works great. If you time it with others the groove comes up quick and people bring out cones, hang out and have a good time running together.
So, as far as tires and tire prep, we intend to have a spec tire again. Everyone will be narrowing down the saucing regime and sharing what works best. This year the talk is to try something a little harder than the 34 temps tires we used last year because there were more hot race days than cold days. Likely a 36 temperature range tire which should make it work better as the day gets warmer rather than worse because the tire is too soft.
As far as setup changes to account for less grip, that's more difficult to define for your car specifically , but typically lower roll center setups work better when traction is low, and higher roll center setups work best when grip is higher, if you want the best performance. I run an Awesomatix, so your results may vary! To gain rear stability you can move your wing back, as well as change your body to one that generates more rear grip.
What's really unique is that our clubs race track is on parks department land, so it's open to the public on most days ( most notably if we aren't racing on it that day. ) So you can test and tune on off days with similar conditions as a race day. All you need to do is you take the time to blow off the track, which isn't too much work.
Cheers,
Jake
It'll be great to see you out there running again.
We no longer use sugar water, or soda track preparation which has helped reduce the change of traction through the day. On a side note, the main reason we moved away from prepping the track surface is because on marginal weather days it doesn't take as long for any moisture to dry to allow a race day. In the past we usually had to cancel because the track had to dry twice and with cloud cover, that's usually not going to happen quickly. There are other benefits too, which include allowing people to test during the week in similar conditions to what we race in. Also its less work, which is nice too. We still blow off the track as best we can, and suggest you do the same on practice days to have very similar conditions. A leaf blower works great. If you time it with others the groove comes up quick and people bring out cones, hang out and have a good time running together.
So, as far as tires and tire prep, we intend to have a spec tire again. Everyone will be narrowing down the saucing regime and sharing what works best. This year the talk is to try something a little harder than the 34 temps tires we used last year because there were more hot race days than cold days. Likely a 36 temperature range tire which should make it work better as the day gets warmer rather than worse because the tire is too soft.
As far as setup changes to account for less grip, that's more difficult to define for your car specifically , but typically lower roll center setups work better when traction is low, and higher roll center setups work best when grip is higher, if you want the best performance. I run an Awesomatix, so your results may vary! To gain rear stability you can move your wing back, as well as change your body to one that generates more rear grip.
What's really unique is that our clubs race track is on parks department land, so it's open to the public on most days ( most notably if we aren't racing on it that day. ) So you can test and tune on off days with similar conditions as a race day. All you need to do is you take the time to blow off the track, which isn't too much work.
Cheers,
Jake
Hi, all! I'm looking towards getting back on the track this summer at SeaTac and would really appreciate some help with a setup for my Xray T4 2019. I'd like to run the "1/10th scale that's not mod or USGT", which outdoors I think is 17.5 Super Stock...?
I've never been very successful with my tire/traction program outdoors. The main issue (other than the guy behind the wheel!) is that I'll get some semblance of a setup during morning practice and it will be good for the first qualifying heat. Then by the second qual heat my traction is heading south and I start swapping ends. By the main the car is just junk and I wind up pulling off the track (or not even starting) so I'm not ruining everyone else's race. I don't feel like I do a good job of anticipating track changes and wind up behind the traction over the course of the day.
I'd really like to get out and turn laps and want to have a car/setup that I can use focus on improving my driving, not chasing traction throughout the day. Rather than reinvent the wheel I'm hoping one of the fast guys will share some setups/advice with me. I get that making adjustments throughout the day is a necessary evil, but some help on starting setups and most effective changes would be really appreciated!
Thanks, and hope to see you out there this summer!
Robert
I've never been very successful with my tire/traction program outdoors. The main issue (other than the guy behind the wheel!) is that I'll get some semblance of a setup during morning practice and it will be good for the first qualifying heat. Then by the second qual heat my traction is heading south and I start swapping ends. By the main the car is just junk and I wind up pulling off the track (or not even starting) so I'm not ruining everyone else's race. I don't feel like I do a good job of anticipating track changes and wind up behind the traction over the course of the day.
I'd really like to get out and turn laps and want to have a car/setup that I can use focus on improving my driving, not chasing traction throughout the day. Rather than reinvent the wheel I'm hoping one of the fast guys will share some setups/advice with me.
I get that making adjustments throughout the day is a necessary evil, but some help on starting setups and most effective changes would be really appreciated!Thanks, and hope to see you out there this summer!
Robert
02-14-2023, 06:52 PM
#2495
most of us won't lie..
i also vote for heads up starts for the heat races
02-14-2023, 10:39 PM
#2497
Tech Apprentice
Interesting to hear about the track prep. I don’t have the experience on asphalt to have an opinion, but all the points you made make a lot of sense. To me, I’m for whatever means more consistency.
Looking forward to the summer!
Cheers,
Robert
02-15-2023, 09:31 AM
#2498
.
02-15-2023, 09:33 AM
#2499
Jake
02-15-2023, 01:23 PM
#2500
I get what you’re saying, was just a suggestion, I’m not sure we’re in this sport/hobby to save money.
But if it keeps the attendance up, so be it.
Just as long as I can use all those tires from last year You talked me into buying at the last race, still NIP.😎🤪
But if it keeps the attendance up, so be it.
Just as long as I can use all those tires from last year You talked me into buying at the last race, still NIP.😎🤪
02-15-2023, 02:24 PM
#2501
Tech Apprentice
Outdoors any tire regardless of shore rating will be fastest in first one or two runs. Those that want to go fast will undoubtedly run fresh tires more often. There is no way to get a tire that maintains the same level of performance from freshy to worn out. Some consider a tire worn out when it slows down .2 a lap but for the purposes of this post we will treat worn out as chords showing.
One way to approach it is to get cheap hockey pucks which lead to horrible handling and frustrations especially for less experienced racers as well as a larger performance gap between participants.
The other would be to get a quality tire that offers that first two run Velcro traction then drops off by .2 per lap and remains consistent until chords are showing. This offers the inexperienced participant a steady consistent platform to work on setup, driving, and enjoy the experience. For the more "competitive" participants it allows peak performance without wonky setups to get the car to work and the choice to run tires for three or four race days or slap on a freshy for when they want to get serious.
One way to approach it is to get cheap hockey pucks which lead to horrible handling and frustrations especially for less experienced racers as well as a larger performance gap between participants.
The other would be to get a quality tire that offers that first two run Velcro traction then drops off by .2 per lap and remains consistent until chords are showing. This offers the inexperienced participant a steady consistent platform to work on setup, driving, and enjoy the experience. For the more "competitive" participants it allows peak performance without wonky setups to get the car to work and the choice to run tires for three or four race days or slap on a freshy for when they want to get serious.
02-16-2023, 06:05 PM
#2504
Having a spec tire is both to save the racer money while also maintaining a level playing field. Having two spec tires just doubles the cost, three, etc, open... it's just money being thrown away in lieu of learning about setup, imho. Generally a softer tire is faster, but will wear out faster too. So the guys with deep pockets will choose to use the 34 instead of the 36 on most days. If it is a race day decision based on the weather it forces a racer to have both tires on hand at all times, again, increasing cost.
Jake
Jake