I'll be at debbies tomorrow. I'm still running brushed though so not sure how much help I'll be. I know whatever set-up Mike Anderson has been using is ballistic (RS with tekin 10.5).

As for tires, magenta/pink is kicking ass for me.

Hi all,

I'm hoping I can get a little input and insight from the more experience 1/12th drivers out there. I just started 1/12th this season (indoor carpet) with a 12R5 and I've been having a blast but I'm struggling to get my car to carry as much corner speed as some of the others I race against.

I've been running the kit setup typically with Yellow rears and Lilac fronts and while the car is fairly easy to drive it seems to push a bit in the corners. It's ballistically fast on the straights with a 17.5 BL and Tekin RS Pro ESC.

Is it typically better to have the car really hooked up with softer tires that allow the car to "carve" harder through the turns or is it better to run harder tires and let the car sort of slide around the corners. I understand the physical changes that changing springs/caster/camber etc. make on the car, I'm just unsure of under what circumstances I'd want to make a change to get the car to carry the most speed through corners.

Sorry for the long-winded post but any insight would be greatly appreciated!

Cheers,
Mike

get those settings and post them here please, it's what I'm running

I don't know his settings but I suspect it's 189 with max boost, minimum physical timing. All you need is to figure out the rollout and rock and roll.

Hyper Mike,

IT's going to depend on the type of push... if it's pushing in the first part of the corner (off power) you can get a little more steering there by making the shock a bit longer (a bit more pod droop) IF the push is mid corner, you can gain some on power steering by raising the front attachment point of the shock a bit.

If it's a double-steer kind of push (starts to steer in, then lets go) try a little heavier oil in the side shock.

IF you feel the need for a little more steering everywhere, I'd go with the next step firmer side springs.

The 12R5 comes with .020 front springs, I wouldn't go lighter than that under most circumstances.

You might also consider trying a set of grey low or orange rear tires. THEse are the same as Yellows, but with a thin outer ring of grey near the sidewall. THese will let the car rotate a bit more than the yellows when the car is in the corners. Going to greay rears will let the car rotate even more.

The 12R5 comes with the gold 12lb spring standard... most of us are running the 14lb red spring on the center shock of our cars (link cars) Changing from the gold to red will let the car rotate a bit better everywhere... that could be all the change you need...

OF course, the simplest solution might just be to treat a wider portion of the front tire before the run... if you're saucing the inner third of the tire, try saucing the inner half... IF I feel I need to sauce more than half the front tire, I usually look elsewhere for the solution though.

I think my first move would be to try the red spring on the shock... keeping everything else the same for now. If I still wanted more overall steering, I'd go one step up on the side springs.

Out of curiosity, what body are you running? It can make a big difference in the balance of the car...

For the guys cleaning the tires with lighter fluid between rounds is it because the tires are getting a build up on them? I typically don't clean my tires during the day and my car get's faster and faster all day long, but the two tracks I frequent their isn't any build up on the tires. Thanks.

I don't always clean, but sometimes the car comes off the track with a diorty buildup on the tires, it almost looks "salt and peppery". When I see that I clean it up with the lighter fluid. Also I'll clean them if the tires come off the track feeling at all tacky or gummy.

Without the cleaning, the grip increases from one run to the next. If there is plenty of grip in the track already, that can slow your lap times down... if I feel I have plenty of grip, I clean. If I feel like a little more grip could help, I don't...

Trips...thank you very much for the reply.

I would characterize it as a general lack of steering everywhere through the corners...I just don't seem to be able to enter or drive through the corner as quickly as I'd like/as others seem to be able to do.

I'm already saucing the fronts at 1/2 to 3/4 which was part of the reason I was thinking I should look elsewhere for a solution.

I had tried Jaco grey rears but found that I just couldn't get the forward drive I was looking for that I get with the softer tires. Who makes the Orange tires you referenced?

I think I'll try your suggestion of going to the red center spring and see how that feels and maybe try the next step harder side springs if I need more.

Is there a point at which having too much turn-in and overall steering would actually make the car slower or should I be looking for as much steering as I can get while still having the car driveable?

BTW I'm using a Black Art (CRC) closed cockpit body and it seems to work pretty well.

Thanks again,

Mike

For the general overall lack of steering I think you'll like the red spring better. IT should give you some more everywhere.

Jaco makes the oranges, CRC makes the "grey-low". IF you didn't like the loss of forward drive with greys, you probably won't like the oranges either. I noticed a loss of forward bite with them compared to yellows, it made the car pretty sketchy off the corners.

That's where I'd start... the slightly longer shock and raising the front of the shock suggestions are subtle changes... I don't think either would be right to get more steering everywhere... I use them more to fine tune entry and exit steering balance.

There's definitely a point where you can have too much steering... when you get there the car will feel slow in the corners... like having the brakes on while turning... no slide, but slow. Slow off the corners too. IF the car feels like it has good rip exiting corners, you're probably not at the point of too much grip in front... but when you DO get there it's not immediately apparent that that's what's happening... it's like your lap times just fall off and you're not sure why...

I'm running that body too. Great balance, easy to drive. The Parma Speed8 lightweight might feel like it has a touch more steering than the Black Art, but my laps are a little faster with the Black Art.

Trips,

Thanks again for all your help...I really appreciate it.

I'm going to try the red spring (and if necessary a few other things) tonight at our club race and hopefully I can dial it in!

Cheers,
Mike

Sorry guys...one more (dumb) question for Trips or anyone else!

When would you choose to go to a softer front tire or harder rear tire to gain more turning versus making changes to springs/shock position/etc?

For example I could change from Lilac front tires to Dbl Pink front tires OR I could change to the stiffer shock spring to get more turning. When would you choose to do one over the other? Is there any difference?

Sorry to be a pain!

Cheers,
Mike

I would agree with everything Trips gave you Hyper if that's worth anything. I've been wheeling around the R5 for a few weeks now. If you built it with the stock setup I could see where you would be looking for more steering. I've about got mine where I want it.

Wow, that's a good question and I'm afraid I don't really have a good answer... I'm gonna sit back and see what people have to say on this subject... this could be interesting.

Well I'm no top racer or tuner so if I'm wrong someone please correct me...

The way I look at tire vs spring is that tires are usually a more radical change and springs/shock position is more fine tuning. If I need a large change in handling I look to tires but if I'm close I look at setup. Also I try to take in account what other people are running and if I am running those tires already I would be more inclined to think it was my setup.

I do tend to be something of a follower when it comes to tires... if I'm on the same tires as the guys on top of the results, I tend to look at chassis... if I'm on different tires and a bunch of people are going faster than me, I'll try the tires the majority of them are using...

Not the most scientific method.