2991Likes1/12 forum
12-05-2011 | 02:23 PM
Regional Moderator
Joined: Jul 2006
Posts: 2,664
Put blue painters tape over hole in the outside of the rim. Use an Xacto to make an X where the bearing goes. Push the bearing in. Trim around bearing. Salt to taste.
12-05-2011 | 03:55 PM
Exactly what I do, works perfectly. I only have a problem with the black Prizms (Parma) though, actual Jacos or Jaco wheeled Xceeds have been fine for me.
12-05-2011 | 04:06 PM
I didnt have blue but had tan masking tape and just did the wheels on my car and seen a big difference in wheel wobble. Seems all my white rim prisms all are a little loose. I think this will help make my car alot more consitant.
12-06-2011 | 10:44 AM
To my knowledge when a 1/12 scale starts to double-steer and or have steering and traction in pulses around a corner it means that the front end isn't moving freely, however the front end in my Gen-XL moves very free and still steers in pulses, it goes around the track fairly well but its not confidence inspiring so pushing it for faster laps becomes an i-don't-want-to-clip-that-apex exercise.
In the back I run light fluid (less that 3000wt) with a CRC white side spring, an associated Gold spring on the shock with 30wt shock oil. In the front its a 0.020" thick CRC stock spring with no tube lube on the kingpin, just a dab of Associated Green Slime in the plastic insert, the 5 degree reactive caster block with 3 degrees of static, almost zero camber, 1-2 degrees of toe out, Pink rear tires and purple fronts. If I add steering throw, it just gets worse in its pulsing and scrubs energy, but never seems to get to where the back end will really come around, it just seems to pulse to a stop like the front brakes are on.
I'm thinking of going to a heavier fluid in the center shock with a heavier spring, and heavier side dampener fluid with a lighter side spring like a CRC Blue in an effort to slow down the transition of weight to the front as I suspect what is happening is the weight of the car is bouncing off the front spring and then rebounding due to lack of dampening. Has anybody else had this sort of problem before? Double-steer for no apparent reason?
In the back I run light fluid (less that 3000wt) with a CRC white side spring, an associated Gold spring on the shock with 30wt shock oil. In the front its a 0.020" thick CRC stock spring with no tube lube on the kingpin, just a dab of Associated Green Slime in the plastic insert, the 5 degree reactive caster block with 3 degrees of static, almost zero camber, 1-2 degrees of toe out, Pink rear tires and purple fronts. If I add steering throw, it just gets worse in its pulsing and scrubs energy, but never seems to get to where the back end will really come around, it just seems to pulse to a stop like the front brakes are on.
I'm thinking of going to a heavier fluid in the center shock with a heavier spring, and heavier side dampener fluid with a lighter side spring like a CRC Blue in an effort to slow down the transition of weight to the front as I suspect what is happening is the weight of the car is bouncing off the front spring and then rebounding due to lack of dampening. Has anybody else had this sort of problem before? Double-steer for no apparent reason?
12-06-2011 | 11:36 AM
To my knowledge when a 1/12 scale starts to double-steer and or have steering and traction in pulses around a corner it means that the front end isn't moving freely, however the front end in my Gen-XL moves very free and still steers in pulses, it goes around the track fairly well but its not confidence inspiring so pushing it for faster laps becomes an i-don't-want-to-clip-that-apex exercise.
In the back I run light fluid (less that 3000wt) with a CRC white side spring, an associated Gold spring on the shock with 30wt shock oil. In the front its a 0.020" thick CRC stock spring with no tube lube on the kingpin, just a dab of Associated Green Slime in the plastic insert, the 5 degree reactive caster block with 3 degrees of static, almost zero camber, 1-2 degrees of toe out, Pink rear tires and purple fronts. If I add steering throw, it just gets worse in its pulsing and scrubs energy, but never seems to get to where the back end will really come around, it just seems to pulse to a stop like the front brakes are on.
I'm thinking of going to a heavier fluid in the center shock with a heavier spring, and heavier side dampener fluid with a lighter side spring like a CRC Blue in an effort to slow down the transition of weight to the front as I suspect what is happening is the weight of the car is bouncing off the front spring and then rebounding due to lack of dampening. Has anybody else had this sort of problem before? Double-steer for no apparent reason?
