MTX 5
06-06-2012, 05:17 AM
#2161
Hey guys this are my thoughts on mugen with MTX5.
Firstly mugen have designed the MTX5 as a winning world championship car, for the professional racers not for the people who drive on club days. Which is a shame because most of the long awaited customers who have being waiting for a car for almost 5 years to find problems.
Well what do i say to mugen well shame on you.
I hope mugen attend this problems because this is a very fast car. But not as fast as a Capricorn
Firstly mugen have designed the MTX5 as a winning world championship car, for the professional racers not for the people who drive on club days. Which is a shame because most of the long awaited customers who have being waiting for a car for almost 5 years to find problems.
Well what do i say to mugen well shame on you.
I hope mugen attend this problems because this is a very fast car. But not as fast as a Capricorn
06-06-2012, 08:22 AM
#2163
Tech Regular
06-06-2012, 10:19 PM
#2164
Has anyone with a five used the new Xceed starter box with it?, I like the new box but it's wider than anything else on the market, and the Mugens flywheel is a lot closer to the centerline now, meaning you end up with a rear wheel rubbing on some bump boxes already.
Edit: Does not look good, I found a top down pic of the Xceed box, enough to make a paper template, it's like 10mm+ too wide, wheel is not close enough to the centerline of the box, MTX5 really has the flywheel a long way in, it's one of those things I noticed on the original CAD pics, and wondered how it would effect use on some starter boxes (On my current generic box the back wheel already rubs).
Edit: Does not look good, I found a top down pic of the Xceed box, enough to make a paper template, it's like 10mm+ too wide, wheel is not close enough to the centerline of the box, MTX5 really has the flywheel a long way in, it's one of those things I noticed on the original CAD pics, and wondered how it would effect use on some starter boxes (On my current generic box the back wheel already rubs).
Last edited by Bishop; 06-07-2012 at 01:26 AM.
06-06-2012, 11:33 PM
#2165
Using Knack racing one now is excellent better than original
Got it from pro shop futaba
06-07-2012, 01:12 AM
#2166
06-07-2012, 01:58 AM
#2167
Tech Fanatic
we tried arena at easter lasted only a couple of runs before it bent so we put brace back on for rest of titles
greg
greg
06-07-2012, 03:34 AM
#2168
Hey guys this are my thoughts on mugen with MTX5.
Firstly mugen have designed the MTX5 as a winning world championship car, for the professional racers not for the people who drive on club days. Which is a shame because most of the long awaited customers who have being waiting for a car for almost 5 years to find problems.
Well what do i say to mugen well shame on you.
I hope mugen attend this problems because this is a very fast car. But not as fast as a Capricorn
Firstly mugen have designed the MTX5 as a winning world championship car, for the professional racers not for the people who drive on club days. Which is a shame because most of the long awaited customers who have being waiting for a car for almost 5 years to find problems.
Well what do i say to mugen well shame on you.
I hope mugen attend this problems because this is a very fast car. But not as fast as a Capricorn
Let me tell you when you do get it right this car is very fast and very satisfying.
I have raced it 4 times and got 2 stripped gears a first and a second. Not a bad record for a has been LOL. Joel Il let you have a drive of mine next meeting if you really want.
06-07-2012, 04:12 AM
#2169
Tech Fanatic
hi my grandson has run the mtx5 for a ages now and we have striped 2 gears /out of alignment 1 chase and a couple of diffs ran about 250 laps at easter/sydney with no trouble/had trouble in semi /diff do not no prob yet have not looked yet he is p//s of at the moment diff went really tight /steel/new but car is really good most of time
06-07-2012, 02:29 PM
#2170
race report copied off red r/c
The Circuit Lamberto Collari in Cassino was the host last weekend to top drivers from across Europe including Pietsch, Wischnewski, Spataro, Balestri, Tironi and others, as they took the opportunity to test ahead of August’s 1/10th 200mm Euros on the same track. Qualifying was dominated by KM driver Dario Balestri followed by another Italian driver Biagio Spataro in 2nd while reigning 1/8th scale World Champion Robert Pietsch was 3rd. On Sunday the two semi-finals were won by Serpent driver Alessio Mazzeo and Xray driver Dirk Wischnewski while problems for Pietsch, Spataro and Balestri in the semis meant they failed to make the final. After an initial battle in the main final between Mazzeo and Wischnewski, it was the Max powered Serpent 747 of Mazzeo that took the win followed by Francesco Tironi (Capricorn) in 2nd and Claudio Culoma (Xray) 3rd
So did he have a problem with stripped gear that only some of us are having problems with ?
and now they admitted there is a problem how long before they admit
and fix the brake issue only some of us are having or will stay silent on this to. I wonder when mugen will come on rc tech and tell us how to fix these issues or let us know they are working on them? or will mugen just put there heads back in sand and not worry about the sales that these issues are costing them.
