on road nitro a dying breed?
04-16-2012, 03:19 PM
#31
here's a thought
I totaly agree everyone wants to sell you on what they run...usaly some high dollar race machine. and that guy is usaly a racer...a noob(we all been there and its not a cut)is gung ho to buy the flashy popular stuff,most of the time not even needed.and spend all his coin and crash said coin and he's done forever....thats why there is loss of intrest in it. the thing to do is start small and save money run for fun....and go from there....it's not costly unless you make it costly.
04-16-2012, 03:33 PM
#32
I see it growing in my area, not alot but a little.
04-16-2012, 04:54 PM
#33
I believe that there are handful reasons why nitro is dying .
1.There is no longer entry level classes ie:rtr pullstart out of the box and without this class you loose alot of beginner drivers which kills growth in the sport.
2.The cost of not only getting started but racing is way over what it costs to run electric on or off road ,lets say for instance on a normal race day you go through 3 sets of tires at $30 a set $90 + a ltr of fuel at $10 + race fees $10 and that`s not including breakages which are often very expensive.Plus one item no one has mentioned is a tire truer $200-$600 and a power supply to run it so the costs are much higher for the same amount of satisfaction and fun factor.
Noise and environmental issues will only become more of a factor over time.
3.The range of rtr on and off road electric kits is massive and parents with kids can buy a car for $100-$300 on monday and go race on sunday because clubs welcome them and run novice classes for them .
I love nitro on road but i believe it has become to exclusive and costly.Just my opinion.
1.There is no longer entry level classes ie:rtr pullstart out of the box and without this class you loose alot of beginner drivers which kills growth in the sport.
2.The cost of not only getting started but racing is way over what it costs to run electric on or off road ,lets say for instance on a normal race day you go through 3 sets of tires at $30 a set $90 + a ltr of fuel at $10 + race fees $10 and that`s not including breakages which are often very expensive.Plus one item no one has mentioned is a tire truer $200-$600 and a power supply to run it so the costs are much higher for the same amount of satisfaction and fun factor.
Noise and environmental issues will only become more of a factor over time.
3.The range of rtr on and off road electric kits is massive and parents with kids can buy a car for $100-$300 on monday and go race on sunday because clubs welcome them and run novice classes for them .
I love nitro on road but i believe it has become to exclusive and costly.Just my opinion.
04-16-2012, 07:59 PM
#34
I believe the sport is just going thru a cycle.
I came from motorcycle roadracing and I when started that they did not have track days like they do now. You had to know you wanted to go roadracing then, and it cost quite a bit to see if you wanted to start racing.
It has become the same in onroad racing now. No one whats to go to the mall parking lot and drive an onroad car, its dirty and just eats up tires--not to much fun there not to mention its a little pricey.
So you either know someone that has a car that will let you try it or you take the plunge and just do it because you know you want to get into the sport.
Tracks are a problem right now. Its a lot of work to build and maintain one.
The big draw for off road is you can go any place and drive. If you wish to try it, get one and drive in your front yard to see you like it.
On road racing requires a huge commitiment i.e. you have to know you want to be involved.
Just my 2 cents.
Greg Esser
I came from motorcycle roadracing and I when started that they did not have track days like they do now. You had to know you wanted to go roadracing then, and it cost quite a bit to see if you wanted to start racing.
It has become the same in onroad racing now. No one whats to go to the mall parking lot and drive an onroad car, its dirty and just eats up tires--not to much fun there not to mention its a little pricey.
So you either know someone that has a car that will let you try it or you take the plunge and just do it because you know you want to get into the sport.
Tracks are a problem right now. Its a lot of work to build and maintain one.
The big draw for off road is you can go any place and drive. If you wish to try it, get one and drive in your front yard to see you like it.
On road racing requires a huge commitiment i.e. you have to know you want to be involved.
Just my 2 cents.
Greg Esser
04-16-2012, 09:24 PM
#35
To expand on your post, at my LHS this is what a AE B4.1 Worlds buggy cost to get started:
B4.1 kit - $230
Brushless ESC - $160
Brushless motor - $80
Steering Servo - $60
LiPo battery - $70
LiPo charger - $70
Decent DSM Tx/Rx - $100
Total - $770
This is to be somewhat competitive at my club track. You can shave a few bucks here to there on some of the stuff, but this is about average cost.
Now, let us put together that same list for a 200mm onroad nitro (using the Mugen MTX5):
Mugen MTX5 kit - $550
Engine - $400
Servos (2) - $140
Tires - $40 (for a starting set)
Body - $30
Fuel - $25
Glow igniter - $15
Starter box - $70
Rx battery pack - $20
Decent DSM Tx/Rx - $100
Total cost - $1,390
This is the price of almost 2 of the start-up B4.1 Worlds buggy. And, I did not throw in the price of a good tire truer if you go the foam tire route. Again, you can find bargins here and there on the 200mm kit and support equipment and shave some bucks off the total cost. But, when the cost of a 200mm nitro is about the same as an 8th scale offroad buggy and you can race the buggy almost anywhere, what do you think is most cost effective to the average buyer?
