Or maybe these Pro-Drivers can send me their vehicles so I can solder them up for $100 a pop!

Ask for Information
 

Hi All,

I just installed Orion Vortex R8.1 Pro and stupidly cut on of the wire too short.. :cry:

I tried to change the wire from the ESC Board but it seems that the solder tin is very very very difficult to melt.

I stopped my attempt to change the wire because I am afraid of burning the PC Board.

DO You guys have any suggestion?

Cheers.. :)

You need an iron that has a lot of thermal mass.

You need the iron to hold heat and put it out quickly to the wire.

You can't cheap out on the iron for this, and the tip shape needs to be wide and flat to maximize surface area.

Or you can use a bullet connector to add extra wire to the end you cut.

Hello marine6680,

Thank You very much for Your concern and replying my question.

At the moment I am using OKI Soldering System PS-900. I would say that this Soldering Iron is pretty good. I am honestly a beginner but I could solder the other joints motors and battery plug with ease, I would say, very easy.

But to melt the solder tin on that ESC Board is suspiciously difficult. So, that is why I was thinking maybe the factory is using another type of Tin, maybe?

And the most importantly, do You recommend changing the Factory wire or not?

Is it common to change the wire, I ask this because this is my first time doing a serious Electric Car for serious racing. I spend most of my time on Nitro Class.. Haha..

Cheers.. :)

Thats a fixed temp iron.

From what I can see, tip selection controls the actual working temperature of the tip. I can not find info on the type of heating element.

It is possible that the factory solder is a high temp type... Or its simply the large mass at the connection preventing the solder from heating quickly before the heat conducts down the wire and away from the solder connection.

Getting the heat to move into the connection quickly is the key.

Getting a new tip seems like a likely first step. Soldering is all about heat control and nuance.


Changing the wire is the best way to repair it to where you need it to be. But extending the existing wire using a high amp bullet connector to join an extra length piece, is the easiest method.

Sorry for the random question but I am having an issue I never faced before. For some reason when I try to clean the solder tip on a wet sponge, there always seems to be some solder left over on one side of the tip. I have to make several more passes over the sponge before all of the old solder is gone. Could I be using too much water on the sponge? The tip is practically new with no visible pitting or damage.

Try dipping quickly into flux, and I'd suggest you use steel wool because the minerals in the water become heavy deposits and can taint the cleanliness of your tip. The advantage of using steel wool is that it literally scrape the surface of the tip gently enough to not on the coding but generally removes every last bit of solder.

Thanks for the response, I may need to give the tip a good scrub with the steel wool if there is some residue on there. I've never tried dipping it directly into flux I might have to give that a shot too.

And when storing the iron, should I just wipe off the old solder as best I can with the steel wool and then put some tin on the tip for storage? Or should I still clean the tip with something damp before I tin it?

It's not a problem if you don't get off all the old solder, it's more important to get the flux residue off. You just want most of the old solder off, so you do not accidentally add too much solder to the joint. If it takes a couple wipes, no problem.


Remember the section on shoveling in the how to?

Basically you are looking to prevent that, and keep the flux residue from turning into a charred mess on the tip.

Also... If you are worried about mineral deposits, you can use distilled water.

There is a couple reasons to use a wet sponge...

The first is cleaning off old solder and flux...

The second is to "thermally shock" the tip... giving a quick and brief drop in tip temp of a few degrees.

In a good iron that electronically attempts to hold a set steady temperature, the sudden heat loss from the water, will ensure the heating element is on/active when you touch the tip to your connection.

This helps ensure fast heat transfer, as the iron is not trying to keep up as much. The element is already on and ready to hold the proper temp.

One more reason a quality iron is helpful...

Now that's the advice I was looking for, thank you :). It's good to know the leftover solder isn't a big deal. I was beginning to think I ruined my equipment lol

Not a problem...

Metal wool is commonly used as well, as it is more aggressive at cleaning a tip. The specially made is similar to chore boy scrubbers.

