Newer Companies VS. Established Ones
05-07-2008, 09:28 PM
#31
Registered User
Blah, blah, blah....
05-08-2008, 06:40 AM
#32
I apologize!
I miss spoke, I thought OCM was Castor. The RTR package I Saw was a Castor, NOT a OCM. I know nothing About OCM. THE CASTOR I saw looked like a Mugen, and I think the Mugen is a great car.
Im sorry if I ruffled some feathers I didnt mean to.
Trout.
I miss spoke, I thought OCM was Castor. The RTR package I Saw was a Castor, NOT a OCM. I know nothing About OCM. THE CASTOR I saw looked like a Mugen, and I think the Mugen is a great car.
Im sorry if I ruffled some feathers I didnt mean to.
Trout.
05-08-2008, 07:33 AM
#34
I'll make a post on this title based off of facts as some of you have very legit points and some of you are shooting into the dark.
Yes, I truly believe there are new companies out now with product at an equal with some or all of the top companies. I am not one to say our OCM is better than any brand. I truly feel we have came a tremendous way in the development of our product.I truly feel a driver can be just as competitive with our kit as any other. Yes we had some issues in the beginning but I think we proved we are dedicated to fixing issues and making a name in the USA. Look at the first generation kits compared to our current kits...
with that said, the reason these newer companise like us have a solid product at a cheap price is very simple. Mugen, kyosho, etc is just that...huge names with a solid back ground, high paid drivers, etc. So if we want to sell kits in the USA we have to introduce them cheap, work hard with customer service, product, team and start a name. THen as time passes by maybe we introduce a "factory team" kit that gets close in price to say the mugen, AE, etc. At the same time we go over the top and include much more for the money. But you first have to prove yourself. Then you get all of your product line going, and with this comes more income. More income means you can afford names that people recognize to race for you. These drivers win races and put you in the spotlight....
IT all starts small and grows as all companies did. Some will not make it, some will. I work very hard to help people better understand OCM's goals and what our product is about. I love my job and hope we are hear for years to come.
What also makes it hard on small companies is people who say "I seen the OCM, it looked good but broke". Well, that is often overlooked on bigger named companies. With any kit your car is only as good as the mechanic behind it...bottom line. How can almost every guy on my team, including myself take a stock kit, build it and race it for months and months and not have any issues, yet John Doe can not finish a race? Preperation is a majority in this hobby. All these little things make it hard starting out. So you have to catch customers in a sense.
ANother thing I would like to set clear...Caster is not OCM. OCM is not caster. Nothing bad at all to Caster but OCM is OCM. We are located in different places in the USA and have different factories. It is also two very different buggies.
At this point I am very confident as a racer and from a business standpoint on the OCM buggy. We are getting ready to introduce a factory team edition that will be very impressive, the price will be out of the "new company range" but it should still be an attractive price.
I feel we have great customer service and we have just sat a plan in motion to make it even better.
We have held back the release of the truck to assure the public is truly happy with it. Once out a bit we will work to make a factory edition for it as well.
Some of you have great points and seem to know a little about how this industry operates.
Have a good night guy!
Alan Burton
Team OCM USA
Yes, I truly believe there are new companies out now with product at an equal with some or all of the top companies. I am not one to say our OCM is better than any brand. I truly feel we have came a tremendous way in the development of our product.I truly feel a driver can be just as competitive with our kit as any other. Yes we had some issues in the beginning but I think we proved we are dedicated to fixing issues and making a name in the USA. Look at the first generation kits compared to our current kits...
with that said, the reason these newer companise like us have a solid product at a cheap price is very simple. Mugen, kyosho, etc is just that...huge names with a solid back ground, high paid drivers, etc. So if we want to sell kits in the USA we have to introduce them cheap, work hard with customer service, product, team and start a name. THen as time passes by maybe we introduce a "factory team" kit that gets close in price to say the mugen, AE, etc. At the same time we go over the top and include much more for the money. But you first have to prove yourself. Then you get all of your product line going, and with this comes more income. More income means you can afford names that people recognize to race for you. These drivers win races and put you in the spotlight....
IT all starts small and grows as all companies did. Some will not make it, some will. I work very hard to help people better understand OCM's goals and what our product is about. I love my job and hope we are hear for years to come.
What also makes it hard on small companies is people who say "I seen the OCM, it looked good but broke". Well, that is often overlooked on bigger named companies. With any kit your car is only as good as the mechanic behind it...bottom line. How can almost every guy on my team, including myself take a stock kit, build it and race it for months and months and not have any issues, yet John Doe can not finish a race? Preperation is a majority in this hobby. All these little things make it hard starting out. So you have to catch customers in a sense.
