5LikesSC10 4x4 Thread
02-05-2012 | 12:37 PM
Joined: Nov 2004
Posts: 2,974
From: Norwood, OH...and CCRCR and The OhioRCFactory
OK man, and i guess Sym and I just lying and making this up as its pretty obvious by vids that i suck...... How can both trucks act the same in the air when the motors are two different directions and locations? How can the weight be more centralized in the SC10 when the motor is in the back as well as the ESC and RX. Why do most add weight to the front of the truck?
OK OK you caught me, i secretly snuck into every SC10 owners pit friday morning and added all of my parts and changed their setup just so i could come on here today and argue with you two like i dont have better things to do than entertain your ridiculous points. I could have kept my mouth shut instead i decided to share my experience from this weekend in hopes that we (excluding you and WC) could come up with a solution. But instead you , like clockwork chime in with your useless info and 3rd person rant about a backwards fact that you in your own mind makes sense. claiming a sc10 jumps like a losi is retarded.
"If anything, in theory, the SC10 4x4 would be easier to do that in BOTH directions, since the motor's rotation would counteract going one way."
let me break this down for you:
That statement is true but it only counter acts in one way easy and the other way much harder since right now the motor spins opposite of the wheels and that direction determines the general tendencies in the air. The Losi motor rotation can only effect "twisting" in the air. both trucks have four wheels that spin the same way and when they accelerate/decellerate of course it will have a gyroscopic effect how can it not?
OK OK you caught me, i secretly snuck into every SC10 owners pit friday morning and added all of my parts and changed their setup just so i could come on here today and argue with you two like i dont have better things to do than entertain your ridiculous points. I could have kept my mouth shut instead i decided to share my experience from this weekend in hopes that we (excluding you and WC) could come up with a solution. But instead you , like clockwork chime in with your useless info and 3rd person rant about a backwards fact that you in your own mind makes sense. claiming a sc10 jumps like a losi is retarded.
"If anything, in theory, the SC10 4x4 would be easier to do that in BOTH directions, since the motor's rotation would counteract going one way."
let me break this down for you:
That statement is true but it only counter acts in one way easy and the other way much harder since right now the motor spins opposite of the wheels and that direction determines the general tendencies in the air. The Losi motor rotation can only effect "twisting" in the air. both trucks have four wheels that spin the same way and when they accelerate/decellerate of course it will have a gyroscopic effect how can it not?
Why do you get so worked up when somebody disagrees with you, and asks questions simply to gain further understanding?
The dogbones, outdrives, diff internals, etc, are really not any beefier/heavier than the SC10 4x4's, so the weight of the SCTE is really kind of a non-issue...unless you think those ring gears are the ticket?
Dunno, guys, with stick packs or rear-mounted saddles ThunderbirdJunkie's SC10 4w was very VERY reactive in the air, to a fault. The SCTE actually feels calmer ITBJHO.
02-05-2012 | 12:38 PM
I would think by flipping the motor you would actually lose more air control. I've never tried it, so I cant comment much further. Oh and the motor rotation direction is the same as a Durango buggy built with 3 gear transmission, not 4.
However, if you were to add and idler gear in the rear diff, you would either have to add one to the front, or figure out a way to add the rear one between the pinion and spur as your belt would run backward if not.
However, if you were to add and idler gear in the rear diff, you would either have to add one to the front, or figure out a way to add the rear one between the pinion and spur as your belt would run backward if not.
First of all thank you for chiming in!
Like Cam was saying im talking about spinning the motor backwards and using an idler gear mounted on the motor plate to keep everything moving the right way.
As you said right now the motor rotates like a RM3 setup but the SC10 is midmotor so the effect will not be the same. This is uncharted territory and it may not even work, could possibly even be worse but until someone at least tries we will not know! I am willing to put out the cash and time to find out, i have to figure something out and quick!
02-05-2012 | 12:57 PM
Joined: Mar 2008
Posts: 5,717
From: At dirt tracks in Michigan!
First of all thank you for chiming in!
Like Cam was saying im talking about spinning the motor backwards and using an idler gear mounted on the motor plate to keep everything moving the right way.
As you said right now the motor rotates like a RM3 setup but the SC10 is midmotor so the effect will not be the same. This is uncharted territory and it may not even work, could possibly even be worse but until someone at least tries we will not know! I am willing to put out the cash and time to find out, i have to figure something out and quick!
Like Cam was saying im talking about spinning the motor backwards and using an idler gear mounted on the motor plate to keep everything moving the right way.
