4LikesNEW HOBBYWING STOCK SUPERCHARGED SOFTWARE
03-08-2011, 04:27 PM
#3661
Tech Apprentice
I did.
Let me try to explain, what I found out with Lipo's.
In my M11X transmitter, I have a 2S 2300mAh Lipo, why do I say that, well listen.
Fully charged, it is 8.4V (Duh
) Because I wanted to find out how long I could use my TX, I used it for several days, without charging. At the start of the last day, the battery voltage was 7.4V, which is nominal, so I thought I could still us my TX for a while (was already using it for 10 Hours up to to then)
But on the drivers stand, after a few minutes my transmitter started giving me low voltage alarms, and after checking the display, the battery was 6.7V.
So, conclusion, I drained the Lipo slowly, but when it reached 7.4V, it actually was almost empty.
Going back to the ESC.
The cut-off kicks in when the Lipo, under load goes under the set Voltage for more then 2 seconds.
The Lipo cut-off I have set to 3.4V (I drive 1S) and when the cut-off kicks in, I can still finish my lap (but slowly) and if I then measure my Lipo, it is around 3.7 - 3.8V
If I set the cut-off to 3.2V, the ESC doesn't give me the possiblity to finish my lap, and is even beeping the low voltage alarm... Lipo voltage is then also 3.2 - 3.3V
My conclusion, together with what I found out with my TX Lipo is that a Lipo set at a cut-off of 3.2 will just drain my lipo's to far, 3.4V is ok for me, for your information, I get 11+ minutes runtime on 3.4V....
I suggest you set your cut-off at 6.8V, just to check what happens...
Let me try to explain, what I found out with Lipo's.
In my M11X transmitter, I have a 2S 2300mAh Lipo, why do I say that, well listen.
Fully charged, it is 8.4V (Duh
) Because I wanted to find out how long I could use my TX, I used it for several days, without charging. At the start of the last day, the battery voltage was 7.4V, which is nominal, so I thought I could still us my TX for a while (was already using it for 10 Hours up to to then)But on the drivers stand, after a few minutes my transmitter started giving me low voltage alarms, and after checking the display, the battery was 6.7V.
So, conclusion, I drained the Lipo slowly, but when it reached 7.4V, it actually was almost empty.
Going back to the ESC.
The cut-off kicks in when the Lipo, under load goes under the set Voltage for more then 2 seconds.
The Lipo cut-off I have set to 3.4V (I drive 1S) and when the cut-off kicks in, I can still finish my lap (but slowly) and if I then measure my Lipo, it is around 3.7 - 3.8V
If I set the cut-off to 3.2V, the ESC doesn't give me the possiblity to finish my lap, and is even beeping the low voltage alarm... Lipo voltage is then also 3.2 - 3.3V
My conclusion, together with what I found out with my TX Lipo is that a Lipo set at a cut-off of 3.2 will just drain my lipo's to far, 3.4V is ok for me, for your information, I get 11+ minutes runtime on 3.4V....
I suggest you set your cut-off at 6.8V, just to check what happens...
but
thank's for suggestion.
03-08-2011, 04:29 PM
#3662
Tech Apprentice
I'm using a Intellect 2S 4000mah 20c with a Xerun / 17.5t and it seems to lack punch (Turbo doesn't hit hard) after two mins of driving running the 119stock software.
Would a larger / high rated LIPO make a difference or should I be looking elsewhere ?
Cheers Alan
Would a larger / high rated LIPO make a difference or should I be looking elsewhere ?
Cheers Alan
03-08-2011, 05:52 PM
#3664
My settings
03-08-2011, 06:05 PM
#3665
Wow very nice Cherry. Do you have the file for download?
03-08-2011, 06:22 PM
#3666
Dear Guys
Here we are with the proper info :
The timing is programmed to function in single step increments not timing related to angle .so every change you make is in (steps) increments to a maximum of 64 steps may it be internal timing(which changes dynamicaly or turbo timing (related to time).nothing else .
for example if you are running 40 steps in internal timing(related to rpm) and 30 steps in turbo timing (related to time) the effective timing (steps) will be max 64 steps with the 211 software ,were the extra 6 degree (steps) of timing will be useless and thats from the turbo timing not the internal timing .i hope you all understand .
the most important is the internal timing which is a total of 64 degree (steps) not degree angle) max now if you run max internal timing at 64 degree Steps) and 30 degree of turbo timing (Steps) the efective timing is only the internal timing and the 30 degree of turbo timing is wasted no turbo .
conclusion timing is related to steps not angle of degree.