ANother thing I would like to set clear...Caster is not OCM. OCM is not caster. Nothing bad at all to Caster but OCM is OCM. We are located in different places in the USA and have different factories. It is also two very different buggies.
At this point I am very confident as a racer and from a business standpoint on the OCM buggy. We are getting ready to introduce a factory team edition that will be very impressive, the price will be out of the "new company range" but it should still be an attractive price.
I feel we have great customer service and we have just sat a plan in motion to make it even better.
We have held back the release of the truck to assure the public is truly happy with it. Once out a bit we will work to make a factory edition for it as well.
Some of you have great points and seem to know a little about how this industry operates.
Have a good night guy!
Alan Burton
Team OCM USA
A prime example is the Team Magic M1B... Now this company spent a lot of time and money trying new ideas that were considered "innovative" and maybe a little extreme. Some of them worked and a lot of them flopped big time! And as some may have seen, they have reverted back to a more "conventional" style of buggy with the M8.
The way i see it, companies that want a piece of the "market share" will look at what is already available, use what they like, and create a machine that, in their view, is different to everything else, even if it is ever so slightly, and at least put there name out there.
IMO, good luck to all the new companies that are releasing "New" products. If they are of good quality, then maybe they will stand they test of time like the bigger brands.... If not, it's back to the drawing board to find another way into the market
At the end of the day, people who are set on the bigger brands will buy those brands. People who are starting out may go for the cheaper (so called, copied) brands, which better suit their budget... Either way, i believe they all have their place!
My 2 cents!
05-08-2008, 07:40 AM
#35
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I would promise you if OCM sponsored me and the car proves to be durable in my hands people would be buying them like mad.As for less expensive being of lesser quality... that isn't always the case. You can buy a Losi race roller for $400 roughly... and parts are dirt cheap for Losi. Lesser quality? I don't think so, although I admit you have to maintain the vehicle.
One of the manufacturers needs to raise the bar in the "RTR" segment. Put in some decent servos (150+ oz .13 speed metal gear steering, 100+ oz throttle) and a radio with exponential. A reliable, easy to tune motor... maybe a few spares for things that commonly break, like front control arms, etc. Call it a "race pack" or "competition pack" or something if you want to differentiate it from the common RTRs. Bump start (hey, if they can make a cheap car in China they can certainly make something as simple as a cheap starter box) and include ignitor, battery pack, charger, tools, everything the new racer needs. Yes, it would cost more... significantly more... but it would be a good way for a new racer to get started.
Last edited by DOMIT; 05-08-2008 at 07:52 AM.
05-08-2008, 07:43 AM
#36
I honestly believe that the reason alot of these new or smaller companies fail is that they simply dont have the exposure at the local club level. Yes it is true that they cant afford the money to pay the major players to run their vehicles but most people know the major drivers could do well with a rc from radioshack
. I think the best way for the companies to grow is by sponsoring more of the small guys to up the exposure of their product. For instance I was very interested in running a Nanda buggy but the cost of the buggy combined with the cost of having to stock extra parts myself is just too much for me to justify the risk. Now on the other hand if I was able to obtain a sponsorship to offset some of the costs that would probably change my mind. Another buggy I looked at was a Crono buggy but I ran into the same problem. See I wont sit on the sidelines cause my car broke a $10 part that my LHS doesnt carry so if I run a "what I would call" an off brand it is crucial that I have enough money to buy extra plastic parts to keep on hand just in case.
I personally would not run a caster even if the parts were available locally cause I just wasnt impressed with the ones that ran at my track but again that is just my opinion. OCM on the other hand I would be willing to try because I only saw one and it was the earliest model, and while it did break, Im not entirely convinced that it was due to parts quality.
. I think the best way for the companies to grow is by sponsoring more of the small guys to up the exposure of their product. For instance I was very interested in running a Nanda buggy but the cost of the buggy combined with the cost of having to stock extra parts myself is just too much for me to justify the risk. Now on the other hand if I was able to obtain a sponsorship to offset some of the costs that would probably change my mind. Another buggy I looked at was a Crono buggy but I ran into the same problem. See I wont sit on the sidelines cause my car broke a $10 part that my LHS doesnt carry so if I run a "what I would call" an off brand it is crucial that I have enough money to buy extra plastic parts to keep on hand just in case.I personally would not run a caster even if the parts were available locally cause I just wasnt impressed with the ones that ran at my track but again that is just my opinion. OCM on the other hand I would be willing to try because I only saw one and it was the earliest model, and while it did break, Im not entirely convinced that it was due to parts quality.
