SOLOARTIST 702

Another thought of mine is when there is a race event held have someone follow up find out how the event went weather good or bad if bad see how it can be improved if good see how to duplicate it report it to roar to evaluate maybe even do some kind of on site marketing of the hobby ----- I can even sign autographs for free

Csaari77

iTrader: (35)

Communication with membership needs to be improved. Since I joined the only information I have received from ROAR was a receipt for my membership dues. I received my card and a rule book in the mail, and nothing since. In this day and age, it is ridiculous that mass communication isn’t used to keep the membership informed of issues, votes, upcoming events, and results. You have to enter an email address to log in to the ROAR website, so they have an email database for the membership. Why isn’t mass email used to keep everyone up to date? I get more information about the activities of the club on this site than I do from the organization that I pay to be a member of!

If more information was forthcoming from the club, people could be more involved. It would also eliminate the perception that things are done in back rooms without membership input.

timmig

iTrader: (25)

"Hey, I resemble that remark."

Well then there is part of the problem. Again, you feel you are part of a ruling elite class that is seperate from your membership---and you don't need to serve them!!

Also, you tore down the manufacturer's-- which is a great part of our racing community. They need to be supported by the racing organization as well--not be made to feel that they are "bad guys" because profit is a motive. This country has been founded on the capitalistic idea that we CAN make a profit-that's what makes America great---SMALL BUSINESS!!

I never said ROAR should be run like a company---but the MEMBERS ARE ROAR---not the officers--and once you have officers that think they are above the membership-- then you have a DICKtatorship---that doesn't work well.
We have members that WANT to be involved--but like others communicating here---there is NO PATH for that involvement--nor any consistant dissemination of information from the ROAR officers. Like 77 said--- I joined ROAR again last year after taking a haiatis-- and the ONLY thing I've revieved from ROAR--was a nice sticker--and Rules booklet!! That was the END of their trying to be in touch with me--you got my money--now you'll get busy and SPEND it.
Hmmm---why not make the website interactive?? Put this kind of debate forum on it---or -- like 77 said--broadcast emails with information that could be useful to the membership?
You partially right--we ALL have to change to help the organization grow and survive --- that means -- NO career politicians!!! They just don't GET IT!!
FWIW
Tim

revodragon

they did? when, where? how do we be a part of it? I was not aware of this I saw the debate go on sgrid and rctech saw Dawn get mad since everyone was bashing the rule then she fired back at the guys and said not to worry about then after the rule was released (6 months later when pro-line showed the first bulldog buggy body at SS) she wouldn't answer questions or commits on the forums. Not trying to bash her but that's what went on.

And BTW I did talk to my regional director (region 12) after the first go around of truggy cab forward bodies debates and for the most part he agreed with us. Said it should go to a vote maybe done on roar's site he said he is running for president and said he'd look into to doing it that way...

I don't mean to kick at a dead horse, but that rule hit a nerve with me!...

jiml

iTrader: (3)

How in the hell do you figure that???

I literally sacrified all of my RC racing to help this hobby. When I was RD I went to as many regionals as I could, and never raced at any of them. I dedicated all my time trying to address racers concerns with ROAR. Anyone who contacted me got a response as quick as possible, usually immediate. The problem is you have no idea what it takes to do the things that ROAR does.

And I wasn't tearing down the manufacturers, I was pointing out a fact of life. Manufacturers are there to make money, and there's nothing wrong with that. What some manufacturers have figured out is that there's more money to be made outside the racing world, and are catering to those customers. That's not a criticism. It is what it is.

jiml

iTrader: (3)

Yea, body rules have always been contentious. There are basically 2 camps, what works, and what looks good. That's just one of those arguments that will never be solved.

ROAR will never use RC Tech to conduct any business. First, it's a commerical site. Second, ROAR, and Dawn in particular, have tried using RC Tech several times, and each time it just gets stupid ugly. Yes, ROAR should have a forum as part of their website, but it should be members only.

One more thing, no decision should be made by a popular vote. It's just way too easy for someone to rig the vote one way or another.

J.Gonzalez

iTrader: (16)

Wow Jiml you have way more patience than I do.

Keep up the good fight but also realize it is an exercise in futility. No matter how you try to explain it reasonable and downright logical manner everyone is going to dispute it.

Racers need to step back an see the bigger picture. It appears that ROAR is doing alot of work on the backside to fix some previous errors and avoid stumbling blocks in the future. It is a long and sometimes painful but negative attitude from racers and poor member participation only makes it worse.

Also keep in mind guys just because it is the popular part/opinion/widget device etc of the week does not mean it is good for racing.

Look what a hornets nest brushless turned out to be in the electric onroad scene.

SOLOARTIST 702

You all have some valid info but remember be careful what you wish for what you want is a straight shooter not a ninja we have to pick the right person for this job we can change the future of this operation for the better

Csaari77

iTrader: (35)

I completely disagree with this. So a limited few get to vote on all the rules and the paying membership has to live with it? How is a popular vote easy to "rig" if it was conducted online? You log in to your account on the ROAR site and cast a vote. Are you worried about people hacking user accounts?
This relates back to the major problem that ROAR has right now. Why should people support something that they have no voice in? Until the membership has the ability to have a say, the bitching and crying will continue and ROAR will be become even more irrelevant with local tracks than it is now.

JDCrow

iTrader: (32)

You have a voice. Its called pick up your phone or write your Region Director, Committee Chairman, Executive Committee Members. Their contact information is posted prominantly on the ROAR Website. Always has been.

You have a voice. At anytime, Racers can submit request for additions, revisions, for anyting. Be it motor, battery, body, race format, and on and on.

