2014/2015 WCICS Official Thread
03-20-2015, 09:25 AM
#226
Right now under the current rule set and classes.. We finish early enough on a Saturday ( except Vic ) to practice and still go for dinner, for those that like the social aspect. The guys that want to just practice, they seem to get a solid 3-4 hours after the 3rd quali on Saturday.
To me, this is a huge improvement and gives everyone the option of what they want to do on a Saturday night... which was our ( WCICS team) goal with the changes to we made this season..
I hope this helps give a bit of insight into the behind the scene questions the WCICS team constantly ask ourselves in an effort to improve the racing and the series.
I would like to hear comments from racers that have attended multi races this season to see if the current time table works as it was intended to. Attending one race this season might not give you the full picture of what we are trying to accomplish.
03-20-2015, 09:29 AM
#227
03-20-2015, 09:49 AM
#228
I like our format of 3 rounds Saturday and 1 and a Main on Sunday. Time for dinner on Saturday and to hit the road or make a flight on Sunday.
20 heats per round like in Kamloops seems perfect for me, but with our current format there's room for the Victoria style epic races too.
A little bit more grip from the tires would be nice but as long as we're on spec i'm happy.
20 heats per round like in Kamloops seems perfect for me, but with our current format there's room for the Victoria style epic races too.
A little bit more grip from the tires would be nice but as long as we're on spec i'm happy.
03-20-2015, 10:27 AM
#229
Tech Master
Thread Starter
All I can say is I'm super happy to hear so many positive comments, it really seems like we're hitting all the right notes with the racers!
While everyone understands there is no perfect solution that makes everyone glowingly happy, sounds like we've hit some great sweet spots in most of the classes.
Josh
While everyone understands there is no perfect solution that makes everyone glowingly happy, sounds like we've hit some great sweet spots in most of the classes.
Josh
03-23-2015, 10:39 AM
#230
Tech Master
iTrader: (6)
Sorry for the slow reply; as Korgae said, I was out of town last weekend.
I'll chat with our racers this week but I'm positive that most would be happy to move to a spec tire in 12th Stock as way of removing one of the largest hurdles of understanding and racing the class. Like John in Vancouver, we keep a close eye on Seattle since we do race exchanges with them, and if they are possibly going this route, it would seem like a good move on our part as well.
PS. Incredibly civil and constructive discussion here.
See you all this weekend in Calgary,
Blake
I'll chat with our racers this week but I'm positive that most would be happy to move to a spec tire in 12th Stock as way of removing one of the largest hurdles of understanding and racing the class. Like John in Vancouver, we keep a close eye on Seattle since we do race exchanges with them, and if they are possibly going this route, it would seem like a good move on our part as well.
PS. Incredibly civil and constructive discussion here.
See you all this weekend in Calgary,
Blake
03-24-2015, 09:01 AM
#232
Tech Master
Thread Starter
03-26-2015, 09:04 AM
#233
Scale Spec - In the NW: open bodies non sedan, run included spoilers or scale spoilers, and any D-Compound HPI tire / wheel combo you'd like, with Novak 25.5 motors only, 1450g. Pretty simple rules to stick by, and a good beginner class to step up to from / along mini. There's no winning one-combination, but the competition is definitely high.
At Overgeared, we've adopted the Scale Spec class, but kept the 21.5 motors of the VTA days to simplify the transition. As the new motors in 17.5 and 21.5 get faster and faster, I personally appreciate the limiting factor of 25.5 and perhaps there is room for a single manufacturer to step up and sponsor the class?
At Overgeared, we've adopted the Scale Spec class, but kept the 21.5 motors of the VTA days to simplify the transition. As the new motors in 17.5 and 21.5 get faster and faster, I personally appreciate the limiting factor of 25.5 and perhaps there is room for a single manufacturer to step up and sponsor the class?
I picked up a Novak Boss 25.5 a while back to play around with, as I too was feeling that CTA is becoming yet another TC class (the top CTA cars are essentially qualifying at the back of the TC stock B main at a WCICS event) with the power of the latest round of 21.5's. I was also curious about using the 25.5 as a possible replacement for the Orca mini motor.
Guess what ?
The 25.5 at 50° timing is not that much slower - about 2750 rpm/volt, and the power seems similar to the 21.5's. (By comparison, my collection of 21.5's are in the 2850 range on KV with lots of timing) In car, it was down maybe a couple of tenths in my CTA compared to my 21.5's. Not the drop I was hoping for.
03-26-2015, 09:07 AM
#234
Hi John,
I picked up a Novak Boss 25.5 a while back to play around with, as I too was feeling that CTA is becoming yet another TC class (the top CTA cars are essentially qualifying at the back of the TC stock B main at a WCICS event) with the power of the latest round of 21.5's. I was also curious about using the 25.5 as a possible replacement for the Orca mini motor.