I hope that it helps you guys out
Here we are with the proper info :
The timing is programmed to function in single step increments not timing related to angle .so every change you make is in (steps) increments to a maximum of 64 steps may it be internal timing(which changes dynamicaly or turbo timing (related to time).nothing else .
for example if you are running 40 steps in internal timing(related to rpm) and 30 steps in turbo timing (related to time) the effective timing (steps) will be max 64 steps with the 211 software ,were the extra 6 degree (steps) of timing will be useless and thats from the turbo timing not the internal timing .i hope you all understand .
the most important is the internal timing which is a total of 64 degree (steps) not degree angle) max now if you run max internal timing at 64 degree Steps) and 30 degree of turbo timing (Steps) the efective timing is only the internal timing and the 30 degree of turbo timing is wasted no turbo .
conclusion timing is related to steps not angle of degree.
I hope that it helps you guys out
Yes thiis clears that issue up. Thank you Angelo.
Shawn.
03-08-2011, 06:45 PM
#3667
03-08-2011, 06:47 PM
#3668
can someone point me to the 1102211 software...
HW website still only has the 110119 software
HW website still only has the 110119 software
03-08-2011, 07:39 PM
#3669
03-08-2011, 07:41 PM
#3670
which one generate more heat .. boost timing or turbo timing ?
03-08-2011, 07:43 PM
#3671
I think all of us should appreciate Angelo first for his hard working instead of complaint.
Almost everyone wants to be fast and want to use the newest weapon just because we are racers. But not everyone knows how the new weapon works even the brother of the weapon maker. Hope you guys can understand my english.
I had posted that the total real timing degrees applied to the motor were same from the version 100518 to latest 110211. (The only one should be mentioned is 101224, it really has some different concept but it was just a test version and now was proved not to be good enough for all kinds of applications by the factory, so it was not released by hobbywing official. But drivers like M7H found it very good for his driving, so just keep it and wait for the better one comes out.)
The difference in timing adjustment of 518,119,211 is from the newer version you can set it with more accurate steps. even 119 (60 steps) and the coming 211(64 steps) is the same. Irgo, I'm very sorry you just posted your imagination and confused so many users, let me tell you how your "4 degree secret" is coming. In 119, Michael has the initial fixed 4 degree(step) applied to the motor, so for users, we setting 0-60 degree(step) actually is 4-64. But in 211, for some detail technical reason , Michael cancelled the initial fixed 4 degree and made it adjustable with the other 60 degree(step), so that's why 211 is 0-64 adjustable.
I must say I really don't want to talk about such details which is not important to we players. I think we should run more on the tracks and found the good settings. The improvement of FW is NOT more timing degrees now, it's the method to make your control smooth and efficient and more adjustable so that the drivers can do faster laptimes by finding the perfect setting.
Hope above can be understood, sorry for my english not as well as you.
Almost everyone wants to be fast and want to use the newest weapon just because we are racers. But not everyone knows how the new weapon works even the brother of the weapon maker. Hope you guys can understand my english.
I had posted that the total real timing degrees applied to the motor were same from the version 100518 to latest 110211. (The only one should be mentioned is 101224, it really has some different concept but it was just a test version and now was proved not to be good enough for all kinds of applications by the factory, so it was not released by hobbywing official. But drivers like M7H found it very good for his driving, so just keep it and wait for the better one comes out.)
The difference in timing adjustment of 518,119,211 is from the newer version you can set it with more accurate steps. even 119 (60 steps) and the coming 211(64 steps) is the same. Irgo, I'm very sorry you just posted your imagination and confused so many users, let me tell you how your "4 degree secret" is coming. In 119, Michael has the initial fixed 4 degree(step) applied to the motor, so for users, we setting 0-60 degree(step) actually is 4-64. But in 211, for some detail technical reason , Michael cancelled the initial fixed 4 degree and made it adjustable with the other 60 degree(step), so that's why 211 is 0-64 adjustable.