In the back I run light fluid (less that 3000wt) with a CRC white side spring, an associated Gold spring on the shock with 30wt shock oil. In the front its a 0.020" thick CRC stock spring with no tube lube on the kingpin, just a dab of Associated Green Slime in the plastic insert, the 5 degree reactive caster block with 3 degrees of static, almost zero camber, 1-2 degrees of toe out, Pink rear tires and purple fronts. If I add steering throw, it just gets worse in its pulsing and scrubs energy, but never seems to get to where the back end will really come around, it just seems to pulse to a stop like the front brakes are on.
I'm thinking of going to a heavier fluid in the center shock with a heavier spring, and heavier side dampener fluid with a lighter side spring like a CRC Blue in an effort to slow down the transition of weight to the front as I suspect what is happening is the weight of the car is bouncing off the front spring and then rebounding due to lack of dampening. Has anybody else had this sort of problem before? Double-steer for no apparent reason?
If the rear is locked in, try magenta/magenta, or magenta front/pink rear.
When the car is right I only use about 60% Dual Rate.
Any more and it's scrubbing and or double-steering.
For a baseline, 100% dual rate is set by adjusting the epa L/R so that full lock is attained, but not forced, i.e. wheels, and any steering bits are not binding, or touching anything.
Loose is fast, some drivers like a car that will rotate hard, i prefer a car that cuts tight arcs, but never brakes loose at the rear so much that I have to counter-steer into a slide.
12-06-2011 | 12:20 PM
In my experience, the main cause of Double-Steer is from the wrong tyre selection, imo, Pink/Purple is an extreme fix for a loose car.
If the rear is locked in, try magenta/magenta, or magenta front/pink rear.
When the car is right I only use about 60% Dual Rate.
Any more and it's scrubbing and or double-steering.
For a baseline, 100% dual rate is set by adjusting the epa L/R so that full lock is attained, but not forced, i.e. wheels, and any steering bits are not binding, or touching anything.
Loose is fast, some drivers like a car that will rotate hard, i prefer a car that cuts tight arcs, but never brakes loose at the rear so much that I have to counter-steer into a slide.
If the rear is locked in, try magenta/magenta, or magenta front/pink rear.
When the car is right I only use about 60% Dual Rate.
Any more and it's scrubbing and or double-steering.
For a baseline, 100% dual rate is set by adjusting the epa L/R so that full lock is attained, but not forced, i.e. wheels, and any steering bits are not binding, or touching anything.
Loose is fast, some drivers like a car that will rotate hard, i prefer a car that cuts tight arcs, but never brakes loose at the rear so much that I have to counter-steer into a slide.
12-06-2011 | 01:10 PM
You're exactly right about the steering throw, setting L/R end points and then dialing it back is what I do as well. 60% seems about right, but the dual steer was still present when I was running magenta fronts before switching to the purple, makes little difference but no matter, I will test it out on practice day.
So the sidewall is flexing and causing the issue.
We ran some itty bitties at the iic race, where the grip was intense.
But at our club races at TQ, we can run larger dia tires.
Have to test the synthetics, vs: the rubber type, then play with dia, and see what works best, then stick with that and fine tune the chassis.
I know you guys were chasing the track a bit with the Off-Road dust issues, maybe now it's more consistent ?
12-06-2011 | 01:29 PM
Tech Master
iTrader: (10)
Joined: Nov 2006
Posts: 1,799
From: New Bern, N.C.
cause of double steer
It's likely that a major source of your double steering issue is too light of dampening in the side tubes. Most guys run at least 10,000 in the tubes these days (I think the blue cap CRC bottle is about 10,000). A few of the team drivers have been going as stiff as 50,000. I suggest that you try 20,000. Then, an easy way to tell if it's too thick is to run a few laps with the 20,000, pull over quickly and pop off one tube and run a few more laps with just one tube connected. You'll know right away if that simple and quick trackside change made the car better or worse. If the car gets better with just one tube connected, than 20,000 is too thick. If if it gets worse, then 20,000 is not thick enough. Lately 20,000 has been my default tube lube and I go up or down slightly from there depending on track conditions.
To my knowledge when a 1/12 scale starts to double-steer and or have steering and traction in pulses around a corner it means that the front end isn't moving freely, however the front end in my Gen-XL moves very free and still steers in pulses, it goes around the track fairly well but its not confidence inspiring so pushing it for faster laps becomes an i-don't-want-to-clip-that-apex exercise.
