Originally Posted by T-BODZ Terry B.
(Post 6537358)
WOW! You just brought back some not so fond flashbacks of my 2WD Thorp and RC300BD Pan Cars with
Greenwood Corvette, Lancia Stratos or Ligier-Matra GT Bodies! A huge difference in handling from the Lola & Elfin CanAm bodies at the time. I remember 1 season in the very early 80's that they had a GT race out at the Ranch Pit Stop in Pomona, CA & Outlaw RC in San Bernardino, CA every month. What a struggle! |
Originally Posted by T-BODZ Terry B.
(Post 6537358)
WOW! You just brought back some not so fond flashbacks of my 2WD Thorp and RC300BD Pan Cars with
Greenwood Corvette, Lancia Stratos or Ligier-Matra GT Bodies! A huge difference in handling from the Lola & Elfin CanAm bodies at the time. I remember 1 season in the very early 80's that they had a GT race out at the Ranch Pit Stop in Pomona, CA & Outlaw RC in San Bernardino, CA every month. What a struggle! |
Originally Posted by 1/8 oldschool
(Post 6537446)
I too remember the days of GT bodies on my MARKER MACHINE and DELTA Super J ( still own both and they still run ) and I would have to agree they weren't great fun , but my god they looked COOL !
large boxes of stuff from California 4 years ago. It was all sitting in our storage unit. Off the top of my head I still have the following cars: 1 RC200 Built / Run 1 RC250 Built / Run 2 RC300 Ball Diff Cars Built / Brand New Never Run with New K&B's each. 3 RC500 2WD Built / Run 2 RC500 2WD Built / Brand New Never Run 1 RC500 2WD Unbuilt / New in Box The rest are RC500 4WD, 4WD Conversion Kits and a Ton Of Parts, Pipes, Carbs, etc... I'll take a few snap shots later and post'em. I even have 1 with a Greenwood body and another with a Nissan GTP. I love the old vintage stuff .. cool to look at and appreciate how much the hobby has evolved. Take care! Terry |
Originally Posted by T-BODZ Terry B.
(Post 6537545)
I actually have a ton of old vintage 1/8 cars left over. My Father sent me several
large boxes of stuff from California 4 years ago. It was all sitting in our storage unit. Off the top of my head I still have the following cars: 1 RC200 Built / Run 1 RC250 Built / Run 2 RC300 Ball Diff Cars Built / Brand New Never Run with New K&B's each. 3 RC500 2WD Built / Run 2 RC500 2WD Built / Brand New Never Run 1 RC500 2WD Unbuilt / New in Box The rest are RC500 4WD, 4WD Conversion Kits and a Ton Of Parts, Pipes, Carbs, etc... I'll take a few snap shots later and post'em. I even have 1 with a Greenwood body and another with a Nissan GTP. I love the old vintage stuff .. cool to look at and appreciate how much the hobby has evolved. Take care! Terry This is not "YOUR FATHER'S OLDSMOBILE" eh......Associated RC-300! These are much better than the old Pan cars. I also still have some of my pan car stuff from "In the day". I have a new in-box Delta Super J. I did run an occasional Greenwood Vette GT body, also Kansas City used to have an annual fall Indy/Formula I body race on the old pan cars which was great fun, but we never ran a sedan body! The GT cars handled bad enough when compared to a can-am body. See you at the Gulf Coast Grand Prix, Dale See you at the Gulf Coast Grandprix, |
I think it would be mistake to run them without lola style bodies.
It is the same problem igt cars have..handle like box of rocks. Why install bodies that will make the car hadle worse? Especially for a newbie and again they look like cars in open class. Same reason they never run gt bodies on 1/12...they dont work and 2wd pancar is just a giant nitro 1/12. |
Originally Posted by motojon
(Post 6537131)
Im guessing though here in the US if i can just add a $50 part and run it on my original chassis great...... If the class doesnt take off then im out $50 with a small paper weight. If I spend $400+ and the class doesnt take off then i got a slightly bigger more expensive paper weight. Also simple goes only so far eventually we want more of this or more of that to get them to handle here in the US. Alot of our tracks arent smooth like oversees so a full suspension 2wd might be the only thing that will work here for example the old Vector....i believe $500 for 2wd $550 for 4wd if you got tired of one you could run the other and keep all the same stuff and use the left overs off of the 4wd people
|
Secondly getting any type of rear ball diff mass produced of retro fitted is going to be a ton of work.