05-08-2008, 07:45 AM
#37
You REALLY don't want to do that. Rules is rules... if you have a chassis sponsorship, you're required to go be a speed bump in the expert class. That's the major reason I didn't "play along" when Mike Battaile was managing the Caster team. I'd rather be a speed bump in sportsman, it doesn't hurt as much.
As for less expensive being of lesser quality... that isn't always the case. You can buy a Losi race roller for $400 roughly... and parts are dirt cheap for Losi. Lesser quality? I don't think so, although I admit you have to maintain the vehicle.
As for less expensive being of lesser quality... that isn't always the case. You can buy a Losi race roller for $400 roughly... and parts are dirt cheap for Losi. Lesser quality? I don't think so, although I admit you have to maintain the vehicle.
I race club racing for the most part but do run the pro series and some other big races so I would only have to run pro/expert in the big races as at my local track they dont apply the chassis sponsor=expert class rule.
As far as Losi I was not impressed with that buggy at all but again that is just my opinion as I know lots of people love it.
05-08-2008, 07:49 AM
#38
05-08-2008, 07:54 AM
#39
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I race club racing for the most part but do run the pro series and some other big races so I would only have to run pro/expert in the big races as at my local track they dont apply the chassis sponsor=expert class rule.
As far as Losi I was not impressed with that buggy at all but again that is just my opinion as I know lots of people love it.
As far as Losi I was not impressed with that buggy at all but again that is just my opinion as I know lots of people love it.
05-08-2008, 08:00 AM
#40
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I honestly believe that the reason alot of these new or smaller companies fail is that they simply dont have the exposure at the local club level. Yes it is true that they cant afford the money to pay the major players to run their vehicles but most people know the major drivers could do well with a rc from radioshack. I think the best way for the companies to grow is by sponsoring more of the small guys to up the exposure of their product. For instance I was very interested in running a Nanda buggy but the cost of the buggy combined with the cost of having to stock extra parts myself is just too much for me to justify the risk. Now on the other hand if I was able to obtain a sponsorship to offset some of the costs that would probably change my mind. Another buggy I looked at was a Crono buggy but I ran into the same problem. See I wont sit on the sidelines cause my car broke a $10 part that my LHS doesnt carry so if I run a "what I would call" an off brand it is crucial that I have enough money to buy extra plastic parts to keep on hand just in case.
I personally would not run a caster even if the parts were available locally cause I just wasnt impressed with the ones that ran at my track but again that is just my opinion. OCM on the other hand I would be willing to try because I only saw one and it was the earliest model, and while it did break, Im not entirely convinced that it was due to parts quality.
. I think the best way for the companies to grow is by sponsoring more of the small guys to up the exposure of their product. For instance I was very interested in running a Nanda buggy but the cost of the buggy combined with the cost of having to stock extra parts myself is just too much for me to justify the risk. Now on the other hand if I was able to obtain a sponsorship to offset some of the costs that would probably change my mind. Another buggy I looked at was a Crono buggy but I ran into the same problem. See I wont sit on the sidelines cause my car broke a $10 part that my LHS doesnt carry so if I run a "what I would call" an off brand it is crucial that I have enough money to buy extra plastic parts to keep on hand just in case.I personally would not run a caster even if the parts were available locally cause I just wasnt impressed with the ones that ran at my track but again that is just my opinion. OCM on the other hand I would be willing to try because I only saw one and it was the earliest model, and while it did break, Im not entirely convinced that it was due to parts quality.
05-08-2008, 08:19 AM
#41
I don't want to seem like I'm bashing the company, but I agree with blowpopracer, I wouldn't own a caster, at least not until they get it right... I owned one for about 3 days, I never even run the car, but just with the final assembly of it, I didn't feel like fighting with all the nitpick shit wrong with it, I felt like I could look at it and it break, lol! Actually one of the front upper arms was cracked when I got it new in box! Lol! But enough about that,
I agree that the nanda/TQ is an awesome buggy for an "unknown brand".... Imo, they all have a fighting chance, but very few new companys can/will work through the critics and make it big...
I agree that the nanda/TQ is an awesome buggy for an "unknown brand".... Imo, they all have a fighting chance, but very few new companys can/will work through the critics and make it big...
05-08-2008, 09:39 AM
#42
I don't want to seem like I'm bashing the company, but I agree with blowpopracer, I wouldn't own a caster, at least not until they get it right... I owned one for about 3 days, I never even run the car, but just with the final assembly of it, I didn't feel like fighting with all the nitpick shit wrong with it, I felt like I could look at it and it break, lol! Actually one of the front upper arms was cracked when I got it new in box! Lol! But enough about that,
I agree that the nanda/TQ is an awesome buggy for an "unknown brand".... Imo, they all have a fighting chance, but very few new companys can/will work through the critics and make it big...
