I haven't checked but I reckon I have more National Championships than you Mark. /witty repartee

And for your information the last time I was offered a sponsorship the sponsor was willing to negotiate the terms with me. In the end I opted out only because I realised I wasn't going to be doing enough driving to represent the brand properly.

Which is all pretty irrelevant really. I mean what sponsor, when told, 'yeah our State and National Championships are control tyre events,' is going to insist you fill in a form for every one of them instead of making a one line change to their standard contract? They'd just be reducing their chances of picking up the best drivers by creating hassle for them.

I'm sure you know best Daniel, clearly the companies that we are dealing with (and other drivers that I talk to that are at the same sponsorship level as Aaron or above) do not allow the use of other manufactures goods unless it has been cleared with them before hand.

Anyway I am still not convinced that a control tire works. It's great if you have that tire already but at least 50% or more wouldn't and need to spend money to buy that tire for that event even when they may have tires from a different manufacturer that would do the job just as well or maybe better?

Control tyre is not about better or worse performance it is about being even for every racer.

As previously stated tyres are key to being fast and they are the largest influence on lap times. Having the right tyre can be the difference between the front of the field of the back.

As per your own post "maybe better?" is exactly the problem.

Yeah i agree with that completely, as long as we are not saying it is cheaper for everyone

Cheers

Mark

Limited number of sets ie 3 sets certainly would.

My question is, haw many people here have travelled interstate or internationally to an open tyre event? I have done 2 cactus classics and FEMCA event in Taiwan. These were both open the events. As a JC team member I still had to take an entire roller bag (similar size to Ogio) just full of tyres for each event. That being said ,I still knew that on the cactus sugared track that barcodes would be the tyre of choice, but I still had to take 50 odd pair in every compound from black the white. Now I know this the extreme end of the discussion , but could the average non sponsored driver afford this extra cost for a state titles?

The last thing that I would want to see is smaller numbers at AARCMCC events due to trying to help out the minority of sponsored drivers in our sport.
Maybe a better option might be that each state uses a different manufactures tyre for each state event so all manufacturers / drivers get to run a little more often with their product.

I do think this form or discussion is a positive move forward for us, it's good to get a broad cross section on certain topics . For the record I would rather see a limit of tyres used rather than a selected control pattern from certain manufacturers , but this is just my view.

Yer John, the impression I'm getting is most of the blokes who get things cheap or free a bitching that its too hard to run control tyre events from other manufacturers. Too bloody bad go back to paying for everything then see how you go. There's not a perfect solution that pleases all. The current rule does make it the easiest possible we all know what we have to take in terms of tyres.
I haven't heard a good change to this rule either online or in person at any track. Sponsored drivers will whinge when their brand isn't chosen as you'd expect, and the queenslanders will whinge either way as is beginning to be expected.

I dont know of any companys that have a problem with said driver doing a AARCMCC round if its not there own brand... i have never heard of a company having an issue with this.

in ep offroad... its the norm that sponsored drivers use other brand products at events where is controlled and not the brand they use..

Nor do you have to ask your sponsor if its ok.

i mean.. i bet Jared Tebo didnt have to ask if it was ok to do the IFMAR worlds last year.. because it was a Proline control tire... and he runs for AKA.

You'd agree Josh would have a better idea than I do about this. He seems to completely agree with me on this point.

It depends how you think about it. If you have a stockpile of tyres for club use, that's great. But you don't think of that as useful for sanctioned events. Control Tyres have been around in EP OFR for so long now that nobody buys tyres for a sanctioned event in advance of the announcement of what they are.

You need a certain number of sets of tyres to do a Nats or a States. Assuming you are going to be racing EP OFR still afterward then you're not actually spending any more money in the long run.

In fact, because of the supply deal AARCMCC EP OFR has the average racer pays less, and the club who do the work of distributing the tyres are entitled to a small margin as well. So really, the only people not winning in this arrangement are the sponsored drivers who are privileged enough to get their tyres for much less than the market value the rest of the time.

The hit you take all at once when you're planning for a States or a Nats is significant though with unlimited sets. Especially when you factor in how much money you're already spending on accommodation, prepping your car, etc. And I agree that can be off-putting. EP ONR has it figured out in this respect. They have limits on the number of sets you can use for racing at the event. That reduces the cost significantly.

But after the event the sponsored guys can no longer use the control tyre.

With unlimited sets you buy 10ish sets which all have 1 run each and still have plenty of life for club days and practice but due to the contract they are not allowed to use them. (Depending on there deal it probably makes up for this anyway)

If events were limited to 3 sets they wouldn't be left over with large numbers of tyres they cant use.

The rules shouldn't be written around sponsored drivers though. I cant use the tyres afterwards, but I can always sell them off at the club which helps other racers (except after the 2013 nats, when they were slicks - but that was the same for everyone).

Its been an interesting discussion, but there seems to be a clear feeling that the current rule is the fairest and no one is strongly opposing the cost. I personally worry about the image of the hobby throwing new sets on each run, but unless we can guarantee foolproof ways of limiting tyres (including tracks that don't chew tyres in 1 run) there isn't a 100% better situation moving forward. Better the devil you know.

Ray

Nailed it i reckon.

I agree and I never suggested the regs should be written around sponsored drivers. Just clarifying the point they appear to be making.

I am all for education rather than regulation but some regulation is esential to reduce costs and level the playing field.
Reducing cost ie limited number of sets has been used in on road for years with great success. It is pretty easy to implement.

If the host club does a proper job of tyre selection (including not just opting for the softest compound available) then there isn't a problem with limiting sets.

Particularly in Stock this should be a no brainer. I haven't done a single event in the last 4 years where I couldn't make the tyres last 3 runs. The problem of course is that I can't do that and be as quick as someone throwing a new set on for each run, because although the car drives fine without it, I'm losing 10ths per lap to everyone else opting for 1 set per run.

New people to sanctioned racing are always wondering just how many sets they need to order. A sensible limit answers that question for them, and ensures we don't approach a supply problem at popular events.