No one really makes a 1/8 onroad ball/gear diff. You would have to retro fit one from a 200mm or offroad car...not fun unless you have a milling machine in your garage..and at that point you could build a simple complete 2wd conversion for say a mrx4x with fiberglass chassis. |
Originally Posted by senna555
(Post 6537951)
I think it would be mistake to run them without lola style bodies.
It is the same problem igt cars have..handle like box of rocks. Why install bodies that will make the car hadle worse? Especially for a newbie and again they look like cars in open class. Same reason they never run gt bodies on 1/12...they dont work and 2wd pancar is just a giant nitro 1/12. Like I said, it is just an idea guys but first, you have to let go of "how it use to be". These newer cars are designed better and probably handle better that their predecessors. Also, lexan bodies are designed and molded better than they were "back in the day". It is like this: many of you drive Hondas and Toyotas now. Well, back in the late 60s and early 70s when they were introduced to the US markets, they were little tin pieces (if you remember back that far). Well, they are not that way now due to progress. Using your lines of thinking about 1/8th scale touring, then the Hondas and Toyotas of today are still the like the little tin pieces from the 60s/70s that aren't worth owning or driving right? At some point, they improved and were worthy of consideration for purchase/ownership right? |
I dont think my point on the igt was clear.
I am sure with tinkering anything will work...the appeal of the class would be simplicity. The pancars are pretty simple and not alot of adjustment. This would be a better start for a newbie or budget racers. Same thing goes for the body....by running lola style body you already have max grip and steering. Much easier for a newbie/budget racer as you dont have to try to create grip thru other adjustments. I ran gt car for a friend to break it in and attempt to improve handling...it ran the same with and without the body. I dont think the body has much of an effect on handling...that is not the case with a lola style body on a pancar electric or nitro...big difference in rear grip and balance. On an unprep surface parking lot temp track I am sure they are a blast and great fun..however on a super clean,smooth,treated surface novelty tends to wear off quickly. I think this is why the class has not really caught on at the two permanent onroad tracks in northeast. |
Originally Posted by senna555
(Post 6537951)
I think it would be mistake to run them without lola style bodies.
It is the same problem igt cars have..handle like box of rocks. Why install bodies that will make the car hadle worse? Especially for a newbie and again they look like cars in open class. Same reason they never run gt bodies on 1/12...they dont work and 2wd pancar is just a giant nitro 1/12. senna dude, in the past I’ve read you bad talking GT cars, racers & racing in general on these threads. Since you are someone that represents your track facility in Conn, maybe you should be more careful about your chosen words regarding GT class cars if you ever want to see your track enjoy on the growth of the class. You know that I sent you a “PM” on this before, remember……….. Here are a few reasons from racers from different countries that should help you should re-think how you talk about GT cars in the future: Ipanema Sports 2010 GT World Championships at Homestead Miami Speedway Florida It's almost a sold-out show, all GT2 Spec class pre-entry spots are filled and the race isn’t until next March! GT1 Open Class 1. Juan Tejero GT1 Open Peru 2. Michael Haley GT1 Open USA 3. Deshun Dash GT1 Open USA 4. Todd Satkunas GT1 Open USA 5. Jose Baquero GT1 Open Venezuela 6. Salvatore Sortino GT1 Open Venezuela 7. Paul Roberts GT1 Open USA 8. Jeff Vargas GT1 Open USA 9. Partricio Concha GT1 Open Chile 10. Tim Phanidasak GT1 Open USA 11. Romulo Arcia GT1 Open Venezuela 12. Steve Miles GT1 Open USA 13. Jeff Green GT1 Open USA 14. Juan Luis Larrabure GT1 Open Peru 15. Miguel Daumont GT1 Open Puerto Rico 16. Eduardo Aparo Rizzi GT1 Open Venezuela 17. Tori Santiago GT1 Open Puerto Rico 18. Tommy Bond