Serpent 710
08-09-2005, 04:00 AM
Centax III
InitialD:
I read through that myTSN article regarding the Centax III an i now have the following questions...
In the past i have run a concrete surface on rubbers around tight track, according to the three combo's no 3 would appear to be the best for less bite. But reading on in the article is says the yellow clutch pad is no good in hot conditions in which was experience here is OZ. So i am guessing that leaves combo 1 as the only option?
At least you don't have to go out an buy a UFO clutch thingy...
BB
I read through that myTSN article regarding the Centax III an i now have the following questions...
In the past i have run a concrete surface on rubbers around tight track, according to the three combo's no 3 would appear to be the best for less bite. But reading on in the article is says the yellow clutch pad is no good in hot conditions in which was experience here is OZ. So i am guessing that leaves combo 1 as the only option?
At least you don't have to go out an buy a UFO clutch thingy...
BB
08-09-2005, 04:31 AM
Originally Posted by Bundy_Bear
But reading on in the article is says the yellow clutch pad is no good in hot conditions in which was experience here is OZ. So i am guessing that leaves combo 1 as the only option?
I don't know if Malaysia is any less hotter than Oz
but we use yellow shoes with modified / cut flyweights mounted in between the flywheel pin with lots of success. 
I think this is the 4th "missing" variation that should have been there in the article. Centax-3 assembly combination 4
* flyweights: modified / cut and mounted in between the flywheel pins
* spring: hard (909518 Centax II spring)
* clutch shoe: new yellow clutch shoe (802509)
* clutch gap: 0.5 to 0.7mm
* end play: minimal
0.5mm is for smaller and tighter tracks with lesser traction. You may even want to try the stock black clutch shoe (802508). 0.7mm clutch gap for larger tracks and more open with higher traction. I think this is what our Indonesian friends (Pyramid / Goldfinger) are using also.
08-09-2005, 04:34 AM
Originally Posted by Bundy_Bear
Oh... FYI i traded as S710_nut... if Sparksy hadn't fled south to Victoria from sunny Qld... hehehehehe
Where's that old bloke sparsky? Well, in RC you need to be very patient. There are some days when nothing will work correctly.
08-09-2005, 04:52 AM
Originally Posted by New_Toasted
I just turned my shocktower around so that the body posts came a little more forward, enough to "miss" the spoilermount. Could get some pics if you like to.
08-09-2005, 04:56 AM
Originally Posted by jag
Is that "The Mike Swauger" brousing the 710 forum? 
08-09-2005, 05:01 AM
Originally Posted by InitialD
Mean no disrespect to our Canadian buddy (Glenn) but perhaps being in a cold country, his interpretation of hot and cold may be relatively different.
I don't know if Malaysia is any less hotter than Oz but we use yellow shoes with modified / cut flyweights mounted in between the flywheel pin with lots of success. I think this is the 4th "missing" variation that should have been there in the article.
Centax-3 assembly combination 4
* flyweights: modified / cut and mounted in between the flywheel pins
* spring: hard (909518 Centax II spring)
* clutch shoe: new yellow clutch shoe (802509)
* clutch gap: 0.5 to 0.7mm
* end play: minimal
0.5mm is for smaller and tighter tracks with lesser traction. You may even want to try the stock black clutch shoe (802508). 0.7mm clutch gap for larger tracks and more open with higher traction. I think this is what our Indonesian friends (Pyramid / Goldfinger) are using also.
I don't know if Malaysia is any less hotter than Oz
but we use yellow shoes with modified / cut flyweights mounted in between the flywheel pin with lots of success. I think this is the 4th "missing" variation that should have been there in the article. Centax-3 assembly combination 4
* flyweights: modified / cut and mounted in between the flywheel pins
* spring: hard (909518 Centax II spring)
* clutch shoe: new yellow clutch shoe (802509)
* clutch gap: 0.5 to 0.7mm
* end play: minimal
0.5mm is for smaller and tighter tracks with lesser traction. You may even want to try the stock black clutch shoe (802508). 0.7mm clutch gap for larger tracks and more open with higher traction. I think this is what our Indonesian friends (Pyramid / Goldfinger) are using also.
I must say after trying out this combo, I really like it.
Errmm ... has the new member "arrived" yet?
08-09-2005, 05:22 AM
Originally Posted by InitialD
The reason why mounting the flyweights in between the post gives better performance is because it somehow makes the flyweights "heavier" mounted in this position and the axial force throws the flyweights axially towards the clutchshoe / clutchbell at a greater force.
I've tried making the flyweights heavier by using 2 pieces of M3 x 4 grub / set screws on each flyweight and mounted the flyweights in between the flywheel pins. Yellow shoes and the harder Centax II spring is used. But like what Pyramid experienced, it gives very good performance initially but the clutch somehow gets stuck intermittently going out of the corners after a while. Probably after it gets heated up.
So now I just cut the flyweights and mount them in between the flywheel pins.
What I do lighten is by drilling and making several dimple holes BEHIND the clutchshoe with a bodyshell reamer in order to make the clutchshoe lighter. I saw this being done by Rick V but that was on a 950R.
He explains that a lighter clutchshoe accelerates faster towards the clutchbell due to the axial force from the flyweights. This results in a more responsive clutch.
I've tried making the flyweights heavier by using 2 pieces of M3 x 4 grub / set screws on each flyweight and mounted the flyweights in between the flywheel pins. Yellow shoes and the harder Centax II spring is used. But like what Pyramid experienced, it gives very good performance initially but the clutch somehow gets stuck intermittently going out of the corners after a while. Probably after it gets heated up.
So now I just cut the flyweights and mount them in between the flywheel pins.
