TT-01 "Get to Know" Drive on 29 Sept 2007
10-01-2007, 11:49 AM
#106
Tech Apprentice
do nt always think it's the motor when u come to it... the driving counts a lot... how fast r u going in n out of the corner??? n how fast r the guys going in n out of the corner??? how to get a good racing line????
10-01-2007, 11:58 AM
#107
i would like to think that 20 years of remote control hobby has made us competitively fast.but how about the source of power?if the motor aint powerful enough,no amount of skill can fully/totally compensate for the power output.
10-01-2007, 12:41 PM
#108
Sorry to correct you but u are wrong. FYI i was using a Fully Run in silver can and DR KK(Tall Guy) was using a stock Silver Can that was new and unBroken in motor.
In the first 2 laps of the final i was being pressure by him till i made a mistake although i was having a better motor and battery. He was able to enter the coner faster and smoother than me but i was able to pull out faster. Despite the power advantage that i have he was still able to keep up with me. And that is all skill.
Compare the lap time. I was able to make a few under 15 sec lap but inconsistant but Tall Guy on the other hand was able to make 15 sec every lap with consistant. So it is all up to the driving and also how much u know the car. Eg. My car setup is slow into a couner and fast out due to the front semi lock diff VS Tall Guy fast into couner and slow out. I set my car this way due to the fact that i know i have a power advantage and Tall Guy set his car up to his driving style.
TT 01 is a good car to start with due to the fact that there is not much setup that is need to be done. What u need are just some springs to setup.
Anyway hope that more ppl turn up for the next race and most important have fun.
In the first 2 laps of the final i was being pressure by him till i made a mistake although i was having a better motor and battery. He was able to enter the coner faster and smoother than me but i was able to pull out faster. Despite the power advantage that i have he was still able to keep up with me. And that is all skill.
Compare the lap time. I was able to make a few under 15 sec lap but inconsistant but Tall Guy on the other hand was able to make 15 sec every lap with consistant. So it is all up to the driving and also how much u know the car. Eg. My car setup is slow into a couner and fast out due to the front semi lock diff VS Tall Guy fast into couner and slow out. I set my car this way due to the fact that i know i have a power advantage and Tall Guy set his car up to his driving style.
TT 01 is a good car to start with due to the fact that there is not much setup that is need to be done. What u need are just some springs to setup.
Anyway hope that more ppl turn up for the next race and most important have fun.
10-01-2007, 12:57 PM
#109
Anyway for ppl who are interested to know how i run in the motor are written as below.
Run In Voltage 2 Volts
Run In Time 10-12 hours
After Running In RPM 17000-20000 RPM at 7.2 Volts
(RPM depends on which batches of motor)
Amp draw at 7.2 volts 0.8-1.5
(Amp Draw depends on which batches of motor)
(The reading is taken from Much More Motor Master WITHOUT Load)
Equipment used:
Much More Motor Master and Much More Motor Fan
Degreaser and comm drops and bearing/bushing oil
Why 2 volts?
Because that is the best voltage to run in without too much viberation to the two brass bushing and also create the less heat to spoil the magnet.
Can i run at higher voltage?
You can, IF u have enough cooling on the motor and also frequent stoppage to oil the bushing.
The above is what i learn from personnal exp best if want to know more can approach me at BK.
Run In Voltage 2 Volts
Run In Time 10-12 hours
After Running In RPM 17000-20000 RPM at 7.2 Volts
(RPM depends on which batches of motor)
Amp draw at 7.2 volts 0.8-1.5
(Amp Draw depends on which batches of motor)
(The reading is taken from Much More Motor Master WITHOUT Load)
Equipment used:
Much More Motor Master and Much More Motor Fan
Degreaser and comm drops and bearing/bushing oil
Why 2 volts?
Because that is the best voltage to run in without too much viberation to the two brass bushing and also create the less heat to spoil the magnet.
Can i run at higher voltage?
You can, IF u have enough cooling on the motor and also frequent stoppage to oil the bushing.
The above is what i learn from personnal exp best if want to know more can approach me at BK.