In the back I run light fluid (less that 3000wt) with a CRC white side spring, an associated Gold spring on the shock with 30wt shock oil. In the front its a 0.020" thick CRC stock spring with no tube lube on the kingpin, just a dab of Associated Green Slime in the plastic insert, the 5 degree reactive caster block with 3 degrees of static, almost zero camber, 1-2 degrees of toe out, Pink rear tires and purple fronts. If I add steering throw, it just gets worse in its pulsing and scrubs energy, but never seems to get to where the back end will really come around, it just seems to pulse to a stop like the front brakes are on.
I'm thinking of going to a heavier fluid in the center shock with a heavier spring, and heavier side dampener fluid with a lighter side spring like a CRC Blue in an effort to slow down the transition of weight to the front as I suspect what is happening is the weight of the car is bouncing off the front spring and then rebounding due to lack of dampening. Has anybody else had this sort of problem before? Double-steer for no apparent reason?
In the back I run light fluid (less that 3000wt) with a CRC white side spring, an associated Gold spring on the shock with 30wt shock oil. In the front its a 0.020" thick CRC stock spring with no tube lube on the kingpin, just a dab of Associated Green Slime in the plastic insert, the 5 degree reactive caster block with 3 degrees of static, almost zero camber, 1-2 degrees of toe out, Pink rear tires and purple fronts. If I add steering throw, it just gets worse in its pulsing and scrubs energy, but never seems to get to where the back end will really come around, it just seems to pulse to a stop like the front brakes are on.
I'm thinking of going to a heavier fluid in the center shock with a heavier spring, and heavier side dampener fluid with a lighter side spring like a CRC Blue in an effort to slow down the transition of weight to the front as I suspect what is happening is the weight of the car is bouncing off the front spring and then rebounding due to lack of dampening. Has anybody else had this sort of problem before? Double-steer for no apparent reason?
12-07-2011 | 09:56 AM
Tech Adept
Joined: Oct 2008
Posts: 190
From: Great Falls, MT
It's likely that a major source of your double steering issue is too light of dampening in the side tubes. Most guys run at least 10,000 in the tubes these days (I think the blue cap CRC bottle is about 10,000). A few of the team drivers have been going as stiff as 50,000. I suggest that you try 20,000. Then, an easy way to tell if it's too thick is to run a few laps with the 20,000, pull over quickly and pop off one tube and run a few more laps with just one tube connected. You'll know right away if that simple and quick trackside change made the car better or worse. If the car gets better with just one tube connected, than 20,000 is too thick. If if it gets worse, then 20,000 is not thick enough. Lately 20,000 has been my default tube lube and I go up or down slightly from there depending on track conditions.
On thing to consider - you were proposing changing shock fluid, shock spring, side dampening fluid and side spring? Make sure and do these ONE AT A TIME. Otherwise, you have no idea which adjustment had the desired handling change. Start with the dampening fluid as VaFactor recommends and probably about a 90% chance you won't need to touch the other setup changes you proposed.
12-07-2011 | 06:00 PM
Tech Adept
iTrader: (25)
Joined: Mar 2011
Posts: 117
1/12th scale servo
hey just picked up a 12l4 so i can race at the local track. I used to have one back in the day but anyways. I can not for the life of me remember what servo i had in it so im looking for some cheaper suggestions on a servo for the car. if you have a use something you want to get rid of let me know.
thanks
travis
thanks
travis
12-07-2011 | 09:52 PM
hey just picked up a 12l4 so i can race at the local track. I used to have one back in the day but anyways. I can not for the life of me remember what servo i had in it so im looking for some cheaper suggestions on a servo for the car. if you have a use something you want to get rid of let me know.
thanks
travis
thanks
travis
12-07-2011 | 09:57 PM
vafactor has it right on - this is where to start sorting out your double-steer, right out of a setup guide. solid advice! I bet this will tidy things up in no time.
On thing to consider - you were proposing changing shock fluid, shock spring, side dampening fluid and side spring? Make sure and do these ONE AT A TIME. Otherwise, you have no idea which adjustment had the desired handling change. Start with the dampening fluid as VaFactor recommends and probably about a 90% chance you won't need to touch the other setup changes you proposed.
On thing to consider - you were proposing changing shock fluid, shock spring, side dampening fluid and side spring? Make sure and do these ONE AT A TIME. Otherwise, you have no idea which adjustment had the desired handling change. Start with the dampening fluid as VaFactor recommends and probably about a 90% chance you won't need to touch the other setup changes you proposed.