If you throw in the cost of a RTR B4.1 or RTR Losi 2.0 buggy and upgrade as your pocket book allows, at least you are in the racing game at a more cost effective manner.
Xray is at least knows of this and offer racer kits (NT1R and T3R) that are similar to their top-of-the-line products but with composite materials in place of the woven graphite. And, both kits are just as competitive as the upscale versions and can be upgraded if a racer chooses. But for every week club racing, they are perfect.
We all know that hobby/sport is not cheap. However, if the industry doesn't see that it is pricing itself out of the reach of the average guy onroad-wise, then onroad will soon be a niche in the overall racing scheme.
B4.1 kit - $230
Brushless ESC - $160
Brushless motor - $80
Steering Servo - $60
LiPo battery - $70
LiPo charger - $70
Decent DSM Tx/Rx - $100
Total - $770
This is to be somewhat competitive at my club track. You can shave a few bucks here to there on some of the stuff, but this is about average cost.
Now, let us put together that same list for a 200mm onroad nitro (using the Mugen MTX5):
Mugen MTX5 kit - $550
Engine - $400
Servos (2) - $140
Tires - $40 (for a starting set)
Body - $30
Fuel - $25
Glow igniter - $15
Starter box - $70
Rx battery pack - $20
Decent DSM Tx/Rx - $100
Total cost - $1,390
This is the price of almost 2 of the start-up B4.1 Worlds buggy. And, I did not throw in the price of a good tire truer if you go the foam tire route. Again, you can find bargins here and there on the 200mm kit and support equipment and shave some bucks off the total cost. But, when the cost of a 200mm nitro is about the same as an 8th scale offroad buggy and you can race the buggy almost anywhere, what do you think is most cost effective to the average buyer?
If you throw in the cost of a RTR B4.1 or RTR Losi 2.0 buggy and upgrade as your pocket book allows, at least you are in the racing game at a more cost effective manner.
Xray is at least knows of this and offer racer kits (NT1R and T3R) that are similar to their top-of-the-line products but with composite materials in place of the woven graphite. And, both kits are just as competitive as the upscale versions and can be upgraded if a racer chooses. But for every week club racing, they are perfect.
We all know that hobby/sport is not cheap. However, if the industry doesn't see that it is pricing itself out of the reach of the average guy onroad-wise, then onroad will soon be a niche in the overall racing scheme.
Nitro on-road is starting to grow in my area, NorCal.
04-16-2012, 10:42 PM
#36
umm hello, ur talking $30 diff betweet the mugen an kyosho. onroad cars don't come with tires to begin with an offroad cars do. onroad cars come with nothing, just a chassie which i think is stupid to begin with....the comparison is onroad which costs almost too much...to....offroad which is half the cost. this is the point being made...i don't have an onroad car because of this. closes i have is my losi L8.
04-16-2012, 10:48 PM
#37
I believe the sport is just going thru a cycle.
I came from motorcycle roadracing and I when started that they did not have track days like they do now. You had to know you wanted to go roadracing then, and it cost quite a bit to see if you wanted to start racing.
It has become the same in onroad racing now. No one whats to go to the mall parking lot and drive an onroad car, its dirty and just eats up tires--not to much fun there not to mention its a little pricey.
So you either know someone that has a car that will let you try it or you take the plunge and just do it because you know you want to get into the sport.
Tracks are a problem right now. Its a lot of work to build and maintain one.
The big draw for off road is you can go any place and drive. If you wish to try it, get one and drive in your front yard to see you like it.
On road racing requires a huge commitiment i.e. you have to know you want to be involved.
Just my 2 cents.
Greg Esser
I came from motorcycle roadracing and I when started that they did not have track days like they do now. You had to know you wanted to go roadracing then, and it cost quite a bit to see if you wanted to start racing.
It has become the same in onroad racing now. No one whats to go to the mall parking lot and drive an onroad car, its dirty and just eats up tires--not to much fun there not to mention its a little pricey.
So you either know someone that has a car that will let you try it or you take the plunge and just do it because you know you want to get into the sport.
Tracks are a problem right now. Its a lot of work to build and maintain one.
The big draw for off road is you can go any place and drive. If you wish to try it, get one and drive in your front yard to see you like it.
On road racing requires a huge commitiment i.e. you have to know you want to be involved.
Just my 2 cents.
Greg Esser
04-17-2012, 02:22 AM
#38
I believe that there are handful reasons why nitro is dying .
1.There is no longer entry level classes ie:rtr pullstart out of the box and without this class you loose alot of beginner drivers which kills growth in the sport.
