RC Crew Chief Software
 

I couldn't find the old thread with the setup info and tips and tricks, so I'm starting a new one. So far I've found it very helpful to get quick numbers on what camber link and roll center changes will do to camber change and weight transfer through a corner. I haven't really gotten into the motor dyno settings, but they seem well thought out.


If you're looking for the software:
http://rccrewchief.wrightdesign.ca/

Great piece of software. You get so much more insight to your setup.

Worth every penny!

yep and tech support second to none

Thanks for starting a new thread. The last one got pulled.

Sounds like the program is working well for you guys. That was the plan :).

I believe all I am allowed to do in this thread is answer any questions you may have or participate in general discussions.

I am starting to work on some program improvements now that hopefully all the bugs are out. If you have suggestions for improvements let me know and I'll do my best to incorporate them.

it has really helped a lot

I would still like to see some optional top shock mounting positions (buggy style multi level advanced mode options)
and the droop stop option and effect that was discussed in the old thread
also a print your setup option

Thanks Azeroth, I have your suggestions on my list. My plan for the update currently in work is:

Setup file Import/Export
Setup Print (just for you)
On Handling page allow suspension link positions and shock positions (similar to setup page) to be changed.
Add option to save changes made on the Handling page back to the setup.

Hope to have this update out in a week or so. Then I will start working on modelling the droop settings.

The multi-level shock mount points involves significant changes to the database structure so will likely not happen until a major update.

Glad to see a new thread up for this. I have only be using the program for a couple weeks and it has helped. It lets you understand what your doing to your car as you are changing things around. Anyway I have a few questions,

How do you properly figure the weight for the sprung/unsprung weight?

How do you figure the arm movement value that is on the setup page?

I know this was talked about in the thread that was pulled, I read it but did not have the program yet.

Thanks for any help on these.

Steve P.

Does this work for oval pan cars?

Thanks Bob :D i know i am such a pain :lol:
the un-sprung weight, ok block up chassis remove shocks weight up shocks divide by 2 this will be closs enough but with chassis blocked up tires and wheels on use your scales like you where weighting the car make sure it is not against the droop screws or bottomed out make sure the suspension moves freely take the weight from the 4 scales and then the shock weight you got earlier add them together is your unsprung weight

I doesn't work for cars with asymmetric suspension or live axle cars (1/12 scale, WGT, F1 or oval). For now it must have independent F/R suspension. Maybe down the road I'll look into live axle cars.

There are two methods to get the unsprung mass the "Azeroth" method above or the component method.

The component procedure is as follows:

1. Dismantle one side of the suspension.
2. Weigh everthing that is outboard of the shocks (wheels, bearings, hubs and axles). This is all 100% unsprung weight. Call this W1
3. Weigh everthing that connects between the components above and the chassis, So suspension arms, camber links, Tie rods and springs/shocks. Take 1/2 of this number and call this W2
4. The total unsprung weight is (W1+W2)x2.
5. Repeat this procedure for the other end of the car.
6. The Sprung mass is then the total car mass - the front and rear unsprung mass.

The other method works very well and is much easier. This is how I do it now. You just have to be careful that you arms arms not binding or you are not sitting on the droop screws. If you get different readings on the scales between the left and right sides then something is likely binding. Also make sure you disconnect the anti-roll bars as they can be tweaked.

The arm movement for the camber gain calculation is measured as vertical chassis movement. So if you push down on the chassis to get 3mm of movement the camber gain value listed is how much the camber will change. The previous method used an arm angle rotation which was not easy to relate to.

I just found this software and it has me intrigued. As an off-road racer, I like to keep setup lists that I can reference from track to track. That way if the new layout track x is similar to track y I can quickly reference that setup and make any necessary adjustments. Will there be any sort of "summary" sheets/pages/tabs available? It would be helpful to have an area to add notes for tire selection, diff oil weight, etc... Any chance that the print option will be widely available? Thanks!

ufoDziner,

On the third page in the setup tab are 3 text boxes, one for track notes, one for setup notes (diff oil weight, droop settings and so on) and one for tire notes. I am working on a print page that will provide a summary of all the setup information entered. That should provide the setup summary you are looking for on hopefully one page. All of your setups are also stored in the program so you can access them any time.

Not sure what you mean by "Will the print option be widely available?". It will be part of the program so every user will have it.

Hey Bob, could explain how to measure the IFS in terms of this program? I have a ta05v2 and want to model it.

Bob, in the above statement are you referring to corner loads with everything assembled? If you have different load measurements left/right and bias the setup could simply be preload tweaked as well.