Guess what ?
The 25.5 at 50° timing is not that much slower - about 2750 rpm/volt, and the power seems similar to the 21.5's. (By comparison, my collection of 21.5's are in the 2850 range on KV with lots of timing) In car, it was down maybe a couple of tenths in my CTA compared to my 21.5's. Not the drop I was hoping for.
I picked up a Novak Boss 25.5 a while back to play around with, as I too was feeling that CTA is becoming yet another TC class (the top CTA cars are essentially qualifying at the back of the TC stock B main at a WCICS event) with the power of the latest round of 21.5's. I was also curious about using the 25.5 as a possible replacement for the Orca mini motor.
Guess what ?
The 25.5 at 50° timing is not that much slower - about 2750 rpm/volt, and the power seems similar to the 21.5's. (By comparison, my collection of 21.5's are in the 2850 range on KV with lots of timing) In car, it was down maybe a couple of tenths in my CTA compared to my 21.5's. Not the drop I was hoping for.
Also we have switched to 21.5 in mini class this year for overgeared while still allowing the orca motors and the orca motors are still quite competitive. Our las mini race was won by an orca2200 with a field full of 21.5's and orcas behind.
03-26-2015, 09:14 AM
#235
I like our format of 3 rounds Saturday and 1 and a Main on Sunday. Time for dinner on Saturday and to hit the road or make a flight on Sunday.
20 heats per round like in Kamloops seems perfect for me, but with our current format there's room for the Victoria style epic races too.
A little bit more grip from the tires would be nice but as long as we're on spec i'm happy.
20 heats per round like in Kamloops seems perfect for me, but with our current format there's room for the Victoria style epic races too.
A little bit more grip from the tires would be nice but as long as we're on spec i'm happy.
I am one of the ones who enjoys the social aspects of the WCICS events - and I look forward to spending time outside of the racing BS'ing with friends you only get to see when travelling to the events.
03-26-2015, 09:39 AM
#236
Which 21.5 motor are you running? I have an orca tx 21.5 and when I go racing in the states with a 25.5 it feels painfully slow.
Also we have switched to 21.5 in mini class this year for overgeared while still allowing the orca motors and the orca motors are still quite competitive. Our las mini race was won by an orca2200 with a field full of 21.5's and orcas behind.
Also we have switched to 21.5 in mini class this year for overgeared while still allowing the orca motors and the orca motors are still quite competitive. Our las mini race was won by an orca2200 with a field full of 21.5's and orcas behind.
1 Reedy Mach 2
2 Killshots (rpm and torque stators, 2 different rotors)
1 trackstar
1 tekin gen 2
Dyno'd them all at various timing levels, from stock (~30°) to max (~60°). All very similar power output (~2-3% difference). Haven't put the 25.5 on the dyno, but the track testing shows it only few tenths behind my 21.5s - I was able to TQ club racing with the 25.5.
I should note that the 25.5 is have is the Novak Boss - it has adjustable endbell timing.
Mini is a special animal because it is fixed gearing and front wheel drive. The speed difference between motors is only realized at the end of a long straight. Power increases are not easily realized by most drivers in the infield due to wheel spin issues. On a tight to medium track, any motor is competitive, be it Orca 2200kv - 21.5 - 25.5, but on a track with a long straight, the 21.5/25.5's will easily outrun the Orca. The Orca 2200 is about 500-600 rpm/volt slower than the maxed timing 21.5s, which is huge.
03-26-2015, 10:03 AM
#237
Hi John,
...
Guess what ?
The 25.5 at 50° timing is not that much slower - about 2750 rpm/volt, and the power seems similar to the 21.5's. (By comparison, my collection of 21.5's are in the 2850 range on KV with lots of timing) In car, it was down maybe a couple of tenths in my CTA compared to my 21.5's. Not the drop I was hoping for.
...
Guess what ?
The 25.5 at 50° timing is not that much slower - about 2750 rpm/volt, and the power seems similar to the 21.5's. (By comparison, my collection of 21.5's are in the 2850 range on KV with lots of timing) In car, it was down maybe a couple of tenths in my CTA compared to my 21.5's. Not the drop I was hoping for.
On the novak site they list the 25.5 only 250rpm/volt slower than the 21.5, which agrees with your findings. Still, my 21.5's will absolutely blow away the novak 25.5 boss motor.
Edit: I predict that the new D4 1s 21.5 motor could perform similar to the first gen 17.5 killshots, it seems that way at least.
Last edited by R3VoLuTiOn; 03-26-2015 at 10:15 AM.
03-26-2015, 10:04 AM
#238
Agreed
03-26-2015, 11:02 AM
#239