2.The cost of not only getting started but racing is way over what it costs to run electric on or off road ,lets say for instance on a normal race day you go through 3 sets of tires at $30 a set $90 + a ltr of fuel at $10 + race fees $10 and that`s not including breakages which are often very expensive.Plus one item no one has mentioned is a tire truer $200-$600 and a power supply to run it so the costs are much higher for the same amount of satisfaction and fun factor.
Noise and environmental issues will only become more of a factor over time.
3.The range of rtr on and off road electric kits is massive and parents with kids can buy a car for $100-$300 on monday and go race on sunday because clubs welcome them and run novice classes for them .
I love nitro on road but i believe it has become to exclusive and costly.Just my opinion.
1.There is no longer entry level classes ie:rtr pullstart out of the box and without this class you loose alot of beginner drivers which kills growth in the sport.
2.The cost of not only getting started but racing is way over what it costs to run electric on or off road ,lets say for instance on a normal race day you go through 3 sets of tires at $30 a set $90 + a ltr of fuel at $10 + race fees $10 and that`s not including breakages which are often very expensive.Plus one item no one has mentioned is a tire truer $200-$600 and a power supply to run it so the costs are much higher for the same amount of satisfaction and fun factor.
Noise and environmental issues will only become more of a factor over time.
3.The range of rtr on and off road electric kits is massive and parents with kids can buy a car for $100-$300 on monday and go race on sunday because clubs welcome them and run novice classes for them .
I love nitro on road but i believe it has become to exclusive and costly.Just my opinion.
2) As mentioned before, you can make it expensive as you want. A tire truer can be borrowed, ATS is now selling pre-trued tires but you can also start with the size out of the box. Ever seen the prices of Electric rubber tires? With the price of one set rubbers you can have 2 or even 3 sets of foam tires. And yes, nitro is expensive but make a prediction about using several fresh batteries a season, a high level electric racer is using many a year as with the motors also.
3) with this quote:
Again, yo can make it expensive as you want. What is wrong with getting an older model which mostly are dumped for about half the prices? Or what is wrong with for example the Xray NT1R which is very affordable and has the same performance? Do you realy need a 400 dollar engine? I do think most starters can make a good start with a 200 dollar engine also. With the 1/8 I even think the Edam Exer RTR for just 600 dollar is a good car to start with.
04-17-2012, 06:26 AM
#39
Tech Addict
On-road is alive and well in the Mid -Atlantic, eastcoast, and Southeastern region of the US. Make your way to Blue Diamond in Del. or one of the many tracks in Florida.
04-17-2012, 08:25 AM
#40
Tech Rookie
I don't post; I am not a noob, but I am glad to see the question being asked and the dialogue it has elicited! I have been trying to drum up interest in nitro on-road with little or no success (mostly none). Between the cost, the ease of electric, the plain flat-out amount of work and commitment required for nitro, most people opt for easy. Everyone is entitled to their opinion. But I leave you all with a quote from my 11 year old who said it best:
"Dad, I like nitro cuz it goes just as fast whether the tank is full or there is just one drop of gas left". Can't argue with that.
"Dad, I like nitro cuz it goes just as fast whether the tank is full or there is just one drop of gas left". Can't argue with that.
04-17-2012, 08:28 AM
#41
Tech Rookie
Oh, and I should add the other saying around here that fits:
If it was easy, everyone would be doing it"
If it was easy, everyone would be doing it"
04-17-2012, 09:15 AM
#42
umm hello, ur talking $30 diff betweet the mugen an kyosho. onroad cars don't come with tires to begin with an offroad cars do. onroad cars come with nothing, just a chassie which i think is stupid to begin with....the comparison is onroad which costs almost too much...to....offroad which is half the cost. this is the point being made...i don't have an onroad car because of this. closes i have is my losi L8.
I agree, Nitro onroad is more expensive than Elec. offroad. But I don't think it's the reason more people don't do it. Nitro is not an entry level class by any means. 1/10 offroad is more newb friendly for sure.
04-17-2012, 09:32 AM
#43
This thread should be closed off.
It will end up us debating between Nitro vs Electric, or On Road vs Off Road,
To first starter of this thread ; if you cannot afford to play on road nitro, you should go play something else...... go play barbie or lego.
It will end up us debating between Nitro vs Electric, or On Road vs Off Road,
To first starter of this thread ; if you cannot afford to play on road nitro, you should go play something else...... go play barbie or lego.
04-17-2012, 11:36 AM
#45
so your dumb ass thinks you can only play if you have money?.....take that silver spoon from your mouth and put in the other end bro....its no wonder people give up on this hooby,It's people like you.in just the last year I've given anway 4 RC's to people who could not aford them due to the economy.does your full pocket make you better than others?........I think not.....God bless you.