5LikesNEW OS 21 XZ-B and Speed XZ-B
12-14-2012, 04:39 AM
#4126
About 1 year ago when all these wonder fuels were in full swing I stated the proof will be in the pudding....time will tell you how good the fuel is by the wear on the crankpins......... If your crankpin is worn down prematurely, and you have not ingested dirt it means your fuels lubrication has failed in its job to protect the engines internals..........too many people are quick to blame the engine quality, when its much more likely to be a fuel issue.... I run VZB and XZB engines, I run the hell out of them, and I do not get anywhere near the wear some of you guys here are seeing...if your crankpin is done in under 4 gallons I would be changing fuels immediately....OS cranks are soft, but they aren't that soft...a stock XZB is not a high revving engine by any means, so the wear is not from too much RPM, it is from friction and a lack of lubrication.....As I say the crankpin doesn't lie...
edit.... of course if you run your engine lean you can kill the crankpin... as in if you run hard and get 12 minutes runtime on a big track your likely running lean...and that will also kill your crankpin...
edit.... of course if you run your engine lean you can kill the crankpin... as in if you run hard and get 12 minutes runtime on a big track your likely running lean...and that will also kill your crankpin...
Last edited by Maximo; 12-14-2012 at 05:09 AM.
12-14-2012, 07:55 AM
#4127
you already know... 
if anyone really wants the skinny on fuel....ask somone like Neal, who does it everyday, on every brand, on every fuel, and on engines with much higher than stock stress and loads put on them after mod....its all there when actually private, random, lab tests are performed on all the major brands, every couple months.....I will definetely be reconsidering the fuel I run in 2013!! thanks Neal!!!
if anyone really wants the skinny on fuel....ask somone like Neal, who does it everyday, on every brand, on every fuel, and on engines with much higher than stock stress and loads put on them after mod....its all there when actually private, random, lab tests are performed on all the major brands, every couple months.....I will definetely be reconsidering the fuel I run in 2013!! thanks Neal!!!
12-15-2012, 07:19 PM
#4128
I think in my case, the fuel plays the biggest role in crankpin wear in all my engines..i run a picco boost in my basher also...my stuffs clean as can be, not a single scuff or scrape, with the most even and consistent pinch area, and beautifully golden plugs that never need changed due to failure...but regardless of xzb, vzb, picco, dlc or raw, my crank pins alone suffer...the last rod i changed had 5.5 gallons on it when it spun the lower bushing and ran dry.....im happy with 5.5 gallons on rods...not 1.5 gallons on xzb uncoated crank pins...its nowhere near out of spec, but clearly noticable....the first gallon is the most pampered one too! Preheat, lil rich, not pushin the revs, etc...
12-17-2012, 12:08 PM
#4129
New EBMods Power Plates are available. Improve power, and idle with just a simple bolt on back plate.
https://www.facebook.com/ed.bridges.35
https://www.facebook.com/ed.bridges.35
12-17-2012, 12:19 PM
#4130
Ed
Will you have a new website and be selling direct?
I don't have facebook, but would like to check out your new products.
Will you have a new website and be selling direct?
I don't have facebook, but would like to check out your new products.
12-17-2012, 01:39 PM
#4132
Power Plate on the way. Can't wait to try it out.
I ran my Speed again yesterday and I'm struggling with the tune on this motor.
At one point, the RPM's would hang when I let off the throttle then drop down. I set the idle gap to .7mm and closed it some more from there.
After that, it would still hang a touch after really opening it up. I fattened up the HSN about 3 hours and that didn't seem to make much of a difference. It flamed out on me a couple of times and I couldn't figure out why. At this point, I think I'm going to start over with the needle settings.
I searched and couldn't find it, but what position do you run the MSN in? I'm at 1 oclock right now.
Tuning this motor is different from my Novas. I could tune those with ease. I know this one isn't difficult, just need to learn it.
I ran my Speed again yesterday and I'm struggling with the tune on this motor.
