1LikesTLR 22 Racing Buggy Thread
04-27-2011, 06:03 PM
#5971
Tech Fanatic
iTrader: (66)
I asked that question earlier in the post also, I have two cars and both went together awesome with no complaints whatsoever. Diffs and all are still smooth, car is free and no slop, yes I love the quality of the car, but my only complaint is that there was no tuning section in the back of the manual as in previous losi manuals.
04-27-2011, 06:06 PM
#5972
Suspended
These look really nice. It is neat that you have two options. RC cars are very advanced nowa days.
I have many RC cars now ( as does my son ), but this is one we may end up getting.
I have many RC cars now ( as does my son ), but this is one we may end up getting.
04-27-2011, 07:36 PM
#5973
anyone interested in a set of blue V1 barcodes on yellow wheels rears. that have 1, 5min run on them, shoot me a PM if interested
Last edited by racerx1920; 04-27-2011 at 08:42 PM.
04-27-2011, 10:15 PM
#5975
Wrap by Stickit1Racing.com
04-27-2011, 10:32 PM
#5976
I think Trevor has it backwards actually.
I wouldn't think about it in terms of entering or exiting, think of it in terms of off-power steering (weight shifted to the front tires), and on-power steering (weight shifted off front tires). Everything I have ever read about caster, says the more caster you run, the less steering you get off throttle (entering a corner), and gives more steering ON-throttle, as you exit.
I wouldn't think about it in terms of entering or exiting, think of it in terms of off-power steering (weight shifted to the front tires), and on-power steering (weight shifted off front tires). Everything I have ever read about caster, says the more caster you run, the less steering you get off throttle (entering a corner), and gives more steering ON-throttle, as you exit.
Steeper caster (more vertical)
Increased OFF-power steering INTO a corner.
Why? Imagine that the caster angle is vertical. Now imagine that you turn the steering; the wheels turn to the side. The steeper the caster angle, the more that the wheels deflect to the side, giving you more turn-in into a corner.
Increased suspension efficiency.
Why? The inboard suspension pins are, for the sake of discussion, parallel the chassis (horizontal) which means that the suspension arms move up and down vertically. Now, imagine that the caster angle is vertical, meaning that the top and bottom of the steering “kingpin” is directly aligned with the motion of the suspension arms. And finally, acknowledge that shock absorbers are pretty much horizontally aligned (the top is no further ahead of or behind the bottom), running perpenticular to the long axis of the car. Since bumps in the racing surface cause vertical deflections of the wheel, the more vertically oriented the steeringblock is, the better the front suspension can soak-up bumps without binding.
Decreased ON-power steering OUT of a corner.
Why? When you increase the power coming out of a corner, the weight bias shifts from the front wheels to the rear wheels. The more vertical the caster angle, the less the effective camber change of the wheels, so that ONLY the static camber of the outside wheel is affecting how much the wheels “dig in”. Since the wheels cannot “dig in” effectively, the reduced weight on the front wheels will cause the front to lose traction more easily, causing the car to understeer.
Decreased wheel-centering.
Why? Imagine that the caster angle is vertical. Now imagine that you take hold of the forward edge of a front tire and move it from side-to-side. The wheel deflects an amount proportional to how much you move it with your hand. Vertical caster is highly unstable because there is little in the way of forces to want to keep the wheels pointing straight ahead.
Shallower caster (more laid-back)
Decreased OFF-power steering INTO a corner.
Why? Imagine that the caster angle is so laid-back that it is horizontal (though this would be impossible). Now imagine that you turn the steering; the wheels would not turn to the side anymore, but rather the tops of the wheels would now tilt to the side. The shallower the caster angle, the less the wheels deflect to the side, giving you less turn-in into a corner.
Increased ON-power steering OUT of a corner.
