DRRC

iTrader: (59)

Good discussion here

I hope people realize this is a series for GT cars promoted by tony
It has an open and sportsman class where you can use any car

What I don't understand is why people are asking his choices for the spec class
It is his decision and maybe these companies are the only ones who are willing to help with his promotion. If you don't like the spec rules don't race spec
It is like racing touring cars you have the Mazda races, BMW races and other brands. If you don't like the brand or don't have it don't race

I think there should be a better name for it rather than spec
Maybe reds gt racing series or long chassis racing

DK McGee

iTrader: (36)

Well I Know your not, must be set in stone, and I do race with the Porter bunch But with your rules I would have to run open #1 I dont run Reds motors and I think this is not fair Thats like telling a drag racer he has to run Ford only. or a boat racer he has to run evinrude only. needs too have variety in the motor area. Hey Marcus what about the Ofna GTV2 (TeamC car)

MantisWorx

iTrader: (28)

You kind of lost me on a few things in there but, there is a engine package being put together by the REDS factory as we speak.

As expected there will be some legal mods allowed that will aid in reliability not speed or performance.

you cant open up Pandora's box on engines and tires because if you do there is no where to draw the line. "grey" area and stock /spec never works!

Yes your car is probably a great example of a spec car but too many loose ends as far as choices which is why SPEC rules are SPEC rules.

MantisWorx

iTrader: (28)

Well at least one person gets it, thanx Everett!
GTSpec??

Your run open now by the second round of quals you get resorted to others that are in your skill set. I understand that you want to run another class but drag racing is not the same as road racing. ie formula Ford,Mazda cup. SCCA spec RX7 etc etc. These organizations use the same engines, same tires and same cars and have so for decades, its a formula that works if you let it!

The OFNAGTV2 is a rebranded TeamC, its legal.

tonylunatic

iTrader: (45)

Sorry for delay.
Your first question the only rules we are trying to enforce Nationally are the "OPEN" /Pro rules the same exact set that has been used. The "Spec" class is an alternative GT8 class chosen by the track or director to run. Never being forced, now if they choose to run it, it would make sense to follow the rules as posted, so that racer could race at other Spec class races also using the rules.

When I created the "SPEC" rules I really took what I believe to be everything into consideration, from experience as a shop and track owner and Racing RC for 20+yrs now.
The idea is to revive On-Road racing in general through the GT8 class, why because many agree the cost to run 1/10 TC or 1/8 OPEN is very expensive.
These cars GT8 are big, fast and durable, compared to other on road classes. They look, handle and have the same basic principles of real auto racing. Making even the normal person understand how they work. Then the cost factor did come in, because people were arguing that to be competitive in our current GT8 class, one had to spend the same if not more then to run a 1/10 TC or 1/8 OPEN. So I thought about my sales as a shop owner, my shop was very catered to supplying high end racer products. But I was not being successful that route. So I started selling RTRs, now a shop owner makes very little selling RTRs. They make their living off parts and upgrades after the first sell. Well I actually got people hooked and into the sport by making their choices easy. 90% of potential customers or future racers, that walks in or is browsing online have no clue about organized RC racing. They typically see them in an ad or at a race and just want one for the wow, cool factor. Also have no clue what they are getting into with Nitro. So I figured if I could offer them a package deal on a product that was relatively inexpensive, easy to use and bugs to great quality that they could use in their front yard or come race at my track it was a win win. They would be happy and it supported the hobby sport.

So I figured Spec would be just that.. Cars that are easily available (new or used) and still have parts support, motor easy to break in, produces great power, has great product support, tires that were easy to identify with limited options, bodies that look like real cars they could relate too. A package deal for a ARTR Race Car, you can use anywhere and still come to race stand next to a guy on the stand look over and he's running the exact equipment setup your running. Someone had mentioned Radio and servos, that in any class should be racers choice as every radio has a different feel and some like fast servos and others slower.

If he wins or gets beat its based on just driving and setup, not equipment choice.

I really like the fact the cars look real, wheels, bodies, paint, stickers etc. They look cool as hell and easily identified by someone that knows nothing about RC. Oh that's a Ferrari, Oh McClaren, GTR.etc.

As for my big over all plan to revive On-Road, it's simple cross breeding what's already there. At least here in Texas a hand full of GT drivers are also now running 1/10 TC and 1/8 Open simply by cross exposure. Then with GT being buggy or Truggy based, if marketed correctly on could get conversion kits to at least get some off roaders to try On Road.

Everything on my site in the home and About pages covers my vision. I just want to provide a sport for my kids to enjoy in the future. Do you realize how many of my friends know I race RC but really have no clue what that means. All this I have an continue work on is to get us to higher level. TV newspaper, radio, Redbull, Monster, let's get some real exposure to our sport. It's a vision maybe many don't agree with, but we won't know till its done.