At one point, the RPM's would hang when I let off the throttle then drop down. I set the idle gap to .7mm and closed it some more from there.
After that, it would still hang a touch after really opening it up. I fattened up the HSN about 3 hours and that didn't seem to make much of a difference. It flamed out on me a couple of times and I couldn't figure out why. At this point, I think I'm going to start over with the needle settings.
I searched and couldn't find it, but what position do you run the MSN in? I'm at 1 oclock right now.
Tuning this motor is different from my Novas. I could tune those with ease. I know this one isn't difficult, just need to learn it.
12-17-2012, 03:36 PM
#4133
12-17-2012, 05:15 PM
#4134
Yes, correct the XZB engines, Blue head or Speed Version.
12-17-2012, 05:19 PM
#4135
I feel like that's geared towards me. Not taking any offense to it, just wanted to get it out there. My engine ran a 240 degrees and I was only wide open for Maybe 2 seconds a lap. I was very smooth with my throttle and always stayed calm in order to achieve that 12 minutes. So I worked pretty hard to get that.
12-17-2012, 05:53 PM
#4136
I feel like that's geared towards me. Not taking any offense to it, just wanted to get it out there. My engine ran a 240 degrees and I was only wide open for Maybe 2 seconds a lap. I was very smooth with my throttle and always stayed calm in order to achieve that 12 minutes. So I worked pretty hard to get that.
which is fine cause most others in the race all pit around the same time but i do read these 10 to 12 minute pit stops i wish
12-17-2012, 10:21 PM
#4137
Tech Master
iTrader: (16)
I also have no access to your Facebook page Ed and would like to buy some of your engine oil but find it very difficult to locate anyone who has it in stock.
Definitely.
Power Plate on the way. Can't wait to try it out.
I ran my Speed again yesterday and I'm struggling with the tune on this motor.
At one point, the RPM's would hang when I let off the throttle then drop down. I set the idle gap to .7mm and closed it some more from there.
After that, it would still hang a touch after really opening it up. I fattened up the HSN about 3 hours and that didn't seem to make much of a difference. It flamed out on me a couple of times and I couldn't figure out why. At this point, I think I'm going to start over with the needle settings.
I searched and couldn't find it, but what position do you run the MSN in? I'm at 1 oclock right now.
Tuning this motor is different from my Novas. I could tune those with ease. I know this one isn't difficult, just need to learn it.
I ran my Speed again yesterday and I'm struggling with the tune on this motor.
At one point, the RPM's would hang when I let off the throttle then drop down. I set the idle gap to .7mm and closed it some more from there.
After that, it would still hang a touch after really opening it up. I fattened up the HSN about 3 hours and that didn't seem to make much of a difference. It flamed out on me a couple of times and I couldn't figure out why. At this point, I think I'm going to start over with the needle settings.
I searched and couldn't find it, but what position do you run the MSN in? I'm at 1 oclock right now.
Tuning this motor is different from my Novas. I could tune those with ease. I know this one isn't difficult, just need to learn it.
When the LSN is a bit rich, once you let off the throttle, there is still a bit of an overload of fuel in the cankcase, so the idle rpm's are too high until the extra charge gets burned off, then the engine slows down to a regular idle speed.
That, the 10 second 'rule/method' and the 'pinch test' are 3 very easy and surprisingly quite accurate ways of getting the LSN of any brand engine tuned well. If your LSN was too lean, most likely you would find the engine will flame out when you back off from a WOT situation.
When you mentioned that the engine did flame out a few times, in what part of the track/what kind of throttle opening did you have just before the engine stalled? Just remember, the HSN really has no effect on the engine when its idling, HSN only has much of a noticeable effect on the jetting from wide-open to about 1/3 or 1/2 throttle.
Read through the manual though, as it has a very easy to understand and easy to follow tuning instruction guide in there and that should hopefully get you going in the right direction. Regarding the MSN, again, the manual specifies to have the MSN flush with the carb body, this usually ends up with the slot in the MSN being at about 2 o'clock.