Why? The more laid-back the caster angle, the more effective camber you get when you turn the front wheels. When you increase the power coming out of a corner, the weight bias shifts from the front of the car to the rear. Normally this would cause front to lose traction and understeer. However, since there is more effective camber at more laid-back caster angles, the “tilted” front wheels are more able to “dig” into the corner, allowing the car to resist centrifugal force and giving it a greater amount of control when exiting a corner.
Increased wheel-centering, but decreased straight-line stability.
Why? Imagine that the front wheels of a shopping cart (which have extremely shallow caster). Push the cart forward, and the front wheels will always try to center themselves. The shallower the caster angle, the more the steering is always fighting to get back to center. However (you knew this was coming, right?), the shallower you make the caster angle, the greater the amount of force trying to center the wheels. Eventually the forces become so great that the wheels will start to shimmy, decreasing straight-line stability.
04-27-2011, 11:04 PM
#5978
I think so too.........This is the reference I have been using for awhile:
Steeper caster (more vertical)
Increased OFF-power steering INTO a corner.
Why? Imagine that the caster angle is vertical. Now imagine that you turn the steering; the wheels turn to the side. The steeper the caster angle, the more that the wheels deflect to the side, giving you more turn-in into a corner.
Increased suspension efficiency.
Why? The inboard suspension pins are, for the sake of discussion, parallel the chassis (horizontal) which means that the suspension arms move up and down vertically. Now, imagine that the caster angle is vertical, meaning that the top and bottom of the steering “kingpin” is directly aligned with the motion of the suspension arms. And finally, acknowledge that shock absorbers are pretty much horizontally aligned (the top is no further ahead of or behind the bottom), running perpenticular to the long axis of the car. Since bumps in the racing surface cause vertical deflections of the wheel, the more vertically oriented the steeringblock is, the better the front suspension can soak-up bumps without binding.
Decreased ON-power steering OUT of a corner.
Why? When you increase the power coming out of a corner, the weight bias shifts from the front wheels to the rear wheels. The more vertical the caster angle, the less the effective camber change of the wheels, so that ONLY the static camber of the outside wheel is affecting how much the wheels “dig in”. Since the wheels cannot “dig in” effectively, the reduced weight on the front wheels will cause the front to lose traction more easily, causing the car to understeer.
Decreased wheel-centering.
Why? Imagine that the caster angle is vertical. Now imagine that you take hold of the forward edge of a front tire and move it from side-to-side. The wheel deflects an amount proportional to how much you move it with your hand. Vertical caster is highly unstable because there is little in the way of forces to want to keep the wheels pointing straight ahead.
Shallower caster (more laid-back)
Decreased OFF-power steering INTO a corner.
Why? Imagine that the caster angle is so laid-back that it is horizontal (though this would be impossible). Now imagine that you turn the steering; the wheels would not turn to the side anymore, but rather the tops of the wheels would now tilt to the side. The shallower the caster angle, the less the wheels deflect to the side, giving you less turn-in into a corner.
Increased ON-power steering OUT of a corner.
Why? The more laid-back the caster angle, the more effective camber you get when you turn the front wheels. When you increase the power coming out of a corner, the weight bias shifts from the front of the car to the rear. Normally this would cause front to lose traction and understeer. However, since there is more effective camber at more laid-back caster angles, the “tilted” front wheels are more able to “dig” into the corner, allowing the car to resist centrifugal force and giving it a greater amount of control when exiting a corner.
Increased wheel-centering, but decreased straight-line stability.
Why? Imagine that the front wheels of a shopping cart (which have extremely shallow caster). Push the cart forward, and the front wheels will always try to center themselves. The shallower the caster angle, the more the steering is always fighting to get back to center. However (you knew this was coming, right?), the shallower you make the caster angle, the greater the amount of force trying to center the wheels. Eventually the forces become so great that the wheels will start to shimmy, decreasing straight-line stability.
Steeper caster (more vertical)
Increased OFF-power steering INTO a corner.
Why? Imagine that the caster angle is vertical. Now imagine that you turn the steering; the wheels turn to the side. The steeper the caster angle, the more that the wheels deflect to the side, giving you more turn-in into a corner.