GT1 Open USA 19. Gus Wood GT1 Open USA 20. Luis Pineda GT1 Open Mexico 21. Ronnie Setser GT1 Open USA 22. Mark Borchert GT1 Open USA 23. Luis Ramos GT1 Open Puerto Rico 24. Andy Liu GT1 Open USA 25. Augusto Buchholtz GT1 Open Chile 26. Pablo Riveros GT1 Open Chile 27. Reinaldo Gil GT1 Open Chile 28. Rodrigo Cartergianni GT1 Open Chile 29. Jaime E. Negron GT1 Open Puerto Rico 30. Fernando Requejo GT1 Open Venezuela 31. Diron West GT1 Open USA 32. Eggie Betancourt GT1 Open Puerto Rico 33. Demonte Thornton GT1 Open USA 34. Joerg Schaedler GT1 Open Mexico 35. Todd Marshall GT1 Open USA 36. Edwin Ortiz GT1 Open Puerto Rico Only 14 spots left in GT1 Open GT2 Spec Class 1. Carl Edwards GT2 Spec USA 2. Juan Tejero GT2 Spec Peru 3. Juan Luis Larrabure GT2 Spec Peru 4. Todd Satkunas GT2 Spec USA 5. Marcus Vinicius da Silva GT2 Spec Brazil 6. Rich Esposito GT2 Spec USA 7. Juan Blaylock GT2 Spec USA 8. Fritz Adolph GT2 Spec USA 9. Mike Lyday GT2 Spec USA 10. Bernie Hoogstra GT2 Spec USA 11. David Mathews GT2 Spec USA 12. Juan Aramburo GT2 Spec Mexico 13. Juan Aramburo Jr. GT2 Spec Mexico 14. Josue Escamilla GT2 Spec Mexico 15. Erick Garcia GT2 Spec Mexico 16. David Ortiz GT2 Spec Mexico 17. Paul Roberts GT2 Spec USA 18. Tim Phanidasak GT2 Spec USA 19. Cuauhtemoc Medal Medellin GT2 Spec Mexico 20. Omar Horta GT2 Spec Mexico 21. Miguel Lopez Alcala GT2 Spec Mexico 22, Joerg Schaedler GT2 Spec Mexico 23. Kyle Green GT2 Spec USA 24. Eduardo Martinez GT2 Spec Mexico 25. Alferatt Vidal Repetto GT2 Spec Peru 26. Victor Babani GT2 Spec Mexico 27. Hector Suarez GT2 Spec Mexico 28. Charro Rivas GT2 Spec Mexico 29. Partricio Concha GT2 Spec Chile 30. Raul Rivera GT2 Spec Mexico 31. Rafael Chapa GT2 Spec Mexico 32. Antonio Lorca GT2 Spec Mexico 33. Gerardo Sanchez GT2 Spec Mexico 34. Luis Pineda GT2 Spec Mexico 35. Gus Wood GT2 Spec USA 36. Ronnie Setser GT2 Spec USA 37. Steve Nguyen GT2 Spec USA 38. Gary Strainer GT2 Spec USA 39. Abel Elizondo GT2 Spec Mexico 40. Guillermo Cadena GT2 Spec Mexico 41. Jeff Green GT2 Spec USA 42. Michael Frazier GT2 Spec USA 43. Diego Belmonte GT2 Spec Mexico 44. Juan Guillermo Garcia Pantoja GT2 Spec Mexico 45. Jose Luis Garcia Dominguez GT2 Spec Mexico 46. Sandro Diez GT2 Spec Peru 47. Todd Marshall GT2 Spec USA 48. Todd Forcione GT2 Spec USA 49. Steven Jackson GT2 Spec USA 50. Erick Nunez GT2 Spec Mexico GT2 Spec is sold-out, all 50 pre-entry spots are filled! We will be accepting GT2 waiting list entries for any openings or racer cancellations A total of 86 GT race cars registered make a great group picture for R/C Car magazine! .... is it March yet!!! www.gtworldchampionships.com I now return you to your great 1/8 pan car thread:) |
Originally Posted by senna555
(Post 6538158)
I dont think my point on the igt was clear.
I am sure with tinkering anything will work...the appeal of the class would be simplicity. The pancars are pretty simple and not alot of adjustment. This would be a better start for a newbie or budget racers. Same thing goes for the body....by running lola style body you already have max grip and steering. Much easier for a newbie/budget racer as you dont have to try to create grip thru other adjustments. I ran gt car for a friend to break it in and attempt to improve handling...it ran the same with and without the body. I dont think the body has much of an effect on handling...that is not the case with a lola style body on a pancar electric or nitro...big difference in rear grip and balance. On an unprep surface parking lot temp track I am sure they are a blast and great fun..however on a super clean,smooth,treated surface novelty tends to wear off quickly. I think this is why the class has not really caught on at the two permanent onroad tracks in northeast. Now, back to the topic, why not think outside the box a little? Why not have a little variety instead of "being like the established class"? If you want to run a lola body, you already have 4wd. Like I said, it is just an idea for consideration, not something that "has to be done". Dude, I like the idea of having a 2wd class of 1/8th scales, I would just like it to be a bit different from the established class (4wd). |
No one really runs this class in the area.
