Can anyone tell me if there is that big of a difference between the mt4/mt4s radios to justify the $100 more in price?

To get the whole story you should think about reading the MT4S thread
http://www.rctech.net/forum/radio-el...anwa-mt4s.html

Or go to their website and read for yourself.
http://www.airtronics.net/index.php/...-radios-1.html

a backlit screen and faster response times are really it. I am perfectly happy with my mt4, and see no need for the mt4s, but i certainly wouldn't turn it down if offered for free as an upgrade. it is 100, and in this hobby 100 can buy a pretty nice servo or motor.

The MT4S also offers the ability to change esc settings remotely from the radio if paired with the 472 receiver and their esc, the vortex zero. Add that with the telemetry features and you have a level of system integration unmatched by anyone else in the industry. I look at it as a m12 for $150 less, not a mt4 for $100 more.

That's probably the right way of looking at it. It's got a ton of features and is very competitively priced.

I wouldn't upgrade from my MT4 though. I don't use Sanwa ESCs, and I actually don't even use the telemetry on my MT4. Take a good look at what you use on your radio. If you don't own a Sanwa Vortex Zero, then you kinda miss out on a pretty cool feature of the MT4s/M12. Sure, there's lower (zero?) response time, but are you really such a good driver that .001 sec makes a difference to you?

That's why I laugh whenever people say, "Oh yea I switched from X brand to Y brand and I really noticed the faster speed" (even though it's a 2ms difference... 2/1000th of a sec... really?) It couldn't possibly have been that the radio had a different feel and weight in your hand, or that the steering wheel felt much different. It MUST be the two-thousandths of a second that your mind can't even react to.

Getting a high end radio with low response time is not always the full picture. Some of the high end radios have much lower AVERAGE and STABLE response times. Cheaper radios may only be 2ms or 4ms slower on the min. response time advertised, but have a much higher average response time that fluctuates much more.

So the feel of a high end radio with LOW response time also is the feel of a LOW AVERAGE and STABLE response time.

And that can be a noticable difference.

And again, I think the bigger change going from say, a SpektrumDx2s to an mt4s is the feel. Anyone switching brands like that always says, "Oh yeah this radio is much faster! I'm turning in too early now and it feels like I steer better!" The radio's settings and the feel of the wheel plays a bigger role in that, over 2-3ms.

I've run Airtronics' best receiver against its worst receiver in the same car and noticed 0 difference. Now, I'm not the greatest driver in the world, but I'm no scrub either. I was TRYING to notice a difference, to justify the price disparity, but I couldn't. I drove both cars the exact same.

Well, it is OK to do all kind of tuning tricks and setups on your car, tweaking of the esc, to gain an every little advantage or better feel, but when you change your radio gear to a high end you are suddenly a dork.

It's just fine tuning (and even more to some), just as any other setup changes you make.

It's all about the feeling of the car.

If your car is otherwise top notch, and you can not feel the difference between a Spektrum DX2S and a MT-4S then good news for you, you then do not have spend dollars on high end equipment. Buy the cheaper RTR stuff and be happy.

It's just like discussing high end stereos. Some can hear the superior quality, others cannot tell the difference between a high end stereo and a cheap one. This doesn't mean that the high end stereo is not better than the cheap one. It just means that some people do not have the ability to comprehend it.

I do agree with you there. There is a bit of subjectivity, but I suppose at its base, numbers don't lie, and the Airtronics/Sanwa DOES have faster response time, no matter if you can feel a difference or not.

I think it's kinda a situation in which if you have a nice radio already, like a 4PLS/MT4, then upgrading to a MT4S would be kinda useless.

I actually just bought an MT-4S to replace my sons 4PL, sorry

The 4PL have a 7ms response time, the MT-4S approaching 1ms.

We were out driving yesterday and my son said he could clearly feel that it was quicker and more responsive.

Maybe, maybe not?

Uh huh.

.007 vs .001 of a second. Huge gap, something that the human mind can easily perceive.

Wonder if I should bring up the benefits of bi-wiring speakers.
Clearly, the bass is tighter, the mids less bloated and the highs are....oh, never mind.

The power of believing

I did notice the difference when going from radio to radio. El cheapo MX sport to a MT4 was a difference. MT4 to a M11X was a difference. Best combo I have found is using the M11x receivers with my MT4 in FHS3 mode. I think the standard MT4 receivers are horrible. I don't use telementry so those receivers seemed to have a lag.

I got a RX472 receiver with my mt4s set to SHR and I haver not lag.