256LikesTamiya TRF419
10-22-2017 | 03:48 AM
#3589
Tech Adept
Joined: Sep 2013
Posts: 172
From: Hungary
Hi Guys,
I am sharing with you my first two „tests” of 419WS on alu chassis. Summer season is over, I didnt have much time to run on asphalt.
Mibo (Hrotovice) first round:
- The car was excellent with alu chassis. I couldnt believe it is so much improvment vs carbon.
- I had 8x4 minutes as practice on Friday and 6x5 minutes on Saturday, overall not too much experience but good start.
- My expectation was to be competitive but not so far from P1 like I was on last season (P1 gave 0.3-0.4 sec / lap). This has been improved to 0.1 sec/lap, which was awesome knowing I am not that good fit (I have 2nd baby born recently who keeps me busy 24 hours :-))
After couple of practice it looked I will end up around P5 out of 36 drivers, some x-ray friends came to me and wanted to know my „secret” :-) (we were very competitive last season, this time I was quicker by 0.15sec/lap) however during qualify I made only one misstake - rolled - in the last corner of the last lap, 2-3 meters from the finish :-(... which cost me 5seconds. Rest of the 2 qualifies I went to wrong direction with setting changes (still I was focused on to try different setups) by chaning roll centers (adding shimps) end ended finally on P11, so B1.
I did test motor screw position, 450 oil, camber changes in front, diff oil from 5k to 7k, chassis stiffener, all screws in the chassis. What I didnt test at all: springs (If I had the time I would test them). I want to test 2.6 all around, 2.5-2.8 all around. I wanted to „free up” the front of the car, since it turned very quickly and didnt want to „manage” it with lower dual rate.
In the final B it was an „easy” win with 4-5 seconds win over 2nd. I continoued to „test” the car and this is how I ended up :-).
Overall very happy with the car and the result since I knew this is the right direction. Couple of practice more, more sleeping :-) and car will be very competitive. Still Awesomatix and x-ray the challange to beat but they are not that far :-).
XRS – Hudy
- this was the first time I visited this great place (Hudy Arena, Trencin). My hungarian x-ray friends took me over this place. Only x-ray cars :-), one awesomatics and myself with the blue one :-). A lot more time we had the chance test on Friday which bring me much closer to understand the car
- the track was „smaller” vs Mibo, on different tyres - Hudy tyres are great one - but traction was high from the begining. This time I did a lot of changes and ended up like this. The misstake I did that only on Saturday – for the final – I changed rear spring and didnt test earlier which I should. (I was running 2.7). Still my challange was the front of the car turns very quick.
- Overall very great performance, however a bit more far away from top5 (factory drivers, like Jan :-)), they were quicker by 0.2sec/lap. Of course I dont have magic charger, but anyway their car worked better and they are top guys.
I ended up in P6 in out of 16 drivers in stock category, which overall is a fantasic result for a guy who runs this game for hobby purpose and was very tired :-).
To test in upcoming races:
- shorter front track width with arm sweep (worked well) and springs will be my „key” direction, maybe 450 front, 500 real oil combination.
Feel free to share/add your comments, if you have any. Waiting for :-)Christian Donath setup after coming ETS – hopefully he will have a great position and share it.
For me next race in November, till that some relax.
Cheers,
Marton
I am sharing with you my first two „tests” of 419WS on alu chassis. Summer season is over, I didnt have much time to run on asphalt.
Mibo (Hrotovice) first round:
- The car was excellent with alu chassis. I couldnt believe it is so much improvment vs carbon.
- I had 8x4 minutes as practice on Friday and 6x5 minutes on Saturday, overall not too much experience but good start.
- My expectation was to be competitive but not so far from P1 like I was on last season (P1 gave 0.3-0.4 sec / lap). This has been improved to 0.1 sec/lap, which was awesome knowing I am not that good fit (I have 2nd baby born recently who keeps me busy 24 hours :-))
After couple of practice it looked I will end up around P5 out of 36 drivers, some x-ray friends came to me and wanted to know my „secret” :-) (we were very competitive last season, this time I was quicker by 0.15sec/lap) however during qualify I made only one misstake - rolled - in the last corner of the last lap, 2-3 meters from the finish :-(... which cost me 5seconds. Rest of the 2 qualifies I went to wrong direction with setting changes (still I was focused on to try different setups) by chaning roll centers (adding shimps) end ended finally on P11, so B1.
I did test motor screw position, 450 oil, camber changes in front, diff oil from 5k to 7k, chassis stiffener, all screws in the chassis. What I didnt test at all: springs (If I had the time I would test them). I want to test 2.6 all around, 2.5-2.8 all around. I wanted to „free up” the front of the car, since it turned very quickly and didnt want to „manage” it with lower dual rate.
In the final B it was an „easy” win with 4-5 seconds win over 2nd. I continoued to „test” the car and this is how I ended up :-).
Overall very happy with the car and the result since I knew this is the right direction. Couple of practice more, more sleeping :-) and car will be very competitive. Still Awesomatix and x-ray the challange to beat but they are not that far :-).
XRS – Hudy
- this was the first time I visited this great place (Hudy Arena, Trencin). My hungarian x-ray friends took me over this place. Only x-ray cars :-), one awesomatics and myself with the blue one :-). A lot more time we had the chance test on Friday which bring me much closer to understand the car
- the track was „smaller” vs Mibo, on different tyres - Hudy tyres are great one - but traction was high from the begining. This time I did a lot of changes and ended up like this. The misstake I did that only on Saturday – for the final – I changed rear spring and didnt test earlier which I should. (I was running 2.7). Still my challange was the front of the car turns very quick.