Your opinion in noted but I dont agree...and honestly dont really care. If you have a thousand people that show up at your race that is great. Very few people run this class in the area. I am sure you have a thriving group of racers that really enjoy this class...that is great it. Enjoy it keep it going. It has not caught on in area and I have no interest in trying to help build this class as I dont think it is a good solution for getting new racers to the track. It needs to be something similar to a traxxas slash extremely simple..cheap...slow....but resembles other racing cars at an event. My idea behind the thread is to get new people at the track...to buy a ready to run, modify the heck out of it, put a big horsepower engine and your back to cost of a 200mm or 1/8 and it becomes really complex and guess what...no new racers. Please Please Please Please Please Please Please Please with all due respect get over it and move on I am sure your time is better spent in other areas. |
I have never raced an IGT car but I did drive one and it drove very well. Not as responsive as I would like but very easy to drive for a noob and I'm sure a stiffer set-up would get the responsiveness I would want. I have also seen some that looked like a nightmare to drive. Just like anything else, it's all in the set-up.
|
Originally Posted by senna555
(Post 6538267)
No one really runs this class in the area.
Your opinion in noted but I dont agree...and honestly dont really care. If you have a thousand people that show up at your race that is great. Very few people run this class in the area. I am sure you have a thriving group of racers that really enjoy this class...that is great it. Enjoy it keep it going. It has not caught on in area and I have no interest in trying to help build this class as I dont think it is a good solution for getting new racers to the track. It needs to be something similar to a traxxas slash extremely simple..cheap...slow. My idea behind the thread is to get new people at the track...to buy a ready to run, modify the heck out of it, put a big horsepower engine and your back to cost of a 200mm or 1/8 and it becomes really complex and guess what...no new racers. Please Please Please Please Please Please Please Please with all due respect get over it and move on I am sure your time is better spent in other areas. But know this..... You have just told all GT racers from around the world that your track doesn't care about them and our class. Thanks for your wishes of good luck, but luck doesn'e have anything to do with the growth your track will not experence until you learn to keep you negative thoughts to yourself.:lol: |
Yawn.
|
Another thing to note on the keeping it simple angle is that the 2wd pan cars, to the best of my knowledge, all use a single speed tranny, and off road type clutch systems, which are much easier to adjust and maintain.
As far as the GT discussion goes, the cars can work quite well or quite poorly, depending on tires, setup, and quality of assembly. I have seen both ends of the spectrum. I think this thread is on the right track with the 2wd pan car discussion, perhaps the GT discussion should relocate to a GT thread. |
I will say this much. I do think GT is ultimately doomed. Not right now. Right now it seems like a great class. It will be doomed the day someone like Serpent or Mugen decides to build a full blown race car just for the class instead of a revamped buggy. Then it will be just as expensive, demanding and difficult as 1/8th so why bother.
|
Originally Posted by garen
(Post 6538310)
As far as the GT discussion goes, the cars can work quite well or quite poorly, depending on tires, setup, and quality of assembly. I have seen both ends of the spectrum. I think this thread is on the right track with the 2wd pan car discussion, perhaps the GT discussion should relocate to a GT thread.
Just so we all understand that whenever senna or anyone tries to bad talk GT they understand I will be there to set them straight on any thread. yo senna, yawn all you want, when the GT race is 100+ strong, remember what your track's turn-outs have been all year long.:lol::lol: |
Personally im SOOOOOOOOO down for a 2wd class, but i do like the adjustability of 4wd, for me its fun to try set-ups and expirement, agrevating at times yes but still fun, cheap or inexpesive will only last as long as you stop wanting to go faster
|
Originally Posted by senna555
(Post 6538158)
I dont think my point on the igt was clear.