10-01-2007, 03:12 PM
#110
For those of you without a motor dyno like a motor master, you can try this method to break in your new silver cans. It's call water dipping. Water will wear the brushes faster.
1. Submerge the motor in water at 3v (2 x D size batts) for 5 to 10 mins to wear the brushes and allow them to sit nicely on the comm. The water should turn murky (residue from the brushes). Use distilled water if available as it has less impurities. DO NOT GET THE CONNECTORS THAT CONNECTS TO YOUR BATTERY SOURCE WET. THE PART WHICH IS SOLDERED TO YOUR MOTOR IS FINE.
2. Repeat step one in clean water for 1 min to flush. The water should be clearer now.
3. Then run it dry to get the water out for another 5 mins. Still at 3v.
4. Disconnect the batts and spray motor spray on the comm.
5. Oil the bushings with bearing oil (the parts where the motor shaft sticks out. The longer end is where you screw on your pinion gear)
6. Spray motor spray after every run to keep the comm clean and shiny, if possible.
7. Remember to oil the bushings every time you use the motor spray, as it cleans away dirt and oil.
* Impt - do not dip your motor in water for too long, or you might not have any brushes left.
1. Submerge the motor in water at 3v (2 x D size batts) for 5 to 10 mins to wear the brushes and allow them to sit nicely on the comm. The water should turn murky (residue from the brushes). Use distilled water if available as it has less impurities. DO NOT GET THE CONNECTORS THAT CONNECTS TO YOUR BATTERY SOURCE WET. THE PART WHICH IS SOLDERED TO YOUR MOTOR IS FINE.
2. Repeat step one in clean water for 1 min to flush. The water should be clearer now.
3. Then run it dry to get the water out for another 5 mins. Still at 3v.
4. Disconnect the batts and spray motor spray on the comm.
5. Oil the bushings with bearing oil (the parts where the motor shaft sticks out. The longer end is where you screw on your pinion gear)
6. Spray motor spray after every run to keep the comm clean and shiny, if possible.
7. Remember to oil the bushings every time you use the motor spray, as it cleans away dirt and oil.
* Impt - do not dip your motor in water for too long, or you might not have any brushes left.
Last edited by vadersing; 10-01-2007 at 03:29 PM.
10-01-2007, 05:27 PM
#111
For those of you without a motor dyno like a motor master, you can try this method to break in your new silver cans. It's call water dipping. Water will wear the brushes faster.
1. Submerge the motor in water at 3v (2 x D size batts) for 5 to 10 mins to wear the brushes and allow them to sit nicely on the comm. The water should turn murky (residue from the brushes). Use distilled water if available as it has less impurities. DO NOT GET THE CONNECTORS THAT CONNECTS TO YOUR BATTERY SOURCE WET. THE PART WHICH IS SOLDERED TO YOUR MOTOR IS FINE.
2. Repeat step one in clean water for 1 min to flush. The water should be clearer now.
3. Then run it dry to get the water out for another 5 mins. Still at 3v.
4. Disconnect the batts and spray motor spray on the comm.
5. Oil the bushings with bearing oil (the parts where the motor shaft sticks out. The longer end is where you screw on your pinion gear)
6. Spray motor spray after every run to keep the comm clean and shiny, if possible.
7. Remember to oil the bushings every time you use the motor spray, as it cleans away dirt and oil.
* Impt - do not dip your motor in water for too long, or you might not have any brushes left.
1. Submerge the motor in water at 3v (2 x D size batts) for 5 to 10 mins to wear the brushes and allow them to sit nicely on the comm. The water should turn murky (residue from the brushes). Use distilled water if available as it has less impurities. DO NOT GET THE CONNECTORS THAT CONNECTS TO YOUR BATTERY SOURCE WET. THE PART WHICH IS SOLDERED TO YOUR MOTOR IS FINE.
2. Repeat step one in clean water for 1 min to flush. The water should be clearer now.
3. Then run it dry to get the water out for another 5 mins. Still at 3v.
4. Disconnect the batts and spray motor spray on the comm.
5. Oil the bushings with bearing oil (the parts where the motor shaft sticks out. The longer end is where you screw on your pinion gear)
6. Spray motor spray after every run to keep the comm clean and shiny, if possible.
7. Remember to oil the bushings every time you use the motor spray, as it cleans away dirt and oil.
* Impt - do not dip your motor in water for too long, or you might not have any brushes left.