As you said right now the motor rotates like a RM3 setup but the SC10 is midmotor so the effect will not be the same. This is uncharted territory and it may not even work, could possibly even be worse but until someone at least tries we will not know! I am willing to put out the cash and time to find out, i have to figure something out and quick!
http://www.rctech.net/forum/electric...-products.html
I raced and did r&d for them a while. The setup worked, but the idler gear wore out very quickly and bound up quite a bit.
02-05-2012 | 12:58 PM
You're right, the Losi's motor direction can only affect twisting in one direction. 1/8 scales don't rotate on the longitudinal axis because of motor rotation, they use the steering to accomplish that. Which is precisely what ThunderbirdJunkie did on his SC10 4x4.
Why do you get so worked up when somebody disagrees with you, and asks questions simply to gain further understanding?
It has more rotating mass along the longitudinal axis, but apart from the diffs being a tad heavier from the steel ring gear, there shouldn't be any significant extra rotating mass, especially that which would overcome the extra static weight on the chassis.
The dogbones, outdrives, diff internals, etc, are really not any beefier/heavier than the SC10 4x4's, so the weight of the SCTE is really kind of a non-issue...unless you think those ring gears are the ticket?
Dunno, guys, with stick packs or rear-mounted saddles ThunderbirdJunkie's SC10 4w was very VERY reactive in the air, to a fault. The SCTE actually feels calmer ITBJHO.
Why do you get so worked up when somebody disagrees with you, and asks questions simply to gain further understanding?
It has more rotating mass along the longitudinal axis, but apart from the diffs being a tad heavier from the steel ring gear, there shouldn't be any significant extra rotating mass, especially that which would overcome the extra static weight on the chassis.
The dogbones, outdrives, diff internals, etc, are really not any beefier/heavier than the SC10 4x4's, so the weight of the SCTE is really kind of a non-issue...unless you think those ring gears are the ticket?
Dunno, guys, with stick packs or rear-mounted saddles ThunderbirdJunkie's SC10 4w was very VERY reactive in the air, to a fault. The SCTE actually feels calmer ITBJHO.
02-05-2012 | 12:59 PM
You're right, the Losi's motor direction can only affect twisting in one direction. 1/8 scales don't rotate on the longitudinal axis because of motor rotation, they use the steering to accomplish that. Which is precisely what ThunderbirdJunkie did on his SC10 4x4.
Why do you get so worked up when somebody disagrees with you, and asks questions simply to gain further understanding?
It has more rotating mass along the longitudinal axis, but apart from the diffs being a tad heavier from the steel ring gear, there shouldn't be any significant extra rotating mass, especially that which would overcome the extra static weight on the chassis.
The dogbones, outdrives, diff internals, etc, are really not any beefier/heavier than the SC10 4x4's, so the weight of the SCTE is really kind of a non-issue...unless you think those ring gears are the ticket?
Dunno, guys, with stick packs or rear-mounted saddles ThunderbirdJunkie's SC10 4w was very VERY reactive in the air, to a fault. The SCTE actually feels calmer ITBJHO.
Why do you get so worked up when somebody disagrees with you, and asks questions simply to gain further understanding?
It has more rotating mass along the longitudinal axis, but apart from the diffs being a tad heavier from the steel ring gear, there shouldn't be any significant extra rotating mass, especially that which would overcome the extra static weight on the chassis.
The dogbones, outdrives, diff internals, etc, are really not any beefier/heavier than the SC10 4x4's, so the weight of the SCTE is really kind of a non-issue...unless you think those ring gears are the ticket?
Dunno, guys, with stick packs or rear-mounted saddles ThunderbirdJunkie's SC10 4w was very VERY reactive in the air, to a fault. The SCTE actually feels calmer ITBJHO.
I only get worked up when you disagree and that stems from your comment weeks ago about me being non American. Up until today i NEVER responded to anything you post but for some reason you find EVERYTHING I say to be wrong like I am stupid. Maybe its the way you come across but questioning my patriotism is not good
You seem to only post to start crap while i am ALWAYS posting about my experiences good and bad to help the community. Im telling what i saw and it wasnt just me or my setup. PM anyone that knows me and if nothing else they will tell you that i test ALOT, im at the track at least four times a week putting countless hours/laps on this truck. When you see EVERY truck with the same problem and different setups where does the finger need to point? on the last track my truck was perfect and on every other track around here it is competitive and super quick but this track exposed a weakness on this platform simple as that. You and WC are both part timers as far as i am concerned and obviously are not fast enough to realize there is a problem that needs to be addressed. My truck is fairly reactive in the air at lower speeds but at full speed there is no control or at least not enough to get you out of trouble.Here is a fact:
EVERY SINGLE SC10 WAS EXPOSED THIS WEEKEND, NONE COULD MAKE THE QUADS OR TRIPLES ONLY ONE SC10 WAS IN THE A MAIN.WE GOT OUR ASS HANDED TO US BY THE LOSI.