I am sure with tinkering anything will work...the appeal of the class would be simplicity. The pancars are pretty simple and not alot of adjustment. This would be a better start for a newbie or budget racers. Same thing goes for the body....by running lola style body you already have max grip and steering. Much easier for a newbie/budget racer as you dont have to try to create grip thru other adjustments. I ran gt car for a friend to break it in and attempt to improve handling...it ran the same with and without the body. I dont think the body has much of an effect on handling...that is not the case with a lola style body on a pancar electric or nitro...big difference in rear grip and balance. On an unprep surface parking lot temp track I am sure they are a blast and great fun..however on a super clean,smooth,treated surface novelty tends to wear off quickly. I think this is why the class has not really caught on at the two permanent onroad tracks in northeast. |
Originally Posted by senna555
(Post 6538299)
Yawn.
|
3 Attachment(s)
Originally Posted by wingracer
(Post 6538317)
I will say this much. I do think GT is ultimately doomed. Not right now. Right now it seems like a great class. It will be doomed the day someone like Serpent or Mugen decides to build a full blown race car just for the class instead of a revamped buggy. Then it will be just as expensive, demanding and difficult as 1/8th so why bother.
Boy that sure is a nice track:D |
Looks like a rally car. How long before someone imports one to the states for GT use?
|
I should try the yellow helmet..works for hamilton and senna...maybe it will work for rc...real question is what color visor..i am thinking amber!
Cheers and especially to the gt racers enjoy your race and good luck. Jamie Gonzalez |
Amber for low light/night.
Grey or bronze tint for bright sun light. :D |
word!
|
Originally Posted by wingracer
(Post 6538317)
I will say this much. I do think GT is ultimately doomed. Not right now. Right now it seems like a great class. It will be doomed the day someone like Serpent or Mugen decides to build a full blown race car just for the class instead of a revamped buggy. Then it will be just as expensive, demanding and difficult as 1/8th so why bother.
|
smh yall too much!
|
Originally Posted by senna555
(Post 6538402)
Too late to....already being done overseas...it is an 1/8 car with sedan tires.
Boy that sure is a nice track:D |
Exactly speedy. This is how any new class goes. It's great in the beginning because the cars are cheap and simple, you don't need big HP because the handling and driving isn't quite world class yet and noobs can be competitive because everyone is a noob. But as soon as the class gets enough participation to attract the big dog manufacturers, you will see them make cars for the class and have drivers like Swauger, Burch an Paolo to deal with. Not quite as much fun for the noob anymore. Just look at 1/10th TC. Used to be noobs running HPI's all blinged out and having a blast, now it's all about worlds level competition and most of those HPI guys are gone or running Slashes instead.
So what does this mean for 2wd pan cars? Well, 1/12th scale has been around from the start and shows no sign of dying. Why? Cheap, simple, low maintenance racing fun with stable rules that don't allow any more technical complexity to creep in. Ten year old cars are still capable of winning major races. GT has all that except for the prohibitions on further tech. So I see 2wd pan cars as a potentially better option for an easy entry level nitro class. Right now GT may be just as good and appealing for that purpose but that will most likely change eventually. |
Originally Posted by *1speedy
(Post 6538510)
LMAO you did a frantic google search for these cars after you shot your mouth off they have been out for at least 2 years now. These cars are not part of the GT class
|
Search Rally Game been out for years overseas and surprisingly not that popular...go figure...however redrc has some neat info.
http://www.redrc.net/2008/12/bmt-081...is/#more-12959 Same thing happened in offroad...whatever happened to that monster truck class...oh yeah it is called truggy...full out 1/8 car with bigger tires and more aero body. Amber visor is the way to go. |
Originally Posted by wingracer
(Post 6538553)
Exactly speedy. This is how any new class goes. It's great in the beginning because the cars are cheap and simple, you don't need big HP because the handling and driving isn't quite world class yet and noobs can be competitive because everyone is a noob. But as soon as the class gets enough participation to attract the big dog manufacturers, you will see them make cars for the class and have drivers like Swauger, Burch an Paolo to deal with. Not quite as much fun for the noob anymore. Just look at 1/10th TC. Used to be noobs running HPI's all blinged out and having a blast, now it's all about worlds level competition and most of those HPI guys are gone or running Slashes instead.
So what does this mean for 2wd pan cars? Well, 1/12th scale has been around from the start and shows no sign of dying. Why? Cheap, simple, low maintenance racing fun with stable rules that don't allow any more technical complexity to creep in. Ten year old cars are still capable of winning major races. GT has all that except for the prohibitions on further tech. So I see 2wd pan cars as a potentially better option for an easy entry level nitro class. Right now GT may be just as good and appealing for that purpose but that will most likely change eventually. |
Actually…. Belt-Drive “Rally-Game” type cars have been around for a while, not new to us GT racers at all.