Wow...I bet this time round, the race will get more and more fun. Breaking in nicely, will allow your motor to get the right RPM increase. I hope you guys will enjoy the race as much as we can, so that this type of race, can be organise oftenly, with you guys' support, I think shouldnt be a problem.
Thanks Vandersing for sharing your knowledge!
10-01-2007, 06:51 PM
#112
Tech Adept
The only other way is to have controlled motor. Brand new marked silvercans handed out 15 minutes before race. But I doubt new guys want to pay for that, even at a discount.
Or maybe SG can sponsor lend us those, taking them back for next subsequent race. This gives a random chance of picking up a very well maintained one or a badly destroyed one. Just musing.
Or maybe SG can sponsor lend us those, taking them back for next subsequent race. This gives a random chance of picking up a very well maintained one or a badly destroyed one. Just musing.
10-01-2007, 08:02 PM
#113
May i know if there is a major difference between 540 Mabuchi & Johnson Silvercan?
I notice one of them is slightly shiny as compare to the other (dull looks enclosure). Can assist to identify which is which?
RC 540-J Mabuchi & Johnson Silvercan - Issit 27T?
RS540 Sport Tuned Motor - How many T?
GT Tune Motor - How many T?
27T = ~?km/h?
I notice one of them is slightly shiny as compare to the other (dull looks enclosure). Can assist to identify which is which?
RC 540-J Mabuchi & Johnson Silvercan - Issit 27T?
RS540 Sport Tuned Motor - How many T?
GT Tune Motor - How many T?
27T = ~?km/h?
Last edited by alestin; 10-01-2007 at 08:27 PM.
10-01-2007, 09:52 PM
#114
Guys ..i think we are getting a bit out of hand here....power is really nothing without control...before we ask why we are not up to the speed...
we have to ask ourselves some questions...are we using the same gearing?is the car built the same way?is it smooth or is it binding somewhere...are we driving the correct racing line on the track or are we just going wide on every single corner...did we have the bearings placed...most importantly ...did we lose because we made too many errors...remember...every single mistake counts....thats the art of stock class racing..bacause all cars are almost the same speed..it is whether you travel a shorter distance or a longer distance...or cos your line was too tight that you could not carry speed....it comes with practice....Practice makes perfect....
And yes...running in of a motor helps...because it helps to allow more contact patch on the brush and also smoothens the bushings....these are some tips that can help....we no need to go into an extent where we hand out motors ....because this is afterall a fun race....these tips are here for us to share so that we can bring our level of RC higher....
Last of all...some guys looked very fast because they were on IB cells where the voltage was higher and with that..the car definately will be faster...but why go into that when a cheaper and more cost effective way to buy yourself a better time is to practice....finding shortcuts is not the way to go because ultimately we are cheating ourselves on thinking that we had improved when it is the pocket that bought that performance...we must always remember...power is really nothing without control.....The reason we use mabuchi and had such a track was also to allow all of us to realise that money can buy you some performance...but it takes skill to drive it...MOst importantly ,you can win with decent equipment....you do not need any fancy equipment or illegal tricks.....you only need yourself and practice...In stock racing..consistency plays a huge factor....
hope to see more people practicing for the next race....
we have to ask ourselves some questions...are we using the same gearing?is the car built the same way?is it smooth or is it binding somewhere...are we driving the correct racing line on the track or are we just going wide on every single corner...did we have the bearings placed...most importantly ...did we lose because we made too many errors...remember...every single mistake counts....thats the art of stock class racing..bacause all cars are almost the same speed..it is whether you travel a shorter distance or a longer distance...or cos your line was too tight that you could not carry speed....it comes with practice....Practice makes perfect....
And yes...running in of a motor helps...because it helps to allow more contact patch on the brush and also smoothens the bushings....these are some tips that can help....we no need to go into an extent where we hand out motors ....because this is afterall a fun race....these tips are here for us to share so that we can bring our level of RC higher....