What I do lighten is by drilling and making several dimple holes BEHIND the clutchshoe with a bodyshell reamer in order to make the clutchshoe lighter. I saw this being done by Rick V but that was on a 950R.
He explains that a lighter clutchshoe accelerates faster towards the clutchbell due to the axial force from the flyweights. This results in a more responsive clutch.
Do you have a picture of how Rick/you lighten the flyweights?
How much preload and gap do you use with this setup? I am assuming the use of a yellow clutch and stiff spring.
Thanks,
jag
08-09-2005, 07:46 AM
Tech Regular
At the gouda track (small and tight) i saw rick cut up a yellow shoe in tree, and then using it like the normal weights would be used.. this was for the 710....
08-09-2005, 07:51 AM
Originally Posted by InitialD
Marcos, how are you? Still running the Schumacher or are you itching to get back to the 710?
08-09-2005, 09:42 AM
Originally Posted by _cyclops_
At the gouda track (small and tight) i saw rick cut up a yellow shoe in tree, and then using it like the normal weights would be used.. this was for the 710....
08-09-2005, 12:42 PM
Tech Regular
Originally Posted by jag
How did that work for him?
Dunno, it rained, lol
Nah, he was oke, but i'm no expert and he didn't finisch the clutch... it was rainy and we all went in.. next time i'll ask...
08-09-2005, 03:27 PM
Originally Posted by InitialD
Mean no disrespect to our Canadian buddy (Glenn) but perhaps being in a cold country, his interpretation of hot and cold may be relatively different.
I don't know if Malaysia is any less hotter than Oz but we use yellow shoes with modified / cut flyweights mounted in between the flywheel pin with lots of success. I think this is the 4th "missing" variation that should have been there in the article.
Centax-3 assembly combination 4
* flyweights: modified / cut and mounted in between the flywheel pins
* spring: hard (909518 Centax II spring)
* clutch shoe: new yellow clutch shoe (802509)
* clutch gap: 0.5 to 0.7mm
* end play: minimal
0.5mm is for smaller and tighter tracks with lesser traction. You may even want to try the stock black clutch shoe (802508). 0.7mm clutch gap for larger tracks and more open with higher traction. I think this is what our Indonesian friends (Pyramid / Goldfinger) are using also.
I don't know if Malaysia is any less hotter than Oz
but we use yellow shoes with modified / cut flyweights mounted in between the flywheel pin with lots of success. I think this is the 4th "missing" variation that should have been there in the article. Centax-3 assembly combination 4
* flyweights: modified / cut and mounted in between the flywheel pins
* spring: hard (909518 Centax II spring)
* clutch shoe: new yellow clutch shoe (802509)
* clutch gap: 0.5 to 0.7mm
* end play: minimal
0.5mm is for smaller and tighter tracks with lesser traction. You may even want to try the stock black clutch shoe (802508). 0.7mm clutch gap for larger tracks and more open with higher traction. I think this is what our Indonesian friends (Pyramid / Goldfinger) are using also.
Too many options, i am not sure i get cutting the flyweights? But it all good as i don't have a car at the moment
BB
08-09-2005, 04:33 PM
Hi guys,
Anybody here has their stock clutch not disengaging properly? How did you fix it? Thanks!
Anybody here has their stock clutch not disengaging properly? How did you fix it? Thanks!
08-09-2005, 06:20 PM
Originally Posted by InitialD
The reason why mounting the flyweights in between the post gives better performance is because it somehow makes the flyweights "heavier" mounted in this position and the axial force throws the flyweights axially towards the clutchshoe / clutchbell at a greater force.
I've tried making the flyweights heavier by using 2 pieces of M3 x 4 grub / set screws on each flyweight and mounted the flyweights in between the flywheel pins. Yellow shoes and the harder Centax II spring is used. But like what Pyramid experienced, it gives very good performance initially but the clutch somehow gets stuck intermittently going out of the corners after a while. Probably after it gets heated up.
So now I just cut the flyweights and mount them in between the flywheel pins.
What I do lighten is by drilling and making several dimple holes BEHIND the clutchshoe with a bodyshell reamer in order to make the clutchshoe lighter. I saw this being done by Rick V but that was on a 950R.
He explains that a lighter clutchshoe accelerates faster towards the clutchbell due to the axial force from the flyweights. This results in a more responsive clutch.
I've tried making the flyweights heavier by using 2 pieces of M3 x 4 grub / set screws on each flyweight and mounted the flyweights in between the flywheel pins. Yellow shoes and the harder Centax II spring is used. But like what Pyramid experienced, it gives very good performance initially but the clutch somehow gets stuck intermittently going out of the corners after a while. Probably after it gets heated up.
So now I just cut the flyweights and mount them in between the flywheel pins.
What I do lighten is by drilling and making several dimple holes BEHIND the clutchshoe with a bodyshell reamer in order to make the clutchshoe lighter. I saw this being done by Rick V but that was on a 950R.
He explains that a lighter clutchshoe accelerates faster towards the clutchbell due to the axial force from the flyweights. This results in a more responsive clutch.
Which has more bite? As in higher coefficient of friction. The yellow shoe or the ori black shoe?
08-10-2005, 01:28 AM
Originally Posted by gfd2726
Hi guys,
Anybody here has their stock clutch not disengaging properly? How did you fix it? Thanks!
Anybody here has their stock clutch not disengaging properly? How did you fix it? Thanks!
If not disengaging properly, perhaps you did not set the shims to space and that the clutch shoe is rubbing constantly when the engine is idling. That's bad and it will wear the clutch shoe prematurely. The clutchbell should be able to spin freely when everything is assembled.
Look and read Glenn Cauley's write up and illustrations at mytsn on how to build the Centax 3 clutch step by step.