The metal wool does clean an overly dirty tip pretty well... And I see it more often in civilian manufacturing than in aviation.

Well I know this is kinda random but I just got this little gadget today and I thought others might want to try it out for desoldering situations. normally I use a hand-fed roll of copper weave but I found this little gizmo hiding on TowerHobbies and had to pick it up. Easy to use, cuts off used wick, replaceable wick drums etc.

http://imagizer.imageshack.us/v2/102...924/a56dGB.jpg

Marine6680, I just wanted to take a second to say THANK YOU. I've always been the type who likes to do their own thing, but soldering was always that rung that was just out of reach due to time and the inability to practice in a meaningful way. We all know, to get better at soldering, you need to practice on different materials, with different solder choices and so on. This "Article" puts all the information in one place, so you can focus on the important part, PRACTICING.

I'm glad it is helping people.

I have a choice of purchasing 2.2% or 3.3% flux content in the solder.
Will either be ok for general R/C electronics work?


Thanks.

Either is fine.

More flux in the core of the solder, can be helpful though... Especially to those who do not apply flux.

Is solder with a D.O.M four years ago still OK? That's the only one they have in stock.

i just bought some 63/37 solder and the test joins i did on some battery posts are really dull. the 60/40 has a nice bright finish but the 63/37 looks like dull aluminium. is that just how it looks?

It should be fine... The flux may dry out and not be very good, but the alloy itself should be fine.

I have used stuff that is a few years old, and had no issues.

Generally though, new is better, just for the fresher flux.

You will need to apply extra flux if the solder core flux is not working well.

Should be shiny.

Could be contamination causing it.

If the solder is old, and you do not use flux, it will not flush away the contamination and oxides very well.

^^^ Contamination OR… the parts are not being held still which causes the molecules to dull as they harden. That's likely Rule #2 with all things soldering…

ALWAYS make sure you have something to hold your leads and/or components so you don't find yourself playing HOT POTATO literally which forces you to remove the hold prematurely. As marine6680 stated though, you can straighten your solder and dip it straight in and out of flux to give it an additional hint of flux.

ALWAYS keep in mind that flux's main job is to assist in carrying maximum heat throughout the entire bead of solder. What I recommend is what I do… Place a small glob of flux on the leads prior to applying solder so that when you introduce the solder, maximum heat is achieved instantaneously so you touch the portion you're tinning and let cool. Then when you are ready to solder the wires on, touch the wire to the flux so it has a tiny bit of flux on it and then apply another tiny bead of flux to the tinned point. This way when you touch your iron's tip to the joint to be, the wire heats up instantly, and when the lead touches the flux on the tinned point, it causes the tin to melt so it all becomes a singular component.

I'm sure we've all seen "soldered" joints separate on some peoples' cars where the solder cracks where the 2 components meet and you can see how the solder between the wire and the contact point never melted. Doing it the way I just explained will prevent that from happening 100% of the time.

Hope this helps.

thanks. I'm a pretty good soldered but I thought I'd give the 63/37 a go. Turns out I bought some cheap solder so that's prob the reason. The good stuff is $70 a roll over here. None of the usual shops stock 63/37, only 60/40

$70... that sucks.

they quality of the alloy is important.

How to Soldering
 

1. Solder needs a clean surface to which to adhere.
Buff the copper foil of a PC board with steel wool before soldering.
Remove any oil, paint, wax, etc. with a solvent, steel wool, or fine sandpaper.
2. To solder, heat the connection with the tip of the soldering iron for a few seconds, then apply the solder.
Heat the connection, not the solder.
Hold the soldering iron like a pen, near the base of the handle.
Both parts that are being soldered have to be hot to form a good connection.

3. Keep the soldering tip on the connection as the solder is applied.
Solder will flow into and around well-heated connections.
Use just enough solder to form a strong connection.
Remove the tip from the connection as soon as the solder has flowed where you want it to be. Remove the solder, then the iron.