The Circuit Lamberto Collari in Cassino was the host last weekend to top drivers from across Europe including Pietsch, Wischnewski, Spataro, Balestri, Tironi and others, as they took the opportunity to test ahead of August’s 1/10th 200mm Euros on the same track. Qualifying was dominated by KM driver Dario Balestri followed by another Italian driver Biagio Spataro in 2nd while reigning 1/8th scale World Champion Robert Pietsch was 3rd. On Sunday the two semi-finals were won by Serpent driver Alessio Mazzeo and Xray driver Dirk Wischnewski while problems for Pietsch, Spataro and Balestri in the semis meant they failed to make the final. After an initial battle in the main final between Mazzeo and Wischnewski, it was the Max powered Serpent 747 of Mazzeo that took the win followed by Francesco Tironi (Capricorn) in 2nd and Claudio Culoma (Xray) 3rd
So did he have a problem with stripped gear that only some of us are having problems with ?
and now they admitted there is a problem how long before they admit
and fix the brake issue only some of us are having or will stay silent on this to. I wonder when mugen will come on rc tech and tell us how to fix these issues or let us know they are working on them? or will mugen just put there heads back in sand and not worry about the sales that these issues are costing them.
06-08-2012, 10:09 AM
#2171
Hello.
I was at Cassino for the 2012 European warm-up with my mtx5.
My purpose was not competition but absolutely do, for my own satisfaction, to experiment with mtx5.
no problem crowns or friction (with game strain-bell 0.65) in that game 2 broken crowns.
the big problem, which is not easy to solve, is in the bending of the frame when braking.
I had to change the frame, was a real banana.
if they can solve this problem without affecting the current structure of the machine (such as a brake type sheperd). the machine will be very competitive.
:-)
I was at Cassino for the 2012 European warm-up with my mtx5.
My purpose was not competition but absolutely do, for my own satisfaction, to experiment with mtx5.
no problem crowns or friction (with game strain-bell 0.65) in that game 2 broken crowns.
the big problem, which is not easy to solve, is in the bending of the frame when braking.
I had to change the frame, was a real banana.
if they can solve this problem without affecting the current structure of the machine (such as a brake type sheperd). the machine will be very competitive.
:-)
06-08-2012, 05:14 PM
#2172
Hello.
I was at Cassino for the 2012 European warm-up with my mtx5.
My purpose was not competition but absolutely do, for my own satisfaction, to experiment with mtx5.
no problem crowns or friction (with game strain-bell 0.65) in that game 2 broken crowns.
the big problem, which is not easy to solve, is in the bending of the frame when braking.
I had to change the frame, was a real banana.
if they can solve this problem without affecting the current structure of the machine (such as a brake type sheperd). the machine will be very competitive.
:-)
I was at Cassino for the 2012 European warm-up with my mtx5.
My purpose was not competition but absolutely do, for my own satisfaction, to experiment with mtx5.
no problem crowns or friction (with game strain-bell 0.65) in that game 2 broken crowns.
the big problem, which is not easy to solve, is in the bending of the frame when braking.
I had to change the frame, was a real banana.
if they can solve this problem without affecting the current structure of the machine (such as a brake type sheperd). the machine will be very competitive.
:-)
Do you know what problems Pietsch had at cassino did he strip gears?
06-08-2012, 10:32 PM
#2173
Which way have you got your bake pads on?
Hi Speed races.
I came across an interesting issue just recently.
While working on t braking system of my mtx-5
You can put the brake pads on two different ways.
I was puzzled at I went to reinstall them as I referred to the manual and that just rased more confusion?
Have a look at the images I made from the manual, yes I cheeked the newer one too and they a both the same.