- Overall very great performance, however a bit more far away from top5 (factory drivers, like Jan :-)), they were quicker by 0.2sec/lap. Of course I dont have magic charger, but anyway their car worked better and they are top guys.
I ended up in P6 in out of 16 drivers in stock category, which overall is a fantasic result for a guy who runs this game for hobby purpose and was very tired :-).
To test in upcoming races:
- shorter front track width with arm sweep (worked well) and springs will be my „key” direction, maybe 450 front, 500 real oil combination.
Feel free to share/add your comments, if you have any. Waiting for :-)Christian Donath setup after coming ETS – hopefully he will have a great position and share it.
For me next race in November, till that some relax.
Cheers,
Marton
10-23-2017 | 03:26 AM
#3590
Joined: Sep 2010
Posts: 3,569
From: My house.
@Marcika, since a long time I've been studying the tamiya cars (since the 415/6), two tips I can share with the tamiya racers:
-the rear roll centre is usually too low and lower than the front, both bad. What you can do is use some shims under the lower suspension holders and see if the lower and upper arms are parallel to each other, you will have to change shims under the inner camber link doesn't matter if you change inner or wheel side to have parallel arms again. To avoid that over sensitivity on corner entry use less 0.5mm of shims under the front suspension holders. To test this use a thicker rear roll bar or softer front, if it does what you want then I'm right.
-more than usually the front springs have to be stiffer than rear, they are mounted away from the wheels and that changes leverage.
Congrats on being father again.
-the rear roll centre is usually too low and lower than the front, both bad. What you can do is use some shims under the lower suspension holders and see if the lower and upper arms are parallel to each other, you will have to change shims under the inner camber link doesn't matter if you change inner or wheel side to have parallel arms again. To avoid that over sensitivity on corner entry use less 0.5mm of shims under the front suspension holders. To test this use a thicker rear roll bar or softer front, if it does what you want then I'm right.
-more than usually the front springs have to be stiffer than rear, they are mounted away from the wheels and that changes leverage.
Congrats on being father again.
I am running the alloy chassis this weekend. I have high hopes for it for the coming carpet season
10-23-2017 | 07:43 AM
#3592
Tech Adept
Joined: Sep 2013
Posts: 172
From: Hungary
Have a good luck and get that hope real 
!
And pls dont forget to share how it went!
30tooth - thanks. I havent tested it but was a base setup in my previous car (417,419) with long dampers. Once i have more time i will give a try. So far, 2.6 and progressive springs worked well.(last season)
Best,
Marton
! And pls dont forget to share how it went!
30tooth - thanks. I havent tested it but was a base setup in my previous car (417,419) with long dampers. Once i have more time i will give a try. So far, 2.6 and progressive springs worked well.(last season)
Best,
Marton
10-23-2017 | 08:22 AM
#3593
@Marcika, since a long time I've been studying the tamiya cars (since the 415/6), two tips I can share with the tamiya racers:
-the rear roll centre is usually too low and lower than the front, both bad. What you can do is use some shims under the lower suspension holders and see if the lower and upper arms are parallel to each other, you will have to change shims under the inner camber link doesn't matter if you change inner or wheel side to have parallel arms again. To avoid that over sensitivity on corner entry use less 0.5mm of shims under the front suspension holders. To test this use a thicker rear roll bar or softer front, if it does what you want then I'm right.
-more than usually the front springs have to be stiffer than rear, they are mounted away from the wheels and that changes leverage.
Congrats on being father again.
-the rear roll centre is usually too low and lower than the front, both bad. What you can do is use some shims under the lower suspension holders and see if the lower and upper arms are parallel to each other, you will have to change shims under the inner camber link doesn't matter if you change inner or wheel side to have parallel arms again. To avoid that over sensitivity on corner entry use less 0.5mm of shims under the front suspension holders. To test this use a thicker rear roll bar or softer front, if it does what you want then I'm right.
-more than usually the front springs have to be stiffer than rear, they are mounted away from the wheels and that changes leverage.
Congrats on being father again.
10-23-2017 | 03:51 PM
#3594
Joined: Sep 2010
Posts: 3,569
From: My house.
BAZINGA!
10-30-2017 | 12:58 AM
#3595
Tech Adept
Joined: Sep 2013
Posts: 172
From: Hungary
Hi Qatmix,
How did it go? Looks ets result for tamiya guys are great, so car is working well.
I am sure truck racing was great as well. (Unfortunately back gome no longer interest for this, before 7-8 of us run it - took the champs 2 times )
Best,
Marton
How did it go? Looks ets result for tamiya guys are great, so car is working well
. I am sure truck racing was great as well
. (Unfortunately back gome no longer interest for this, before 7-8 of us run it - took the champs 2 times )Best,
Marton
11-11-2017 | 01:22 AM
#3597
Tech Master
Joined: Jun 2008
Posts: 1,458
From: santa monica / manchester
11-11-2017 | 01:39 PM
#3598
Tech Addict
Joined: Oct 2012
Posts: 660
Sorry to ask this. I didn't see any where to buy just the aluminum chassis plate. Is this for sale by tamiya? Or is someone else making 1?the aluminum chassis doesn't come with part set 42317?is the 42317 a different chassis plate from 419x?
11-11-2017 | 03:02 PM
#3599
Tech Addict
Joined: Jun 2016
Posts: 569
From: Munich
In the picture you can see on the left side the part numbers for aluminium lower deck and 1.7mm upper deck (419XWS)