I must say I really don't want to talk about such details which is not important to we players. I think we should run more on the tracks and found the good settings. The improvement of FW is NOT more timing degrees now, it's the method to make your control smooth and efficient and more adjustable so that the drivers can do faster laptimes by finding the perfect setting.
Hope above can be understood, sorry for my english not as well as you.
03-08-2011, 08:10 PM
#3672
MANY THANKS
I think all of us should appreciate Angelo first for his hard working instead of complaint.
Almost everyone wants to be fast and want to use the newest weapon just because we are racers. But not everyone knows how the new weapon works even the brother of the weapon maker. Hope you guys can understand my english.
I had posted that the total real timing degrees applied to the motor were same from the version 100518 to latest 110211. (The only one should be mentioned is 101224, it really has some different concept but it was just a test version and now was proved not to be good enough for all kinds of applications by the factory, so it was not released by hobbywing official. But drivers like M7H found it very good for his driving, so just keep it and wait for the better one comes out.)
The difference in timing adjustment of 518,119,211 is from the newer version you can set it with more accurate steps. even 119 (60 steps) and the coming 211(64 steps) is the same. Irgo, I'm very sorry you just posted your imagination and confused so many users, let me tell you how your "4 degree secret" is coming. In 119, Michael has the initial fixed 4 degree(step) applied to the motor, so for users, we setting 0-60 degree(step) actually is 4-64. But in 211, for some detail technical reason , Michael cancelled the initial fixed 4 degree and made it adjustable with the other 60 degree(step), so that's why 211 is 0-64 adjustable.
I must say I really don't want to talk about such details which is not important to we players. I think we should run more on the tracks and found the good settings. The improvement of FW is NOT more timing degrees now, it's the method to make your control smooth and efficient and more adjustable so that the drivers can do faster laptimes by finding the perfect setting.
Hope above can be understood, sorry for my english not as well as you.
Almost everyone wants to be fast and want to use the newest weapon just because we are racers. But not everyone knows how the new weapon works even the brother of the weapon maker. Hope you guys can understand my english.
I had posted that the total real timing degrees applied to the motor were same from the version 100518 to latest 110211. (The only one should be mentioned is 101224, it really has some different concept but it was just a test version and now was proved not to be good enough for all kinds of applications by the factory, so it was not released by hobbywing official. But drivers like M7H found it very good for his driving, so just keep it and wait for the better one comes out.)
The difference in timing adjustment of 518,119,211 is from the newer version you can set it with more accurate steps. even 119 (60 steps) and the coming 211(64 steps) is the same. Irgo, I'm very sorry you just posted your imagination and confused so many users, let me tell you how your "4 degree secret" is coming. In 119, Michael has the initial fixed 4 degree(step) applied to the motor, so for users, we setting 0-60 degree(step) actually is 4-64. But in 211, for some detail technical reason , Michael cancelled the initial fixed 4 degree and made it adjustable with the other 60 degree(step), so that's why 211 is 0-64 adjustable.
I must say I really don't want to talk about such details which is not important to we players. I think we should run more on the tracks and found the good settings. The improvement of FW is NOT more timing degrees now, it's the method to make your control smooth and efficient and more adjustable so that the drivers can do faster laptimes by finding the perfect setting.
Hope above can be understood, sorry for my english not as well as you.
Yes the best situation to clear setups is to set all parameters to the careful low temp options and start from this point to set up for your local track. Been there and destroyed two motors just trying to go fast!
All tracks are different and all brushless motors are different.
A point to this, just set a TP21.5P and a SP21.5V3 with identical software options but knowing that the two motors are different had to set FDRs different.
The SP21.5V3 spools up nicely but does not have the steady climb into turbo territory, a little jump on throttle occurs, where as the TP21.5P is super smoothe and a nice clean but very progressive climb into turbo territory where the motor goes nuts with extra RPM!!!!
Must now go and test......results soon.
Just an insight from across the seas.
Cheers
Ren
P.S. I am impressed.
03-08-2011, 08:43 PM
#3673
Timing, no matter how it is applied creates heat in the motor, by lowering its effiency, which increases its current draw.
Generally most people consider Turbo to create more heat because it is only used when the motor is at high speed, and already has alot of timing. So by adding more timing the motor will create more heat.
But its not the turbo, or the boost itself, just a function of the timing.
Shawn.
Generally most people consider Turbo to create more heat because it is only used when the motor is at high speed, and already has alot of timing. So by adding more timing the motor will create more heat.