I also went look for photos of Roberts car and the cad images and found it was shown in both directions
If you look at page 11 you will see in one illustration mugen show the pads on in one direction. But in all other illustrations in the manual they are shown in the other orientation.
Now you may ask what does it matter?
Glad you asked, I though you would never ask..lol
If you install them as per the illustrations thought the book and the cad images you will find the pad on cam side will not sit flat on the bulk head, because the pad touches on the Rear damper brace t2502 as there a re a few bumps to accommodate the countsunk screw heads.
So if you have them on as per the bulk of the illustrations. The shoe will not be sitting parallel to the disk when being held back by the springs.
So what! I can here you say
It doesn’t really matter because when you apply the brakes the shoe will square up the disk then, yes true but it binds a bit at first.
The consequence is the brake linkage needs to swing through more travel before it can grab the disk, meaning you lose mechanical advantage, what does this mean?
If you can keep the linkage as close to vertical when the pads come into contacts with the disk you will get more force applied to the pads for the amount of pull the servo is exerting on the link rod.
To adjust this you can pack the inner pad closer to the disk by adding some small shim washers to the brake pad shaft T2309. This is the same effect of adjusting the brake pad mounting screws on the old 4 so the disk dragged and them you back them off a ¼ turn. But the trick here is to add shims until the free roll of the car is compromised then pull one 0.1mm shim out to make sure the disk spins feely.
Now I really only notice the pad direction issue when I started to shim the inner pad and really the brakes will still work but only so well as if your brake arm is laying over at 2 or 3 o’clock (calling the vertical 12 o’clock) you will be inducing more bending moment in the chassis plate.
The simple fix is to mount the pads in the other direction, or as per the first and only illustration in the manual on page 11 of the manual. There is how another fix which I tried and that’s to grind a small relief of the back to the pad where it was hitting the T2502 brace. The pads are the same pads from the 5’s 1/8 scale big brother and you will note the direction of the pads is the same as in the cad image on the 5. I’ve not really done any testing to see if the braking is better with the pads in either direction just yet and there is no good reason to assume it would make a difference.
What I do know is my 5 has gone from hard to stop with major chasse deflection to massive amount of braking with minimal chasse flex.
I have extend the linkage by about 10mm (small carbon extension arm) and I am using the soft pads T2317 and I have the pads shimmed and the total movement of my brake linkage is no more then 15deg and I was locking up at the end of a straight to a full stop until I got it dialled in and backed it off. In fact last race meeting I had to really back of my brakes big time as I was getting huge amounts of braking with minimal chasse deflection. Once I reset my EPA and my ALT braking setting I was getting nice progressive braking.
You might like to try these fixes in this order and see how it works for you:
(Run the shoe in what ever direction floats you boat, but remember to relive the back of the out pad just a bit where it hits the brace if yo choose that option).
1. Shim the pads to get the linkage as close to vertical. But be careful to maintain the free roll. Small hint here if you think it’s to close just back of the screws a small amount and if it rolls better then pull out a shim. Make sure to use thread lock once you get it right and clamp it up tight. You will only get about 0.2mm of shims in anyway so it will likely be 1 or 2 shims depending on the age of the pads.
2. Used the optional pads.
3. Extend linkage.
4. Or any combination or all of the above
Ok there are other thinks I have noticed too.
1. The part T2303-F can flare out and bind in the rear upper bulkhead T2103R because the brake piston hex starts to get sloppy after a while and stretches the plastic. This will cause the cam to drag a bit and stop the pads from backing ot the disk. My fix was to glue T2303-F to T2305 and the but the shaft in a drill and spin the drill while holding a fine file on it to just reduce its diameter just a bit.. NOT TOO much.
2. Also the ears on the brake pads are not flat and this makes it hard to shim accurately so I straighten them and sand the bake of the pad flat too.
No I’m not a world champion for even a club champion but I do enjoy this hobby and I hope some of what I have shared here will help fellow 5 speed races enjoy the hobby more.
Steve H
I came across an interesting issue just recently.
While working on t braking system of my mtx-5
You can put the brake pads on two different ways.
I was puzzled at I went to reinstall them as I referred to the manual and that just rased more confusion?
Have a look at the images I made from the manual, yes I cheeked the newer one too and they a both the same.