Last of all...some guys looked very fast because they were on IB cells where the voltage was higher and with that..the car definately will be faster...but why go into that when a cheaper and more cost effective way to buy yourself a better time is to practice....finding shortcuts is not the way to go because ultimately we are cheating ourselves on thinking that we had improved when it is the pocket that bought that performance...we must always remember...power is really nothing without control.....The reason we use mabuchi and had such a track was also to allow all of us to realise that money can buy you some performance...but it takes skill to drive it...MOst importantly ,you can win with decent equipment....you do not need any fancy equipment or illegal tricks.....you only need yourself and practice...In stock racing..consistency plays a huge factor....
hope to see more people practicing for the next race....
10-01-2007, 09:59 PM
#115
mabuchi...27t....difference between the johnson and mabuchi....hmm..can't asnwer that...
sport tune.....also 27t..
gt tuned...25t.....
sport tune.....also 27t..
gt tuned...25t.....
10-01-2007, 10:14 PM
#116
Khng is right.
Power is nothing without control.
Mabuchi or Johnson doesn't really matter. The performance difference is very slight. No worries.
The reason why we stay with the Silver Can is simple;
1) Its the CHEAPEST.... comes with kit... beat that!
2) It can only go sooo fast. Even with tuning tweaking and care. Keeps the racing even, fun and exciting.
3) Lowest maintenance. No brush to change, no comm to cut. Just clean and oil.
4) Lowest stress on electronics.
5) Longest run time..... again beat that. (Lightly tune maybe 28, but stiff springs and stronger magnets means more drag and heat)
6) Most consistent in performance. When it starts to wear out, performance don't drop like a rock.
Control motor is (in my opinion) a bad thing, cos its like lucky draw, you have no control over how the motor performs.
R/C racing is not only about Race Craft, but also some engineering. The satisfaction you get from preparing a nicely broken in motor and winning with it is great.
About batteries offering higher voltage.
Some guy managed to qualify into A mains, doing 16 laps with brandless GP3700 stick packs, although is was mainly due to a very clean run, avoiding traffic and accidents.
Focus on:
1) Driving (FREE)
2) Tires (1 time cost, can use for many races)
3) Suspension Tuning (FREE)
4) Motor break-in (FREE)
Power is nothing without control.
Mabuchi or Johnson doesn't really matter. The performance difference is very slight. No worries.
The reason why we stay with the Silver Can is simple;
1) Its the CHEAPEST.... comes with kit... beat that!
2) It can only go sooo fast. Even with tuning tweaking and care. Keeps the racing even, fun and exciting.
3) Lowest maintenance. No brush to change, no comm to cut. Just clean and oil.
4) Lowest stress on electronics.
5) Longest run time..... again beat that. (Lightly tune maybe 28, but stiff springs and stronger magnets means more drag and heat)
6) Most consistent in performance. When it starts to wear out, performance don't drop like a rock.
Control motor is (in my opinion) a bad thing, cos its like lucky draw, you have no control over how the motor performs.
R/C racing is not only about Race Craft, but also some engineering. The satisfaction you get from preparing a nicely broken in motor and winning with it is great.
About batteries offering higher voltage.
Some guy managed to qualify into A mains, doing 16 laps with brandless GP3700 stick packs, although is was mainly due to a very clean run, avoiding traffic and accidents.
Focus on:
1) Driving (FREE)
2) Tires (1 time cost, can use for many races)
3) Suspension Tuning (FREE)
4) Motor break-in (FREE)
10-01-2007, 11:06 PM
#118
10-02-2007, 12:21 AM
#119
just my s$0.02 worth for you guys using the shaft driven TT01 chassis.
make sure both the bevel gears in the gearboxes are properly shimmed for the least rolling resistance and ALL bearings in the drivetrain are degreased and lightly oil...this will help to increase the performance of the car...
make sure both the bevel gears in the gearboxes are properly shimmed for the least rolling resistance and ALL bearings in the drivetrain are degreased and lightly oil...this will help to increase the performance of the car...