So anything you say to combat that is just silly, its a fact meaning that its not arguable. You cant disagree with a fact black is black, blue is blue. By arguing with me your just saying that i am lying for some reason. Instead of trying to prove me wrong why dont you spend that energy helping us racers?
I only attack when cornered, keep that in mind
02-05-2012 | 01:09 PM
MantisWorx: Is there a vid out there showing the condition you are experiencing? i did some light searching and on some general SC10 4x4 jump vids, it seemed that at time they just couldn't control the vehicle in mid air on throttle or hard brake as you would expect on a different one. Wasn't consistent but did happen.
Last edited by Cain; 02-05-2012 at 01:19 PM.
02-05-2012 | 01:16 PM
I am assuming that you would want to see the condition being reported before believing it was true the other way around right?
MantisWorx: Is there a vid out there showing the condition you are experiencing? i did some light searching and on some general SC10 4x4 jump vids, it seemed that at time they just couldn't control the vehicle in mid air on throttle or hard brake as you would expect on a different one. Wasn't consistent but did happen.
MantisWorx: Is there a vid out there showing the condition you are experiencing? i did some light searching and on some general SC10 4x4 jump vids, it seemed that at time they just couldn't control the vehicle in mid air on throttle or hard brake as you would expect on a different one. Wasn't consistent but did happen.
02-05-2012 | 01:21 PM
Okay. If you can take a vid that would be great.
I notice something similar now I think about it on the tight indoor carpet track. Now of course my conditions are way different, but i didn't at least feel the same kind of throttle control to pull up the front end or bring it down as my buddies SCRT10. But, it didn't stick out much to me at the time as the vehicle was money every where else and I chalked it up to lack of time with the truck.
I notice something similar now I think about it on the tight indoor carpet track. Now of course my conditions are way different, but i didn't at least feel the same kind of throttle control to pull up the front end or bring it down as my buddies SCRT10. But, it didn't stick out much to me at the time as the vehicle was money every where else and I chalked it up to lack of time with the truck.
02-05-2012 | 01:23 PM
no video but i am going back to the track this week to try and redeem myself at least a little bit. But it was just as you said, it seems like if you go anywhere beyond lets say...22* you have no control and cant bring it down and the same goes for nose down. If you add 100% brake its manageable but of course driving around the rest of the track sucks, at least for the way i drive. Of course this depends on the lip and so forth but the tendencies are the same. It was never as noticeable as it was this weekend on this track.
02-05-2012 | 01:35 PM
i am going tuesday to do some on road anyway but planned on leaving around 2 to come back but if you want to come out i will stay the whole day, its driving me crazy. Dont know if i can rig up a counter gear by then though...
02-05-2012 | 01:40 PM
Class starts at 1pm, but I have a test and should be done quickly. Ill bring my stuff in the car and head out asap! Gotta get this figured out!
02-05-2012 | 02:22 PM
i am not taking one side or another....but for the nose to be thrown down when applying the brake in air, the wheels must have been moving in the first place. if you come off a jump incorrectly, and you are too far nose down, no amount of throttle is going to bring the nose up. this is much more pronounced with the added weight of the exotek. i am still adjusting to this.
that being said... losi's are more reactive in the air. from what i have seen from capable drivers is that they can make jumps that a nitro 1/8 buggy cannot. the only thing you can do is focus on your line.
that being said... losi's are more reactive in the air. from what i have seen from capable drivers is that they can make jumps that a nitro 1/8 buggy cannot. the only thing you can do is focus on your line.
02-05-2012 | 02:37 PM
i am not taking one side or another....but for the nose to be thrown down when applying the brake in air, the wheels must have been moving in the first place. if you come off a jump incorrectly, and you are too far nose down, no amount of throttle is going to bring the nose up. this is much more pronounced with the added weight of the exotek. i am still adjusting to this.
that being said... losi's are more reactive in the air. from what i have seen from capable drivers is that they can make jumps that a nitro 1/8 buggy cannot. the only thing you can do is focus on your line.
that being said... losi's are more reactive in the air. from what i have seen from capable drivers is that they can make jumps that a nitro 1/8 buggy cannot. the only thing you can do is focus on your line.