4. Don't move the connection while the solder is cooling.

5.Don't overheat the connection, as this might damage the electrical component you are soldering.
Transistors and some other components can be damaged by heat when soldering. A crocodile clip can be used as a heat sink to protect these components.

6. Soldering a connection should take just a few seconds.
If it is taking longer, see the troubleshooting section below.

7. Inspect the joint closely. It should look shiny.
If you are soldering a wire (called the lead) onto a PC board (on the track), it should have a volcano shape. See Figure 3.
If the connection looks bad, reheat it and try again.

9. Wipe the tip of the iron on a damp sponge to clean it. The tip should now be shiny.
10. Unplug the soldering iron when it is not in use.

What thickness of solder is used in your video? I found 63/37 on amazon for $22.00 (.31 )good?

The 63/37 is what you want. As for thickness, is that .31mm? This is what I use for reference. I get the thinnest solder I can find as it is easier to add solder than it is to take it off

https://www.frys.com/product/5841963...H:MAIN_RSLT_PG

Awesome
Thank You

Do you mean .031?

.31 would be huge!

For soldering wires and battery terminals, .031 would be a good size. It is a bit big for fine work on circuit cards though.

It's a kind of all purpose size... not ideal for fine work or larger connections, but usable, and suitable in a wide range of tasks.

What cause the solder get a pointy tail ? Tip not hot enough ? Need flux ?

I believe that is caused by the solder joint not getting hot enough preventing the solder from flowing as it should. This could indeed be remedied with flux as that will help transfer the heat much more efficiently. Though a new tip or a bump up in temperature may be all you need. If you're not using a chisel tip for ESC's and motor wires then I suggest getting one.

What I've found to cause the pointing is moving the iron away too slowly because it allows the solder between the iron and the joint/point to cool enough to not fall all the way flat once the iron is moved far enough away to separate itself from the mix.

A good way to prevent this and keep things ultra-shiny is to place a small bead of flux on the contact point you're going to solder onto and then touch the tip of the lead your also joining into the flux as well. This will allow both solder points to heat up much more quickly and efficiently while the flux acts like a lubricant of sorts that causes solder to bead back down in a more liquid state, resulting in a factory like joint.

Next time you buy a an ESC that is pre-soldered, look closely at those shiny contact beads and you will usually see flux on the very edges.

They use higher temperature irons like I do so they only touch it down on the contact point for a couple of seconds and hold it firmly in place until it solidifies and that also helps keep things shiny and smooth.

Usually that is a sign of too little flux, or possibly needing a slightly higher temp.

Another cause can be a dirty tip, or not wiping off the excess solder from the tip before starting the next connection. A dirty tip does not allow solder to flow well or transfer heat well. Not wiping off the tip allows the solder to oxidize and get dirty, so it does not flow well.

Technique also can play a role.

Try adding a bit more flux to the joint prior to soldering, and ensure your tip is wiped clean each time you make a connection.

Great info!
 

Thanks to marine6680 for creating this thread. Also, many thanks to all that have shared their experiences. After reading all of the pages, I realized that I've been soldering totally wrong. I have a Hakko FX888D on order and maybe, just maybe, I can actually solder correctly in 2018. :lol:

I had bad experience hakko fx888d and i sold it here but some people they like hakko soldering i got weller WESD51 and love it.

Need practice but, satisfied.
 

raved007,

So far I’m very satisfied with the Hakko. I use a 3.5mm chisel tip and keeping it clean and shiny made a world of difference. I tried some Kester 63/37(.031) rosin core solder and rosin paste flux from SRA soldering products. This was the first time I was able to solder my electronics with ease. I need to continue to fine tune my technique but, I’m very satisfied for now. Here are some pictures. Any feedback is welcome. Thanks.
https://cimg3.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.rct...e80b46d007.jpg

https://cimg7.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.rct...32a0a74235.jpg

https://cimg2.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.rct...18b6f0092c.jpg

Use more flux, that will smooth out the flow of solder better.

