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Old 03-12-2003, 10:34 AM   #106
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I'll just give my parting shot and then leave this topic alone - but not the thread! heh heh

My point was that if someone steals the design (not process, that's a patent, not a copyright) it's going to make the designers begin to clam up and not share their work. You can shout open-source all you want, it doesn't mean that the vast majority of software is not still written for Windows, and it doesn't change the fact that 99% of the students that I have on my campus use Windows or Mac (93% windows). (Btw, I run a division of Academc Computing, just fyi)

Obviously some of the designs have been straight-out copied. That is always going to inhibit the creative outflow of those being ripped off. Open-source gives permission to copy and modify. Richey isn't an open-source modifier. . .so it doesn't apply.

Morality and ethics is the central issue for this. It makes all the difference in the world if you're a thief or not. If no morality, then I can steal your nose-hairs and I'm not wrong and you're wrong to kick my ass for it. There isn't any right or wrong except in MY mind (and your mind is wrong. . . )

Okay, off my horse now. . .
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Old 03-12-2003, 04:53 PM   #107
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This is dead talking about Ritchey boomer, no need to continue it. I'll keep my comments positive and about motors I have actually ran.

Last edited by patelladragger; 03-12-2003 at 05:21 PM.
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Old 03-12-2003, 05:50 PM   #108
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Quote:
Originally posted by patelladragger
This is dead talking about Ritchey boomer, no need to continue it. I'll keep my comments positive and about motors I have actually ran.
i saw your original post

and i agree with you
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Old 03-13-2003, 09:39 AM   #109
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Quote:
Originally posted by patelladragger
This is dead talking about Ritchey boomer, no need to continue it. I'll keep my comments positive and about motors I have actually ran.
Yep, I know. Like I said, just my last parting shot. Everyone else got one. . .just wanted mine!
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Old 03-14-2003, 02:46 PM   #110
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Kinda like Metallica vs. Napster! They want to get paid for everyone of their "cloned" songs. Can't blame them for feeling that way. Certainly, nobody can be the band that they are, but they are finding that "intellectual property" is difficult to bank on in the modern age of the computer- where information is flowing at an ever-increasing rate. We're lucky today to have sites like this to learn from. When I started racing, the only resources were magazines and books, and friends at the track. Now, if I have a question, I can simply come here, post a quedstion, and get replies almost instantly. It's a bummer for guys like Dennis who do possess great knowledge, but once he begins commodify his wealth of information (by selling his motors) and make money, he realizes that his ideas can now freely be replicated, without compensation. I think this is little bout we had here is a microcosm of larger socio-economic problems that face us today. Just my parting shot...
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Old 03-14-2003, 03:13 PM   #111
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Here is an interesting discussion copied from the RB Products message board:




By David S on Friday, December 31, 1999 - 05:48 am:

Does RB manufacture the engines, or design/develop them, for manufacture? Quite impressive.
------------------------------------------------------------------------
By RB Products (Admin) on Monday, January 3, 2000 - 05:57 pm:

No we do not manufacture the engines, we make the design and development ourselves, also we own the moulds to manufacture our engines. Manufacturing is done by Novarossi.
------------------------------------------------------------------------
By Gustav on Tuesday, January 4, 2000 - 12:53 am:

So in simple terms if you do all the r&d of the engine and novarossi manufacture them they can easily copy any ideas you have developed .Do you think its worth it.
------------------------------------------------------------------------
By RB Products (Admin) on Tuesday, January 4, 2000 - 10:26 am:

Yes, this is indeed sometimes a problem, a good example is our M.E.S.(Multi Exhaust System) we introduced during the Worlds '97 in Mexico.
However we had obtained the exclusif for this system for 2 years at Novarossi and as you can see they released this in their engines(and other client engines who do not make R&D) in '99 so they are quite honest with this.
Also when we released our M.E.S. system it was easy for a lot of other engine manufacturers to buy our engine and copy it...