DK McGee

iTrader: (36)

formula Ford,Mazda cup. SCCA spec RX7 etc etc ...............We are not running these classes as well we are running RC cars GT8 I run Open class but who is to say I would run both classes YET dont want to make your pockets fatter ? Hell this is a dead issue I hope your Spec class works out for the best see ya Oct 6 for some open.
D

MantisWorx

iTrader: (28)

So its ok for you to make someone elses pockets fatter just not mine?If you cannot see the similarities between real spec racing and GT spec racing but think we are closer to drag racing and boats like your example well your statement sounds about right coming from you. Unless you are making your kits in your garage someone profits off of everything you buy. That makes lots of sense BTW its not my spec class, i dont sell REDS, i dont sell VP tires or OFNA. I make the parts that make your open cars faster like those braces you run, guess who made them? the fatness you gave me from that purchase i used to buy rice and potatoes for my family

DK McGee

iTrader: (36)

At least you got to eat that week Im glad
" well your statement sounds about right coming from you" Ouch That hert !

*1speedy

iTrader: (12)

Marcus with comments like your last post you are not sounding much different then someone else on this forum, you know who I mean.

Tony I fail to see how excluding other manufacturers from Spec GT8 can grow the class. The word that comes to mind when I look at the Spec rules is incredulous.

If you think that this Spec class will work in Texas, then by all means, I wish you much success.

Looks like the masses are not in step what has been offered by IGT8F for Spec & I hope you use anything that has been constructive to make changes that will be received in a more positive manner. I also realize that not everyone will agree and that’s ok, just keep using pencil until it’s time for ink.

I repeat… why not TweeK the old Spec rules?? Update the Engine list and a few other things and most of Open GT8 racers already have or have access to run the class or help someone enter it. Isn’t that the goal to Grow the class?

As for Open, well that speaks for itself and that’s what 99% of the Country already runs.

Tracks will as always be the deciding factor for what rules will be enforced. I hope we can all come to a reasonable conclusion that will ruffle the least amount of feathers.

I hope this is taken in a positive light I mean no malice.




.

tonylunatic

iTrader: (45)

They way I see it, my Spec class is adding a (one) class. Yes with Specific rules. But still adding.
I fail to see others vision of growth by simply, splitting the same group of racers we already have. With all respect by adding a Sportsman, stock, etc class that has a few changes allowing the SAME racer to run two classes, well I don't see that as growth at all. You still have the exact same group of guys showing up to race. I guess growth in entries fees, but not growth by bringing in new blood.
When I mean BLOOD I mean what keeps us alive, new innovations, new companies willing to invest time and money into the class and sport/hobby in its entirety, new types of media exposure, new types of Sponsors, and bring in youth the future of the sport.

So your telling me a Mom or Dad that has a child interested in racing or just wants to play. Walks into a shop and either gets (A) given multiple choices to choose from, or (B) given a specific package... Which to you think they will choose. Hmm.. maybe that's why RTR kits are what made the really GIANTS of the industry.

Serpent catered to the top quality racers for many years and that is wonderful, but why now the interest to get into RTR kits?

I have done my research and surveyed hundreds of people, NORMAL people (it's easy as I drive all over the country and I'm a pretty talkative guy) usually people ask me as if see my Serpent logo on my shirt, or I'm watch a rc race video clip etc. They always ask, Oh what's that, Oh that's cool.. Oh had a uncle that did that. I go on to explaining very short, to not lose their interest. I always ask if they have kids that might be interested or even themselves usual response is "ya maybe but I think they are really expensive". So if you take that answer plus the (A) choice of multiple choices. I guarantee their interest is lost.
But when I ask, what if there was a RACE CAR PACKAGE you could get about the same price as you kids current Ps3, Xbox plus a couple games. Gets him out the house, gets his mind working, has the ability to put him in actual organized RC racing. They always say, ya would be nice to see him do something beside play video games. Now understand of course no sell was made, nothing has come of it yet, but at least know their still interested.

Maybe my plans and vision is just to Big for most to even understand or see, when they are looking at it through a straw. Then again I'm ONLY one guy here ONE. NO one else in the last 3 years has stepped up to organize anything like this.

I do and will always give Serpent the credit they deserve for pushing the factory to build your and my beloved Cobra GT. That project entirely would have been scraped, if not for Desoto Racing and Paolo. Paolo proved to them and us that the car was race worthy, and worth building and explained their is a market for it.

Most will never understand what it actually take in (time, money, effort) to build something, especially from nothing.

Their are already plans and events in motion that will benefit us all in the big scheme of the things.

I am always open for discussion, just as we have last 10+pages. You have questions, I have my answers. For those that actually know me, know the type of guy I am. Anything said here about me has no effect on me. If I offended anyone it's not with bad intent, but I do apologize.

I'm always available.