Increased suspension efficiency.
Why? The inboard suspension pins are, for the sake of discussion, parallel the chassis (horizontal) which means that the suspension arms move up and down vertically. Now, imagine that the caster angle is vertical, meaning that the top and bottom of the steering “kingpin” is directly aligned with the motion of the suspension arms. And finally, acknowledge that shock absorbers are pretty much horizontally aligned (the top is no further ahead of or behind the bottom), running perpenticular to the long axis of the car. Since bumps in the racing surface cause vertical deflections of the wheel, the more vertically oriented the steeringblock is, the better the front suspension can soak-up bumps without binding.
Decreased ON-power steering OUT of a corner.
Why? When you increase the power coming out of a corner, the weight bias shifts from the front wheels to the rear wheels. The more vertical the caster angle, the less the effective camber change of the wheels, so that ONLY the static camber of the outside wheel is affecting how much the wheels “dig in”. Since the wheels cannot “dig in” effectively, the reduced weight on the front wheels will cause the front to lose traction more easily, causing the car to understeer.
Decreased wheel-centering.
Why? Imagine that the caster angle is vertical. Now imagine that you take hold of the forward edge of a front tire and move it from side-to-side. The wheel deflects an amount proportional to how much you move it with your hand. Vertical caster is highly unstable because there is little in the way of forces to want to keep the wheels pointing straight ahead.
Shallower caster (more laid-back)
Decreased OFF-power steering INTO a corner.
Why? Imagine that the caster angle is so laid-back that it is horizontal (though this would be impossible). Now imagine that you turn the steering; the wheels would not turn to the side anymore, but rather the tops of the wheels would now tilt to the side. The shallower the caster angle, the less the wheels deflect to the side, giving you less turn-in into a corner.
Increased ON-power steering OUT of a corner.
Why? The more laid-back the caster angle, the more effective camber you get when you turn the front wheels. When you increase the power coming out of a corner, the weight bias shifts from the front of the car to the rear. Normally this would cause front to lose traction and understeer. However, since there is more effective camber at more laid-back caster angles, the “tilted” front wheels are more able to “dig” into the corner, allowing the car to resist centrifugal force and giving it a greater amount of control when exiting a corner.
Increased wheel-centering, but decreased straight-line stability.
Why? Imagine that the front wheels of a shopping cart (which have extremely shallow caster). Push the cart forward, and the front wheels will always try to center themselves. The shallower the caster angle, the more the steering is always fighting to get back to center. However (you knew this was coming, right?), the shallower you make the caster angle, the greater the amount of force trying to center the wheels. Eventually the forces become so great that the wheels will start to shimmy, decreasing straight-line stability.
04-27-2011, 11:13 PM
#5979
Tech Elite
iTrader: (10)
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: Norwood, OH...and CCRCR and The OhioRCFactory
Posts: 2,974
Trader Rating: 10 (100%+)
04-27-2011, 11:44 PM
#5980
04-28-2011, 02:29 AM
#5981
I hate being wrong, lucky for me I never admit it.
So, who else loves their 22?
So, who else loves their 22?
04-28-2011, 04:47 AM
#5985
Caster
Regarding all the caster discussions:
Keep in mind that the caster is the total inclination of the king pins. Foe example, you can get 30 deg. caster in two ways, when you use the 20 deg. shim with 10 deg. blocks or the 25 deg. shim with 5 deg. blocks. The kick up is different in both cases but the caster is the same.
To change the caster (without effecting the kick up) you need to only change the blocks without (changing the shim).
Avner.
Keep in mind that the caster is the total inclination of the king pins. Foe example, you can get 30 deg. caster in two ways, when you use the 20 deg. shim with 10 deg. blocks or the 25 deg. shim with 5 deg. blocks. The kick up is different in both cases but the caster is the same.
To change the caster (without effecting the kick up) you need to only change the blocks without (changing the shim).
Avner.