Hope that helps a bit mate.
12-18-2012, 04:17 AM
#4138
Power Plate on the way. Can't wait to try it out.
I ran my Speed again yesterday and I'm struggling with the tune on this motor.
At one point, the RPM's would hang when I let off the throttle then drop down. I set the idle gap to .7mm and closed it some more from there.
After that, it would still hang a touch after really opening it up. I fattened up the HSN about 3 hours and that didn't seem to make much of a difference. It flamed out on me a couple of times and I couldn't figure out why. At this point, I think I'm going to start over with the needle settings.
I searched and couldn't find it, but what position do you run the MSN in? I'm at 1 oclock right now.
Tuning this motor is different from my Novas. I could tune those with ease. I know this one isn't difficult, just need to learn it.
I ran my Speed again yesterday and I'm struggling with the tune on this motor.
At one point, the RPM's would hang when I let off the throttle then drop down. I set the idle gap to .7mm and closed it some more from there.
After that, it would still hang a touch after really opening it up. I fattened up the HSN about 3 hours and that didn't seem to make much of a difference. It flamed out on me a couple of times and I couldn't figure out why. At this point, I think I'm going to start over with the needle settings.
I searched and couldn't find it, but what position do you run the MSN in? I'm at 1 oclock right now.
Tuning this motor is different from my Novas. I could tune those with ease. I know this one isn't difficult, just need to learn it.
To me it sounds like your still letting in too much air when you let off the throttle...either your idle gap is too big, or your linkage setup needs some attention........Do you have space between your servo arm and throttle set stop ? ........
.call me crazy here , but I don't find that the LSN being too rich causes a engines RPM hang, usually it is the opposite....If a engine is lean the RPM Hangs, if the idle gap is too big the RPM hangs, if the linkage is sticking the RPM hangs...But I have never seen a engines RPM hang up from having too rich of a mixture...and I have tuned thousands of engines dating back to 1985 ..... Usually if the LSN is set too rich and the RPM is hanging it just means the idle gap is hanging open too far and the LSN set too rich to mask it....not really the cause of the problem but rather a byproduct
here is what I find causes engines RPM to hang, more or less in order of likelihood
.
1. idle gap.... either linkage hanging, or gap too large( no space on set stop is #1 )
2 HSN mixture too lean
3 LSN mixture too lean
4 fuel volume low in tank, loss of fuel supply during hard braking
5 Glowplug too hot
6 engine still tight (new )
7 engine worn out (too loose )
8 engine damage
Just to explain a little... Anything that requires you to run a larger then normal idle gap will cause a engine to high idle letting off throttle.... for example when a engine is worn out it wont idle correctly unless it has a large idle gap, and because of this the engine will want to idle high letting off throttle, but then idle down low once sitting...and if you try to lower the idle gap to a normal size the engine will just flame out..... Same thing as the engine being too new and tight, the only way you can keep it running is to have a big idle gap, which causes the RPM hanging issues..... Any time you are forced to run a larger idle gap your going to experience the hanging RPM letting off trigger.... The mechanical condition of the engine will determine how well the engine will be able to idle down simply based off how stable the engine is with a small idle gap....... new,worn or damaged engines are unstable with a small idle gap, and will usually only run with a larger idle gap, which obviously causes these other issues.... anyways hope this helps some
12-18-2012, 07:11 AM
#4139
To me it sounds like your still letting in too much air when you let off the throttle...either your idle gap is too big, or your linkage setup needs some attention........Do you have space between your servo arm and throttle set stop ? ........
.call me crazy here , but I don't find that the LSN being too rich causes a engines RPM hang, usually it is the opposite....If a engine is lean the RPM Hangs, if the idle gap is too big the RPM hangs, if the linkage is sticking the RPM hangs...But I have never seen a engines RPM hang up from having too rich of a mixture...and I have tuned thousands of engines dating back to 1985 ..... Usually if the LSN is set too rich and the RPM is hanging it just means the idle gap is hanging open too far and the LSN set too rich to mask it....not really the cause of the problem but rather a byproduct
here is what I find causes engines RPM to hang, more or less in order of likelihood
.