I agree that the nanda/TQ is an awesome buggy for an "unknown brand".... Imo, they all have a fighting chance, but very few new companys can/will work through the critics and make it big...
05-08-2008, 10:21 AM
#43
Big verse Small
I agree with allot of the points that I have read but I would like too point out some small things.
Companies like Kyosho,Mugen, Xray,Jammin,Ho BAo have been in the market for a longer period of time and they have established brand recognition.There is allot to be said for parts quality,yes allot of the manufacturing is know done overseas but not all companies have the same resources as the larger comapanies when it comes too materials.
Most racers want to enjoy there time at the track and that requires finishing the races and low level repair so they can bench race and enjoy there race buddies.
Good materials help that equation.
Companies like Kyosho,Mugen, Xray,Jammin,Ho BAo have been in the market for a longer period of time and they have established brand recognition.There is allot to be said for parts quality,yes allot of the manufacturing is know done overseas but not all companies have the same resources as the larger comapanies when it comes too materials.
Most racers want to enjoy there time at the track and that requires finishing the races and low level repair so they can bench race and enjoy there race buddies.
Good materials help that equation.
05-08-2008, 10:30 AM
#44
I can do that because It wouldn't have held up more than 1 lap, lol! The shock caps threads didn't match up (leaked half the oil in a matter of 10 strokes), the front upper a arm had a crack in it from what looked like molding problems, and I used every diff shim I had to shim the diffs, I'm talking like 10 or 12 per diff... Between all that and not having ANY parts at the time available to fix the problems, I didn't waste my time.... The steering ackerman also hit the a-arm also during susp. Travel also If I recall correctly?
But that's not to say that the car or the company won't make it, that's just saying that at the time I gave it a chance, they weren't prepared to release to the public yet, they had a long ways to go... I wish them the best of luck, I told cameron that when I quit... And we all must agree, we're out there to race, not to have our cars fall apart and not have anything to fix it with...
QUOTE=vnmsgt;4425890]I do not see how you can judge a company like that. Not even driving it or giving it a chance. I have one of the original ZX1-R from like 4 yrs ago. and I have the new zx1-r and all I can is there is a night and day difference. The new ones are great and built just as good as the big guys today. My friend has his losi 8 lose driveshaft pins and loose clutch bell right out of the box so not everyone is perfect.[/QUOTE]
But that's not to say that the car or the company won't make it, that's just saying that at the time I gave it a chance, they weren't prepared to release to the public yet, they had a long ways to go... I wish them the best of luck, I told cameron that when I quit... And we all must agree, we're out there to race, not to have our cars fall apart and not have anything to fix it with...
QUOTE=vnmsgt;4425890]I do not see how you can judge a company like that. Not even driving it or giving it a chance. I have one of the original ZX1-R from like 4 yrs ago. and I have the new zx1-r and all I can is there is a night and day difference. The new ones are great and built just as good as the big guys today. My friend has his losi 8 lose driveshaft pins and loose clutch bell right out of the box so not everyone is perfect.[/QUOTE]
05-08-2008, 02:18 PM
#45
OK, everyone take a breath!
Ok, now I have read all these wonderfull insights into Newer Companies VS. Established Ones I felt it necessary to give my thoughts on the subject. I rarely post on sites ( because most of the time its just a roast ), and people seem to type meaner than they talk in person. On my own site casterracingusa.com I am never on there either! I will say this, Caster Racing Products are about to take a radical leap in innovation. If you dont believe it,
here is the proof. We designed this vehicle here in Iowa. I dont think we copied anyone on this one. When someone has had a problem with our product, I have taken care of it. We did have a problem with the shocks, and I have the replacement product here for it. Our cars are also not being marketed as a high end racer like the xray, kyosho, associated, mugen, and losis of the world ( nor do I want it to ). I have said on multiple occasions that I would rather have the top three podium finishes in the sportsman class at the rc proseries finals be Casters and not have one in the expert class. The sportsman driver pays for his or her own equipment, pro level drivers dont and from my experience, most of the pro level drivers are about themselves and not about the team at all. Not all of them, but a large number of them are that way. I have experienced this first hand! All vehicles have had thier problems also, ie associated revised parts, losi drivetrain wearing out, xray changing thier car multiple times, kyosho had front arm problems, mugen also had front arm problems. I mean the list goes on and on. The only difference is when they have thier problems everyone seems to look the other way. Competition fuels innovation. Im glad to see more vehicles on the track, and Im sorry if smaller companies are stealing market share from the larger ones, but that is business! Sorry for wanting to make rc affordable and putting a roof over my families head at the same time. Let the flamers proceed! cam