There is already a TA05 V2 (laydown shocks) modelled in the program. You just have to import it.

It's a little tricky to explain how I came up with the shock model as the geometry with the pushrod/crankarm gets a little complicated. The simplest way to do it is to measure the X1, Y1 coordinates of the push rod connection to the crankarm as it shows on the shock variables graphic. Then correct the pushrod angle to get the correct shock movement. I did this by measuring the shock movement at several different chassis vertical displacements.

If the model with the program doesn't suit your needs let me know and I'll write up a better procedure.

When you use this method to measure the unsprung mass the shocks and ARB's are not connected so the only weight you will be reading on the scales is the dead weight of the wheels, tires, axles and so on. The chassis weight is supported on droop blocks or something similar. There are no preloads to cause tweak only friction in the hinge pins and/or ball cups/studs.

For a 1/10 sedan you should be reading about 50gms at each corner

Thanks for the prompt reply. This is what I was referring to when I asked about the printing.

Ahhh. By "just for you" I was referring to it being his request. Not that Azeroth would be the only one to get it. The print option will be available to everyone.

I hear ya, thanks!

The only model I see is a TAO5 V2, is this with the laydown geometry, or did I not download the file? (ta06 has 2 files)

thanks for the help.

Sorry Mike didn't get a notification of your post.

Yes the TA05 V2 model is the one you want. The model will draw as a short upright shock. The geometry has been corrected to account for the rocker arm to provide the correct ride and roll stiffness values. That is what is important. The front unsprung mass in the car model is also slightly lower because the shocks are now 100% sprung mass.

Adding shims under the shock ball stud on the rocker arm has the same affect as standing up the shock in a conventional upright shock. I didn't work out that part but it shouldn't be to hard to figure out. Let me know if you want me to do it.

I purchased the app and I really enjoy it. Thank yo

I would like a roll out chart added to the final drive page. Have a swith with rubber tire or foam tire. That way when I tap foam tire it will lead me through a roll out chart like you final drive chart does.

Can you also add an explanation of front arm toe. What are different effects on have the front arms swept forward vs front arms swept back.

Thanks so much for the help over the last few years. I bought your book along time ago. It has help more then anything except practice.

Joe Maxey, I think you may have posted your requests in the wrong thread. It sounds like you are talking about Martin Crisp's "RC Setup" app for iphone and android. Do a search and you should find it.

Sorry.

has anyone measured or up the TC 6.1 yet ? or have the chassis file ?

love the program by the way !!

I tried a new method to create chassis models that seems to work quite well. It involves importing an image of the suspension from the Setup sheet into my CAD program. I then use the image as a base to locate the suspension points. I used the TC6 shock tower mount points as a reference for scaling. The results look to be within .2mm which isn't bad. Email me and I'll send you the Car, Chassis and Setup files.

This method should work for any chassis as long as I have a scale image of the suspension to work from.

Thats great, email has been sent, thanks :D

Off Road
 

I have This software and have my on road car loaded Tc6.
Is there a mbx6t file i can get for my mugen truggy. the program helped my on road experience a lot and i can use the help for off road .
Great work on the program Bob.

I wish I could say I have the Mugen but unfortunately I don't at this time. I've been working hard on an upgrade that gets into dynamic roll centre, droop and some chassis roll animations. This work has been consuming all my spare time lately.

I do have an idea on how I can build models using digital photos though. It will involve some work on your part to take photos of the chassis with a ruler included to provide a scale I can work from. If you are up for it let me know and I will get together an example of what I need to try this out.

MBX6T
 

Be glad to bob pm me with what you need

Thought a preview of the new suspension Dynamics feature that's in work would be appropriate. Still have some work to do but you should get the idea.

I've included a screenshot and a link to a quick Youtube screen cast video.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4ieFtfne_xw

Do you have a list somewhere of the chassis you have in the program?

The website FAQ page has a list of the currently available chassis. As new chassis models are developed they will be added to the download page so you can add the ones you want to the program database.

You can also create your own models if you can wield a pair of digital calipers. :)

Very cool Bob!

nice stuff Bob :sweat: now can you add up stop location :)

Bob, I downloaded the demo but haven't had a chance to check it out yet. Are you able to model oval cars that are asymmetrical?

You're killing me. LOL. How do you like the Print function I added?

Sorry pan/oval cars are not supported. Only symmetric independent suspensions.

These aren't pan cars. They're buggy based (B3, B4) dirt oval cars. Great job on the program!