They’re very cool cars that deserve their own category. More like a single speed 1/8 scale with big rubber tires, as GT racing grows they’ll be another class in “shaft drive” GT “rubber tire racing events. What ever "Rally-Game" racers have done & do, has nothing the do with North American style GT racing. "Pro" drivers have to race with the same stuff as us "newbies" do, maybe we'll see how good they really are too. But............ we should really move this to the GT thread if you want to learn more about GT racing, for respect for the 1/8 Pan-Car racers. If the Pan-Car" class does grow, I might want to race in it too and if by chance it wishes to try racing with rubber tires; Ipanema might help support it too.:nod::tire::) |
Originally Posted by wingracer
(Post 6538553)
Exactly speedy. This is how any new class goes. It's great in the beginning because the cars are cheap and simple, you don't need big HP because the handling and driving isn't quite world class yet and noobs can be competitive because everyone is a noob. But as soon as the class gets enough participation to attract the big dog manufacturers, you will see them make cars for the class and have drivers like Swauger, Burch an Paolo to deal with. Not quite as much fun for the noob anymore. Just look at 1/10th TC. Used to be noobs running HPI's all blinged out and having a blast, now it's all about worlds level competition.
So what does this mean for 2wd pan cars? Well, 1/12th scale has been around from the start and shows no sign of dying. Why? Cheap, simple, low maintenance racing fun with stable rules that don't allow any more technical complexity to creep in. Ten year old cars are still capable of winning major races. GT has all that except for the prohibitions on further tech. So I see 2wd pan cars as a potentially better option for an easy entry level nitro class. Right now GT may be just as good and appealing for that purpose but that will most likely change eventually. |
Originally Posted by senna555
(Post 6538584)
Search Rally Game been out for years overseas and surprisingly not that popular...go figure...however redrc has some neat info.
http://www.redrc.net/2008/12/bmt-081...is/#more-12959 Same thing happened in offroad...whatever happened to that monster truck class...oh yeah it is called truggy...full out 1/8 car with bigger tires and more aero body. Amber visor is the way to go. |
Originally Posted by Jspeed
(Post 6538615)
"Pro" drivers have to race with the same stuff as us "newbies" do, maybe we'll see how good they really are too. |
Originally Posted by wingracer
(Post 6538558)
Is that because they are illegal or just because no one has showed up with one yet?
|
Originally Posted by wingracer
(Post 6538553)
Exactly speedy. This is how any new class goes. It's great in the beginning because the cars are cheap and simple, you don't need big HP because the handling and driving isn't quite world class yet and noobs can be competitive because everyone is a noob. But as soon as the class gets enough participation to attract the big dog manufacturers, you will see them make cars for the class and have drivers like Swauger, Burch an Paolo to deal with. Not quite as much fun for the noob anymore. Just look at 1/10th TC. Used to be noobs running HPI's all blinged out and having a blast, now it's all about worlds level competition and most of those HPI guys are gone or running Slashes instead.
So what does this mean for 2wd pan cars? Well, 1/12th scale has been around from the start and shows no sign of dying. Why? Cheap, simple, low maintenance racing fun with stable rules that don't allow any more technical complexity to creep in. Ten year old cars are still capable of winning major races. GT has all that except for the prohibitions on further tech. So I see 2wd pan cars as a potentially better option for an easy entry level nitro class. Right now GT may be just as good and appealing for that purpose but that will most likely change eventually. Speedy, I appreciate what you are saying about the GT class, however look at the topic of this thread. It does'nt say anything about the GT class. This thread was started to discuss The "1/8th scale pan car class" . I sure did not say anything about the GT class. If the GT class is your passion and you have a successful program at your track, thats great, I wish you well. Senna 555 got his say and you got your say. enough is enough with the insults. Now, can we please get back to thread topic? If you would like to stick around and discuss the topic, you are welcome. Dale:) |
Originally Posted by wingracer
(Post 6538707)
Believe me, you will and they are. :D
Pan-Car guys.... senna opened his "pie-hole" trashing the GT cars and your thread went south....... I wish you guys all the best with the new class, once you get it rolling, don't let anyone trash talk what your doing and it will grow well too. |
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