I also went look for photos of Roberts car and the cad images and found it was shown in both directions
If you look at page 11 you will see in one illustration mugen show the pads on in one direction. But in all other illustrations in the manual they are shown in the other orientation.
Now you may ask what does it matter?
Glad you asked, I though you would never ask..lol
If you install them as per the illustrations thought the book and the cad images you will find the pad on cam side will not sit flat on the bulk head, because the pad touches on the Rear damper brace t2502 as there a re a few bumps to accommodate the countsunk screw heads.
So if you have them on as per the bulk of the illustrations. The shoe will not be sitting parallel to the disk when being held back by the springs.
So what! I can here you say
It doesn’t really matter because when you apply the brakes the shoe will square up the disk then, yes true but it binds a bit at first.
The consequence is the brake linkage needs to swing through more travel before it can grab the disk, meaning you lose mechanical advantage, what does this mean?
If you can keep the linkage as close to vertical when the pads come into contacts with the disk you will get more force applied to the pads for the amount of pull the servo is exerting on the link rod.
To adjust this you can pack the inner pad closer to the disk by adding some small shim washers to the brake pad shaft T2309. This is the same effect of adjusting the brake pad mounting screws on the old 4 so the disk dragged and them you back them off a ¼ turn. But the trick here is to add shims until the free roll of the car is compromised then pull one 0.1mm shim out to make sure the disk spins feely.
Now I really only notice the pad direction issue when I started to shim the inner pad and really the brakes will still work but only so well as if your brake arm is laying over at 2 or 3 o’clock (calling the vertical 12 o’clock) you will be inducing more bending moment in the chassis plate.
The simple fix is to mount the pads in the other direction, or as per the first and only illustration in the manual on page 11 of the manual. There is how another fix which I tried and that’s to grind a small relief of the back to the pad where it was hitting the T2502 brace. The pads are the same pads from the 5’s 1/8 scale big brother and you will note the direction of the pads is the same as in the cad image on the 5. I’ve not really done any testing to see if the braking is better with the pads in either direction just yet and there is no good reason to assume it would make a difference.
What I do know is my 5 has gone from hard to stop with major chasse deflection to massive amount of braking with minimal chasse flex.
I have extend the linkage by about 10mm (small carbon extension arm) and I am using the soft pads T2317 and I have the pads shimmed and the total movement of my brake linkage is no more then 15deg and I was locking up at the end of a straight to a full stop until I got it dialled in and backed it off. In fact last race meeting I had to really back of my brakes big time as I was getting huge amounts of braking with minimal chasse deflection. Once I reset my EPA and my ALT braking setting I was getting nice progressive braking.
You might like to try these fixes in this order and see how it works for you:
(Run the shoe in what ever direction floats you boat, but remember to relive the back of the out pad just a bit where it hits the brace if yo choose that option).
1. Shim the pads to get the linkage as close to vertical. But be careful to maintain the free roll. Small hint here if you think it’s to close just back of the screws a small amount and if it rolls better then pull out a shim. Make sure to use thread lock once you get it right and clamp it up tight. You will only get about 0.2mm of shims in anyway so it will likely be 1 or 2 shims depending on the age of the pads.
2. Used the optional pads.
3. Extend linkage.
4. Or any combination or all of the above
Ok there are other thinks I have noticed too.
1. The part T2303-F can flare out and bind in the rear upper bulkhead T2103R because the brake piston hex starts to get sloppy after a while and stretches the plastic. This will cause the cam to drag a bit and stop the pads from backing ot the disk. My fix was to glue T2303-F to T2305 and the but the shaft in a drill and spin the drill while holding a fine file on it to just reduce its diameter just a bit.. NOT TOO much.
2. Also the ears on the brake pads are not flat and this makes it hard to shim accurately so I straighten them and sand the bake of the pad flat too.
No I’m not a world champion for even a club champion but I do enjoy this hobby and I hope some of what I have shared here will help fellow 5 speed races enjoy the hobby more.
Steve H
Last edited by shanwright; 07-27-2014 at 03:30 PM.
06-09-2012, 12:21 AM
#2174
06-09-2012, 01:44 AM
#2175
Tech Fanatic
shane wright that was the biggest post since tomb and it might even make sense when bailey makes up his mind to race again i hope i can still remember how to pull it apart
greg
greg