Trinity SS DQ'd from JC Stock Nationals?
04-28-2015, 05:11 AM
#91
A few points.
1. I believe the report was .1mm, not .01mm. Order of magnitude difference there.
2. Tolerances are for set dimensions, not minimum/maximum dimensions. A set dimension would be something like saying you have to use a 12.5mm rotor only +/-.2. A minimum or maximum dimension is a line you can not cross but have plenty of room for tolerance on the other side.
1. I believe the report was .1mm, not .01mm. Order of magnitude difference there.
2. Tolerances are for set dimensions, not minimum/maximum dimensions. A set dimension would be something like saying you have to use a 12.5mm rotor only +/-.2. A minimum or maximum dimension is a line you can not cross but have plenty of room for tolerance on the other side.
04-28-2015, 05:56 AM
#92
So murff has the worlds finest calipers? He has to robotic features to pertectly center them each time in the same spot on every motor? Man....murff is a Machine. Only trinity motors are having a problem.....at a race reedy ae sponsored at a track that the reedy race is put on at. yet no reedy product (even the batteries...are they roar approved yet? Idk that's why I'm asking) is close to being illegal. Why do we give a motor company the right to say what is right and wrong during tech? Seems like the lack of control lies solely on ocrc jconcepts and the sponsors of this race. And murff dq'd other brands than his at hotrod last year. And let's not forget the fiasco at cactus. Murff isn't the only one to blame. But if reedy won this race..won cactus...and never gets in the slightest trouble...at all. Who is calling the shots? Could it be the biggest competion to trinity stemming from years back. and the biggest issues always seem to be at races closest to a particular company....ummmmmmmm reedy
04-28-2015, 06:44 AM
#94
Socket, i was not at the race nor do i control how they enforce the rules. The events stipulations should have been available by the time sign up started or if for some reason changed after but before the event should have been made available. Personally i think motor tech should be at the start of the day and sealed. It really boils down to staffing and equipment. Perhaps they chose to manage what they could with the resources at hand. What I am seeing is people wanting/expecting Formula 1 scruteenering at a non-sanctioned event. Are you guys checking stator length and inductance each week at the Club Champs? Highly doubt it unless somebody won the lottery and had a few bills to spend on certified mics and lcr as well as the education to properly use it.
If anything this event just proves the point that its time to slow down stock motor speeds to the point that joe serious steps up to mod.
If anything this event just proves the point that its time to slow down stock motor speeds to the point that joe serious steps up to mod.
This is a non-ROAR event - so nothing sides on them.
It's interesting how a track will cherry pick what they want for rules - and then wait until after the mains to DQ people.
Pre-tech and sealed motors should be the method used going forward. This will allow people to either buy or use a different motor, and not blow money on the entire experience and then lose the result they worked hard for.
This falls on Trinity for having loose tolerances, the track for not pre-teching, and the racer for not pre-teching.
I am basicly done with 17.5 - I built a 1430 car, I had fun, and finished well in a state stacked with 17.5 racers. I've over this though - I'll run modified and not worry about this again....
Let's say I do race the OCRC "nats" next year - I will definitely be running down the tech guy to check my shit before it ever touches the track, because I would not be a happy camper if I were DQ'd after all was done.
04-28-2015, 08:08 AM
#95
Trinity submitted the motor to roar. It passed roar inspection....the same motor you buy is the same submitted. Roar then changed the rules but grandfathered the d4 ss in. The new rule allows for no varience....so to be truly in line with the rule the intrude nt that measures it must be placed perfectly and calibrated perfectly for no variance. In the real world this does not happen. So it falls on the tech guy to judge based upon the rules we use in the us. And he does what he always does.....plain and simple. He's a motor company that also is a roar tech official who us then hired to run tech at races. What do you think is going to happen? His judgment is what dq'd people not trinity not roar (because it's not an official roar race only). He says that it was under. I think blaming roar completely and blaming trinity is way off base. Maybe.we need to look at who we use for tech. What and who they represent. And maybe just maybe find a outside source to provide tech. We shoot ourselves in the foot over and over in stock by doing this. And until the human element of judgement and or who one likes dislikes who one represents is out of the equation then this back and forth of tech will never end. It has to be a global ruling. It has to be a global standard of tech equipment. the stuff we use has to be consistant. A 100 dollar fluke brand meter is tested by the National fire agency. It's listed to be a gold standard. Use them. Use nice calipers. Whatever it is make it the same across the board
04-28-2015, 08:39 AM
#96
The saddest aspect of this whole situation is that there are racers trying to justify illegal gear. How could R/C racing have sunk so low? Really pathetic.
04-28-2015, 08:51 AM
#97
Trinity submitted the motor to roar. It passed roar inspection....the same motor you buy is the same submitted. Roar then changed the rules but grandfathered the d4 ss in. The new rule allows for no varience....so to be truly in line with the rule the intrude nt that measures it must be placed perfectly and calibrated perfectly for no variance. In the real world this does not happen. So it falls on the tech guy to judge based upon the rules we use in the us. And he does what he always does.....plain and simple. He's a motor company that also is a roar tech official who us then hired to run tech at races. What do you think is going to happen? His judgment is what dq'd people not trinity not roar (because it's not an official roar race only). He says that it was under. I think blaming roar completely and blaming trinity is way off base. Maybe.we need to look at who we use for tech. What and who they represent. And maybe just maybe find a outside source to provide tech. We shoot ourselves in the foot over and over in stock by doing this. And until the human element of judgement and or who one likes dislikes who one represents is out of the equation then this back and forth of tech will never end. It has to be a global ruling. It has to be a global standard of tech equipment. the stuff we use has to be consistant. A 100 dollar fluke brand meter is tested by the National fire agency. It's listed to be a gold standard. Use them. Use nice calipers. Whatever it is make it the same across the board
nah, the saddest part is reps from other motor companies trying to harpoon another company and leaving customers/hobbyists/racers in their wake...
04-28-2015, 09:00 AM
#99
i dont' know about "always". since i've been in the hobby, i've only heard of/experienced the D3.5 and the D4 SS. imo, the D3.5 thing was BS and trinity and their customers got screwed and so far from what i've read, with the current SS debacle, it's BS and trinity and their customers got screwed. of course i reserve the right to change my mind if some more info on this situation comes out. i'm only going off of what i've read here. if there's more to it, i'd readily admit i was wrong.
04-28-2015, 09:01 AM
#100
Did i read that right?
The Tech has ties with a competing motor line (Manufacture A).. The DQ's came from the competition(Manufacture B) of that competing line at an event that is sponsored by(Manufacture A)?
The Tech has ties with a competing motor line (Manufacture A).. The DQ's came from the competition(Manufacture B) of that competing line at an event that is sponsored by(Manufacture A)?
04-28-2015, 09:04 AM
#101
I probably should have not used the word 'always'....but I will say the last 2 high profile "cheater" motors came from the same company. I will say without a doubt the person that got dq'd at this race did not knowingly assemble a "cheater" motor. He bought it and put it in his car.
04-28-2015, 09:09 AM
#103
Wasnt there motor teching drama at the Hot Rod Shootout race last year? Who teched the motors at that race?
04-28-2015, 09:13 AM
#104
04-28-2015, 09:22 AM
#105
True. And to my knowledge this was also done at the ROAR Nationals last year for Stock classes. Smaller events don't usually have the personnel/knowledge to accomplish this in a timely manner. This is the first year that this level of tech was done at this race.