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Old 03-11-2009, 11:02 AM   #31
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Originally Posted by Tread1 View Post
Oh come on Rocketrob,your using wikipedia as a source is as bad as you using the urban dictionary as a source,in case you don't know it both are user modifiable,anyone can place anything they wish in them,NOT a very reliable source for anything but amusement.
Which goes out the window apparently if some insults are not thrown in for good measure.

This is the problem with people raised on cereal. Their education stops at the quotes on the back of the box. Just wait until they discover the bus tickets.

But there may be hope still. Let's see.
Here you go, malicious weather phenomenon, maybe you can learn something, (random find on internet after lengthy 2 second search, never heard of these guys, try to find the solder with 2% silver):

http://www.bhavanimetals.com/Solder_...ore_Solder.htm

Last edited by niznai; 03-11-2009 at 11:14 AM.
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Old 03-11-2009, 03:45 PM   #32
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Oh come on Rocketrob,your using wikipedia as a source is as bad as you using the urban dictionary as a source,in case you don't know it both are user modifiable,anyone can place anything they wish in them,NOT a very reliable source for anything but amusement.
Maybe anyone can edit Wikipedia (that doesn't make it wrong), but the relevant definition of flux from the American Heritage Dictionary is:

A substance applied to a surface to be joined by welding, soldering, or brazing to facilitate the flowing of solder and prevent formation of oxides.

It has nothing whatsover to do with changing the melting point of the solder. It is possible that someone might think it affects the melting point because the solder seems to melt easier when flux is used, but what is really happening is that the flux is cleaning the contact surfaces so the heat flows from the iron to the parts being soldered so much easier. That's why I use flux on every joint.
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Old 03-11-2009, 04:02 PM   #33
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The problem with using pure silver solder is that it has to be heated to the point that any Copper or Tin will melt long before you get it Soldered.

I use pure Silver Solder for Stainless Steel Driveshafts on my boats and you have to get the SS almost red hot (with flux) to get it to flow.

$.02

Just make sure you get Silver Solder for Electronics and use water based flux.
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Old 03-11-2009, 04:06 PM   #34
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I use flux as well. Flux also acts as a cleaner, and you can get all that black gunk off the solder point. Apply some, then heat it. You can see the residue flow towards the edges, cool off, and wipe with a towel. you will then get a really clean surface to work on. Same thing goes when you are joining things too. Soldering works without flux, but better with it.

For the iron, I use a Goot PX-201
http://www.howardelectronics.com/goot/px201.html

Small and powerful, it can get to max temp in less than 30sec. Recommended
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Old 03-11-2009, 09:03 PM   #35
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Originally Posted by ta_man View Post
Maybe anyone can edit Wikipedia (that doesn't make it wrong), but the relevant definition of flux from the American Heritage Dictionary is:

A substance applied to a surface to be joined by welding, soldering, or brazing to facilitate the flowing of solder and prevent formation of oxides.

It has nothing whatsover to do with changing the melting point of the solder. It is possible that someone might think it affects the melting point because the solder seems to melt easier when flux is used, but what is really happening is that the flux is cleaning the contact surfaces so the heat flows from the iron to the parts being soldered so much easier. That's why I use flux on every joint.
You're wrong. It has everything to do with that. Fluxes are used in all sorts of places, and metallurgy is probably the first place in human history where fluxes were used and guess why? My guess is that neanderthal man didn't have good enough fuels to help him melt Fe, so he had to invent flux to lower the melting point. Some examples include fluorite (CaF-calcium fluoride) for melting Aluminium, limestone for melting Fe, and so on. If you look at the properties of alloys you will see that eutectics have lower melting points than individual elements (one example at random again is a tin-lead alloy which melts just under 200C whereas both tin and lead on their own melt above that, I think tin at about 300C and Pb about 230). Adding a flux to this combination helps to lower the temperature again and homogenises it otherwise the molten liquid wouldn't flow better as you say. This is because fluxes prevent the covalent bond forming in the liquid by interposing a foreign atom inbetween those of the relevant metals. This changes quite a few of the properies of the molten liquid, one of which most of you are mentioning often and that is "cleaning the surface of metals". That is because silicates and oxides (which are often the annoying impurities are lighter and they float to the surface of molten alloys (slag in furnace is one example), but this is just a positive side effect of the flux which has fluidised the molten metal/alloy so impurities can float unimpeded (which would not readily happen if there were points of lower temperature in the liquid to which they would remain attached). And so on.

Wikipedia is not bad, but it's far from a good scientific source of information. Likewise the dictionary. The problem with these is they are not written by specialists so you have to be careful when using it, and as far as I am concerned the information therein can not constitute hard evidence. They can be good starting points but take it easy. Some people know more than others.