1. idle gap.... either linkage hanging, or gap too large( no space on set stop is #1 )
2 HSN mixture too lean
3 LSN mixture too lean
4 fuel volume low in tank, loss of fuel supply during hard braking
5 Glowplug too hot
6 engine still tight (new )
7 engine worn out (too loose )
8 engine damage
Just to explain a little... Anything that requires you to run a larger then normal idle gap will cause a engine to high idle letting off throttle.... for example when a engine is worn out it wont idle correctly unless it has a large idle gap, and because of this the engine will want to idle high letting off throttle, but then idle down low once sitting...and if you try to lower the idle gap to a normal size the engine will just flame out..... Same thing as the engine being too new and tight, the only way you can keep it running is to have a big idle gap, which causes the RPM hanging issues..... Any time you are forced to run a larger idle gap your going to experience the hanging RPM letting off trigger.... The mechanical condition of the engine will determine how well the engine will be able to idle down simply based off how stable the engine is with a small idle gap....... new,worn or damaged engines are unstable with a small idle gap, and will usually only run with a larger idle gap, which obviously causes these other issues.... anyways hope this helps some
.call me crazy here , but I don't find that the LSN being too rich causes a engines RPM hang, usually it is the opposite....If a engine is lean the RPM Hangs, if the idle gap is too big the RPM hangs, if the linkage is sticking the RPM hangs...But I have never seen a engines RPM hang up from having too rich of a mixture...and I have tuned thousands of engines dating back to 1985 ..... Usually if the LSN is set too rich and the RPM is hanging it just means the idle gap is hanging open too far and the LSN set too rich to mask it....not really the cause of the problem but rather a byproduct
here is what I find causes engines RPM to hang, more or less in order of likelihood
.
1. idle gap.... either linkage hanging, or gap too large( no space on set stop is #1 )
2 HSN mixture too lean
3 LSN mixture too lean
4 fuel volume low in tank, loss of fuel supply during hard braking
5 Glowplug too hot
6 engine still tight (new )
7 engine worn out (too loose )
8 engine damage
Just to explain a little... Anything that requires you to run a larger then normal idle gap will cause a engine to high idle letting off throttle.... for example when a engine is worn out it wont idle correctly unless it has a large idle gap, and because of this the engine will want to idle high letting off throttle, but then idle down low once sitting...and if you try to lower the idle gap to a normal size the engine will just flame out..... Same thing as the engine being too new and tight, the only way you can keep it running is to have a big idle gap, which causes the RPM hanging issues..... Any time you are forced to run a larger idle gap your going to experience the hanging RPM letting off trigger.... The mechanical condition of the engine will determine how well the engine will be able to idle down simply based off how stable the engine is with a small idle gap....... new,worn or damaged engines are unstable with a small idle gap, and will usually only run with a larger idle gap, which obviously causes these other issues.... anyways hope this helps some
I did double check the linkage and it's not sticking or preventing the slide from closing completely.
It just needs to be run some more and I'll slowly get it dialed in.
Thanks for the help
12-18-2012, 07:54 AM
#4140
I set the idle gap at .7mm before I went to the track and closed it more while tuning the car. It's less than .7mm for sure right now, probably closer to .5mm. After thinking about it, I really think the RPM hanging had more to do with the fact that the motor is still really new. It's just now reaching the 1 gallon mark.
I did double check the linkage and it's not sticking or preventing the slide from closing completely.
It just needs to be run some more and I'll slowly get it dialed in.
Thanks for the help
I did double check the linkage and it's not sticking or preventing the slide from closing completely.
It just needs to be run some more and I'll slowly get it dialed in.
Thanks for the help