That is a versatile tip size... But it may be a bit on the small size for larger wires, a bit more heat may help. Bump it up 10-15 degrees, and try that.

marine6680,

Thanks for all of your advice. I have larger tips that I will try and I will also use more flux.

DMD, Looking at your solder joints I can see that Hakko is doing to you what my buddie's unit does which is not maintain it's temperature. On his we'd turn it all the way up and wait a couple of minutes to ensure it reached max temperature and for the first solder it was ok (not great), but on the 2nd joint it would already have lost too much heat to continue soldering unless you let it sit to recuperate some of the heat it lost. And we work inside his trailer so there was no flowing air that could be considered. It just doesn't do the job well in my experience.

Overpriced, under powered.

I went with this one because the one with the display was out of stock and back ordered and it's easily the best station I've ever used. Temperature control is accurate and it heats up fast and maintain temp so well I have to turn it way down between joints so to keep from ruining the tip.

https://www.circuitspecialists.com/7...g-Station.html


This is the same unit with LED Display I wanted to get.
https://www.circuitspecialists.com/7...D-Display.html


FYI, these are the exact same units that are RC "branded" and sell for 2 – 4x more money.
If you continue to not have success with the Hakko, return or sell it and buy one of these. I've found the 60Watt units are pretty solid for RC, but only the cheap basic ones that built insane amounts of temperature, but ones with temperature control tend to lack the ability to maintain heat. That's why I went with the additional 15Watts and it was the right call.

As for your soldering job specifically, it doesn't look like you pre-tinned your leads well enough and if you did, you either used too much solder or didn't have the proper heat to get it to soak all the way through the wire.

Looking at your wires, I see 2 things that are immediate red flags for me.

1. You've stripped too much insulation. Usually .125" (1/8) is all you want to strip off the end of the lead. This helps teach how little solder you really need.

2. You used far too much solder on every wire. When done properly to the specification above, wire will lay smoothly from the insulation onward and in yours you can see where the solder is and how far up it ran inside the wire/insulation.

When solder goes too far inside the insulation it makes soldering even more difficult because the iron then has to work much harder to heat up enough to liquefy that mass of solder. And although an iron might reach a proper temperature, once it touches a lead with all that solder, the lead acts like a heat sink and draw temperature away from the iron, resulting in less than stellar joints.

The one thing I urge people to remember is that you only need JUUUUST enough solder on your leads to coat the entire thing all the way through, and that doesn't mean keep feeding solder into the lead until it reaches the underside. Usually solder wont want to soak through to the very bottom of a lead so it's a good idea to tin until it's coated down the sides and then turn the wire over and feed a smidgen of solder to the un-tinned portion of the lead. Also, it's good to have the lead secured and place the iron under the lead and feed solder into the wire from above. this allows gravity to help the wire soak up the solder.

Hope this helps.


Been saying this for some time now but I have to make the time to create a video series to share with you guys. Maybe this weekend.

dmd still need some work on soldering man..looks to cold a solder joint to me..smooth n shiny that's what you want..

I can't say I had the same experience when I had the Hakko FX888. I never had to turn the heat above 725f to solder up to 10ga wire. Must've either been a fake (which are actually quite prevalent on the internet now) or just a bad unit. I even upgraded to the Hakko FX951 because I had been so pleased with the fx888. I agree the price is steep for the FX888 but I think it's still a very good unit especially when you use the right tip for the job. I'd just be careful where you purchase them from.

And to echo others concern with the joints, they should be smooth and shiny. I see yours are somewhat shiny but you can see the strands of wire still which is an indication of the solder not flowing well enough. I'm sure the tips offered above should get you where you want to be :) the 3.2mm chisel tip should be fine up to 12ga wire. Any thicker I'd update to the 5mm tips