Good luck.
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Old 03-11-2009, 09:20 PM   #36
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ta_man View Post
Maybe anyone can edit Wikipedia (that doesn't make it wrong), but the relevant definition of flux from the American Heritage Dictionary is:

A substance applied to a surface to be joined by welding, soldering, or brazing to facilitate the flowing of solder and prevent formation of oxides.

It has nothing whatsover to do with changing the melting point of the solder. It is possible that someone might think it affects the melting point because the solder seems to melt easier when flux is used, but what is really happening is that the flux is cleaning the contact surfaces so the heat flows from the iron to the parts being soldered so much easier. That's why I use flux on every joint.
We all might as well stop wasting our time because niznai, whose real name is Al Gore, has had it all figured out since way back when he invented the Internet.
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Old 03-12-2009, 09:31 AM   #37
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We all might as well stop wasting our time because niznai, whose real name is Al Gore, has had it all figured out since way back when he invented the Internet.
+1,000,000
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Old 03-21-2009, 05:29 AM   #38
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My soldering joints still suck haha.
I have practiced and practiced.
I just can't do it, they end up messy, when i apply solder to join the wires, i pull the iron away as soon as i melt the solder on to the wires but it drags the solder along with it, and creates sort of a wave looking joint, it looks craphouse.
I have a hot 60W iron and good silver based solder, Much More AG-4
What are all the tips on how to get a perfect solder joint?
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Old 03-21-2009, 05:42 AM   #39
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Originally Posted by edhchoe View Post
After looking at countless neat wiring jobs on a thread, I tried some rewiring myself. But it didn't go well. I watched youtube videos on how to solder Deans connectors and tried it but my solder would not melt easily. The silicon cover on the wire melted before the solder liquified. Sometimes the heat shrink tube shrunk before it was in place because of the high temp on the wire and sometimes the heat shrink was too small to fit over the soldered spot because I made it too big. It was a mess.

I shortened the servo to receiver wires, esc to receiver wires, and got rid of the esc - motor plug. I replaced the Tamiya plugs with Deans. I completed the job but my car still doesn't look like the ones I have seen on the other thread.

What could I be doing wrong? Do I just need more practice?
Also the hottest spot on my soldering iron is not at the very tip. It is at the point where it starts to taper into the cone rather than at the tip of the cone. Should I get another soldering iron? Are there better ones? It is cheap and old but I have not used it much.

But I had fun. Before I realized I had spent four hours working on the car.

You have to keep the tip clean and tinned. I like to use the copper sponge type cleaner. Its works well and the temp doesn't drop on the iron. And get a good wire snip so you can cut and trim the wires good and don't forget shrink tubing.
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Old 03-21-2009, 10:16 AM   #40
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This thread helped me tremendously. Thank you all.
I decided for the servo wires it is a lot easier to just use shrink wrap to shorten it (zig-zag inside) without splicing. And tape it on the chassis using double sided tape or wedge it between the receiver and the ESC.
Keeping the tip clean is very important and putting solder on both sides is important also..
I tried out flux and it makes the job easier.
Thank you again!
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Old 03-21-2009, 06:33 PM   #41
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Another note on splicing: Whenever I need to splice wires, I flare out the ends so they look like a cone. this keeps the strands a fair distance apart. I use the third hand to hold both, press them together, then remove one side and give it a good twist.
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Old 03-22-2009, 04:59 AM   #42
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Does the Much More Super Solder have flux in it or do i need to buy it seperate.
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Old 03-22-2009, 05:07 AM   #43
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Not sure on the much more solder, but I used to use deans solder before they discontinued it. Now I use the Novak racing one and it's very good and melts nice while creating nice solid joints. I use a hakko soldering station with the novak solder and have to say it's been pretty good for me.
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Old 03-22-2009, 08:49 PM   #44
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tucker101 View Post
My soldering joints still suck haha.
I have practiced and practiced.
I just can't do it, they end up messy, when i apply solder to join the wires, i pull the iron away as soon as i melt the solder on to the wires but it drags the solder along with it, and creates sort of a wave looking joint, it looks craphouse.
I have a hot 60W iron and good silver based solder, Much More AG-4
What are all the tips on how to get a perfect solder joint?
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tucker101 View Post
Does the Much More Super Solder have flux in it or do i need to buy it seperate.
I said before and I'll say it again: It all depends on what you consider an acceptable solder joint. My opinion is that the way to get an acceptable solder joint every time (by my standards: look at the pics I posted) is to use [separate] flux each and every time you heat up a joint to solder it.

If the iron is pulling the solder away from the joint that is because the solder was not flowing onto the materials to be joined because of the presence of oxides. Flux removes the oxides. Flux in the solder won't do as good a job as flux applied separately beforehand.
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Old 03-23-2009, 01:40 PM   #45
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Solder is solder. Brand names don't make any difference. just make sure you get the stuff for electronics instead of the stuff for plumbing. You can also get silver content solder and that can be picked up for fairly cheap.
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