But its not the turbo, or the boost itself, just a function of the timing.
Shawn.
03-08-2011, 08:57 PM
#3674
I think all of us should appreciate Angelo first for his hard working instead of complaint.
Almost everyone wants to be fast and want to use the newest weapon just because we are racers. But not everyone knows how the new weapon works even the brother of the weapon maker. Hope you guys can understand my english.
I had posted that the total real timing degrees applied to the motor were same from the version 100518 to latest 110211. (The only one should be mentioned is 101224, it really has some different concept but it was just a test version and now was proved not to be good enough for all kinds of applications by the factory, so it was not released by hobbywing official. But drivers like M7H found it very good for his driving, so just keep it and wait for the better one comes out.)
The difference in timing adjustment of 518,119,211 is from the newer version you can set it with more accurate steps. even 119 (60 steps) and the coming 211(64 steps) is the same. Irgo, I'm very sorry you just posted your imagination and confused so many users, let me tell you how your "4 degree secret" is coming. In 119, Michael has the initial fixed 4 degree(step) applied to the motor, so for users, we setting 0-60 degree(step) actually is 4-64. But in 211, for some detail technical reason , Michael cancelled the initial fixed 4 degree and made it adjustable with the other 60 degree(step), so that's why 211 is 0-64 adjustable.
I must say I really don't want to talk about such details which is not important to we players. I think we should run more on the tracks and found the good settings. The improvement of FW is NOT more timing degrees now, it's the method to make your control smooth and efficient and more adjustable so that the drivers can do faster laptimes by finding the perfect setting.
Hope above can be understood, sorry for my english not as well as you.
Almost everyone wants to be fast and want to use the newest weapon just because we are racers. But not everyone knows how the new weapon works even the brother of the weapon maker. Hope you guys can understand my english.
I had posted that the total real timing degrees applied to the motor were same from the version 100518 to latest 110211. (The only one should be mentioned is 101224, it really has some different concept but it was just a test version and now was proved not to be good enough for all kinds of applications by the factory, so it was not released by hobbywing official. But drivers like M7H found it very good for his driving, so just keep it and wait for the better one comes out.)
The difference in timing adjustment of 518,119,211 is from the newer version you can set it with more accurate steps. even 119 (60 steps) and the coming 211(64 steps) is the same. Irgo, I'm very sorry you just posted your imagination and confused so many users, let me tell you how your "4 degree secret" is coming. In 119, Michael has the initial fixed 4 degree(step) applied to the motor, so for users, we setting 0-60 degree(step) actually is 4-64. But in 211, for some detail technical reason , Michael cancelled the initial fixed 4 degree and made it adjustable with the other 60 degree(step), so that's why 211 is 0-64 adjustable.
I must say I really don't want to talk about such details which is not important to we players. I think we should run more on the tracks and found the good settings. The improvement of FW is NOT more timing degrees now, it's the method to make your control smooth and efficient and more adjustable so that the drivers can do faster laptimes by finding the perfect setting.
Hope above can be understood, sorry for my english not as well as you.
03-08-2011, 09:00 PM
#3675
Dear friends
Please also remember that when we say timing we mean Steps of current that is required to advance the timing not timing like you see on brushed motors where you turn the end bell of the motor from 10 degree to 60 degree etc thats all mechanical timing also known as (centrifugal timing advance) so the faster the motor spins the more timing is advanced the more powerful the motor gets .
what we talk about is electrical/electronic and related to current increasing/decreasing and not the angle of the timing to increase the current flow .So the steps we use example 64 steps not degree relates to current increase or decrease per step and we can increase the current flow much faster by using a timer to ramp it up .were the dynamic steps use rpm the turbo function uses time .
Please also remember that when we say timing we mean Steps of current that is required to advance the timing not timing like you see on brushed motors where you turn the end bell of the motor from 10 degree to 60 degree etc thats all mechanical timing also known as (centrifugal timing advance) so the faster the motor spins the more timing is advanced the more powerful the motor gets .
what we talk about is electrical/electronic and related to current increasing/decreasing and not the angle of the timing to increase the current flow .So the steps we use example 64 steps not degree relates to current increase or decrease per step and we can increase the current flow much faster by using a timer to ramp it up .were the dynamic steps use rpm the turbo function uses time .