Problem is, most choose to not do so. But will be the first to complain about decisions which are made. And that is the major problem ROAR, and many organizations, have these days.

And unfortunately, we have few members in Region Director positions as dedicated as Jim has been serving their regions and the organization.

Bill Wyatt

iTrader: (2)

I see a bunch of valid, and needed, points being brought up in here. It will all be a waste of breath if you don't spread the word at your tracks and get your people to commit to voting at the election.

You can't NOT vote then cry about it later...well...you can...but don't expect to get much sympathy about it.

I think the most important positions up are the Regional Directors (no offense to any presidential candidates out there) because they are the ones we will be yanking the ears off of during the year. If your voice to them falls on deaf ears, for whatever reason, then we got the wrong guys in "office" for that position. They are the ones that are mainly in charge of your areas operation and they have your voice back to the head chingons.

JSeay

JD,

I cant accept that as a valid answer. Not that I don't believe you but I find this statement as not valid.

Rule 1.2.4 states :
Members, ROAR Officials, Track Operators, and Industry Affiliates are encouraged to send suggested rules additions or changes directly to the chairpersons of these committees. Proposals or suggestions may be submitted to any member of the ROAR Executive Committee, but these submissions will be referred to the relevant Section Chairpersons for discussion and acceptance before being reviewed by the
ROAR Executive Committee.

Yet no where on ROAR's site are the committees listed, nor is there anyway to know what is going on within the committee that may be formed? How do I send comments to my RD regarding a proposal that the rules committee for instance is thinking about if there is no way for me to know about it until after the fact? Does not add up to me.

So JD, what is the mechanism that ROAR has in place right now that allows the membership to (1) know what rules are being purposed so that we can talk to our RD about it, and (2) what kind of impact does one or more RD's have in actually affecting the outcome of the rule, and (3) how do we know how our particular RD's have voted on rules over their term?

I feel like we are talking in circles, you say talk to your RD about issues you have with rule proposals, but I don't know what is being proposed to talk to my RD about. Where am I missing the obvious in this?

Tubaboy

iTrader: (9)

Online voting is easily rigged, because certain tracks will setup a computer, and create accounts on the spot for their members and have them vote. (Because not all ROAR members have an online account).

Similiarly, offline voting is just as problematic, as many tracks would have pre-filled out ballots and just have the members put their name and ROAR # on the voting slip and mail it in for them.

It's these very reasons why you can't have campaign workers within so many feet of a polling place in the United States. To ensure that people are voting under their own free will.

Paul

JDCrow

iTrader: (32)

Im not sure how to help you Accept a fact. You seemed to be able to locate the rule book and a specific rule, yet couldnt find the names and contact information for any official. They are there.

Lets start from the following understanding. The ROAR Rule Book primarily is the Basis for racing standards for consistent and fair sanctioned events across the country. And the baselines used for ROAR National Championships.

Region Directors, Local Tracks, other Independent Race Promotors have the ability to deviate from the Rule Book based on local/regional preferences. The exception is Safety Related items (Track and/or Equiptment usage).

In fact, such allowances help to create new segments of racing, which may or may not elevate to a National Recognized Class.

The RD, when Sanctioning State and Regional ROAR Championships, will communicate such deviations when the Event becomes Sanctioned. This is done thru their work with the Sanction Director (ExCom Member). Any items he cant resolve are presented to the full ExCom for immediate consideration.

For Example, we do not currently have a 1:8 GT Racing Class (ie Kyosho IGT 1or2, OFNA DM1 etc). That does not mean the cars cant be raced at local ROAR Tracks, State or Regional Events. They can, and are encouraged to be raced as long as the public is made aware of the requirements for the class.

Most Classes that make it to a National Championship Event, get a start at a local track or series.

To Address your last paragraph.
1) Our Rule Book is Published and OnLine so any revisions or additionals are always accessable. These are the basis for our National Championship Events. If there is a rule you dont like, but want to race locally without having to comply with it, talk to your track and deviate from it if your track desires.

2) They have all the impact on what occurs in their Region. Be it their specific Championships and/or what specs/classes are recognized. Much of which comes thru direct consultation with the host facility and what vehicles are popular.

3) I suggest you build a dialoge with them. The Track Owner and RD are the ones that have the most direct impact on changes you wish to see at your local ROAR Track or ROAR Championship Event. Just keep in mind, they have to take into account the best interest of all racers.

Again - Regional Directors are the key individuals in the Activities held in the region. They are also valuable assets for the region when Host are selected for National Championships, as well as World Championships that become scheduled in the US.

As I set our course to build more awareness and recognition to Regional Championships, Region Directors will be tasked with understanding the Regions activities and building a team of volunteers to grow the lines of communication up and down the membership.

JSeay

Jim,

While I dont know you personally, I appreciate that you sacrificed your racing enjoyment to support ROAR in your current capacity. I agree with senna that you have an extraordinary amount of patience, his example only highlights how business is done in secret behind closed doors, I wonder if the EXCOM believes that it knows better than the membership what it wants or needs.

The most recent rule for spec profiles is a perfect example of this. Was it needed, maybe? Certain tracks this may make sense. Larger tracks where 17.5 maybe painfully slow not so much. Where was the discussion held that the membership could have given any form of input to anyone within ROAR? It is no where on the website, not on any discussion board, is there a super secret discussion board that only the cool kid group of members have access to?

Somewhere along the line we are going to have be truthful at all levels and understand the communication that we think is going on within ROAR is not actually happening and when we address that issue head on can we begin to understand how to make this organization better for the members.