MantisWorx

iTrader: (28)

Speedy, the comment about "not making my pockets fat" was a direct attack on me but i cannot defend myself? I said nothing to him before that except for answered his question but now you think i sound like Jeff?? I mean no harm by this but please explain to me how I was in the wrong? maybe I am missing something. i could easily say you sound like Jeff by bringing up old rules but I did not do that.

"formula Ford,Mazda cup. SCCA spec RX7 etc etc ...............We are not running these classes as well we are running RC cars GT8 I run Open class but who is to say I would run both classes YET dont want to make your pockets fatter ? Hell this is a dead issue I hope your Spec class works out for the best see ya Oct 6 for some open."


Seriously what was meant by that? D I have helped you numerous times at the track, didnt even know your name, helped you with a tune issue and helped with what we though was a clutch issue but ended up being your dif gears also helped you with some chassis tuning tips. I even made those braces for you the morning you wanted them even though at that time they were not even released yet, i woke up at 6 that morning , changed the setup on my machine and made one set just for you because Tony said you really wanted them!! So i am somewhat confused by your aggressive statement. You asked me a question and i answered it honestly with no malice or ill intentions and then you turn around and say something like that? I feel that was completely uncalled for. And your follow up for editing is because "you dont want to rattle Marcus the great"? So from this point on i guess we have a problem with each other? Let me know now so i can move on with it.

bassman2

iTrader: (7)

Tony, I have to say initially after I saw what you've posted on the IGT8F website regarding the SPEC rules I was concerned. HOWEVER, after I put some serious thoughts behind what you've explained to the rest of us, I DO SEE YOUR VISION!

Now, this might upset some of you guys who might have an issue with the IGT8F's spec rules of running only single manufacturer's engine, pipe, header or tires by excluding other players in the business, please do keep in mind there is Open and Sportsman class in which any manufacturers can offer their best products to this GT8 class, same as before.

Serpent and Desoto Racing(Joaquin Sr., Joaquin Jr, Paolo) had revived the GT8 class and put this class on the right path this year with their relentless effort of maximizing the exposure of this great GT8 class. My hope is to see IGT8F along with all other manufacturers and racers helping this class and carry this awesome class to its maximum potential as it deserves.

Tony, after days of thinking this thing through my own head. I see the vision you lay in front of us.

YOU HAVE MY SUPPORT as a racer.

tonylunatic

iTrader: (45)

After going back and rereading everything with a fresh mind, this is the simplest way to explain IGT8F and it's intent by design.

By design IGT8F is to promote racing. On Road RC racing to be exact, through the GT8 class.

The OPEN & PRO$ (SPORTSMAN once rules are submitted) Class Rules are*designed to promote more racing for the CURRENT GT8 racers. By promoting what has already been established over the years. By bringing more races, Series racing, and BIG EVENT. We are promoting existing races, future races, existing venues, existing Series Events, future Series Events,existing and future venues etc etc.

Especially promoting All current and existing Brands of Manufacturer as well as future ones in the ENTIRE RC INDUSTRY.

The SPEC class by design is intended to promote future POTENTIAL RACERS, (not everyone wants to race). By making their choices fixed, and not overwhelming said potential prospect with multiple choices. It's design to build a prospect from the ground up.

One would start in Spec race against others with Exact same equipment. They would learn from the Open, Pros, corner Marshall for the open, Pros watch and learn from them. Building a ladder (spec to open to pro). Again this class is by CHOICE from both prospect and tracks willing to run the rules.

Also by design if said prospect wants to build a Open class car he can. We are not turning anyone away. He will race in the class to the car and rules he chooses to follow.

I understand the fixed equipment list is exclusive, but that is by nature of the Spec class rules. Believe many, many hours of R&D were done before making decisions.

To get this started at the beginning of course we (current GT racers) have to race it, to be able to promote it.

Weather you agree or not it makes no difference in the vision and plans already making huge progress.

IGT8F IS HERE TO PROMOTE RACING for YOU the racer or Potential Racer.

tonylunatic

iTrader: (45)

Thank you Andy,

This is still a very much needed Team (everyone) working together effort, to accomplish the goals.

pressure

iTrader: (3)

These discussions always make me smile. I think Tony Luna went ahead a created something for everyone not for everyone to recreate. Obviously those in favor will participate and those who are not in favor will not. These are his spec rules and he ask for input from the GT8 community. The viability will be tested at the track with racer turnout not on the net. I personally won't run spec but ill run open. For me supporting another chassis is the ONLY and determining issue. Personally I love the spec motor rule and if the tires are good as long as everyone has to run them I think it's great. Kudos to Reds for offering a solution. In Texas I will run by the rules if the track. If you can get 20 local racers to support a similar set if rules at your track post them and announce it then you have a bonofied spec class. Matter of fact this is and excellent blue print for any local GT club.