We continue the R&D on our engines since we think what is important is to innovate and not just follow, even if it is not the easiest way it pays off in the long term.
Also we think that beside the engine performances and reliability the communication with racers is very important too since it is them who indicate the quality of our work...
------------------------------------------------------------------------
By Mc on Friday, January 7, 2000 - 03:46 am:

You mean to tell me you all dont have copy right
to your M.E.S.(MultiExhaust System) you all should then other people cant copy it.
------------------------------------------------------------------------
By RB Products (Admin) on Friday, January 7, 2000 - 02:43 pm:

Copyright or Brevet is what they call this but a lot of work and long to obtain and explain all this to the officers who handle this, finally obtained the idea would be obsolete and also if 1 small detail to the idea or system is changed all this Copyright and Brevet stuff does not work anymore.

The best way for us is to continue our development and to show the racers we are leaders in this domain and that if they need power, reliability and innovation they just use and race our engines.



Note that this was several years ago. Seems this current discussion has been around for sometime! Just thought RB's take on this subject was interesting.
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Old 03-14-2003, 06:05 PM   #112
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Quote:
Originally posted by PasCarRC
Here is an interesting discussion copied from the RB Products message board:




By David S on Friday, December 31, 1999 - 05:48 am:

Does RB manufacture the engines, or design/develop them, for manufacture? Quite impressive.
------------------------------------------------------------------------
By RB Products (Admin) on Monday, January 3, 2000 - 05:57 pm:

No we do not manufacture the engines, we make the design and development ourselves, also we own the moulds to manufacture our engines. Manufacturing is done by Novarossi.
------------------------------------------------------------------------
By Gustav on Tuesday, January 4, 2000 - 12:53 am:

So in simple terms if you do all the r&d of the engine and novarossi manufacture them they can easily copy any ideas you have developed .Do you think its worth it.
------------------------------------------------------------------------
By RB Products (Admin) on Tuesday, January 4, 2000 - 10:26 am:

Yes, this is indeed sometimes a problem, a good example is our M.E.S.(Multi Exhaust System) we introduced during the Worlds '97 in Mexico.
However we had obtained the exclusif for this system for 2 years at Novarossi and as you can see they released this in their engines(and other client engines who do not make R&D) in '99 so they are quite honest with this.
Also when we released our M.E.S. system it was easy for a lot of other engine manufacturers to buy our engine and copy it...

We continue the R&D on our engines since we think what is important is to innovate and not just follow, even if it is not the easiest way it pays off in the long term.
Also we think that beside the engine performances and reliability the communication with racers is very important too since it is them who indicate the quality of our work...
------------------------------------------------------------------------
By Mc on Friday, January 7, 2000 - 03:46 am:

You mean to tell me you all dont have copy right
to your M.E.S.(MultiExhaust System) you all should then other people cant copy it.
------------------------------------------------------------------------
By RB Products (Admin) on Friday, January 7, 2000 - 02:43 pm:

Copyright or Brevet is what they call this but a lot of work and long to obtain and explain all this to the officers who handle this, finally obtained the idea would be obsolete and also if 1 small detail to the idea or system is changed all this Copyright and Brevet stuff does not work anymore.

The best way for us is to continue our development and to show the racers we are leaders in this domain and that if they need power, reliability and innovation they just use and race our engines.



Note that this was several years ago. Seems this current discussion has been around for sometime! Just thought RB's take on this subject was interesting.
Great Post!

Interesting RB's approach to it as well. Just keep making good motors. Must be working for them because every year they come out with the "must have" production motor.
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Old 03-15-2003, 12:01 AM   #113
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Default novarossi .12 5port - break-in

Just bought this engine for my ntc3. The manual does not give you a clear instruction on how to break-in the engine. Is there a website I can go to, their website www.novarossi.it is also vauge in providing break-in instructions. Any who have used this engine? You suggestion will be very much appreciated. Thanks
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Old 03-15-2003, 07:22 AM   #114
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i would take the high speed needle and set 5 turns out

low speed 4 or 4 1/2 out

start engine idle a tank if you want (i usually skip this step)

lean needles some if it wont stay running

let cool with piston not at top dead center

when cool i would start again and drive 1/2 throttle or less

tune to run about 200F and run 6-10 tanks let cool in between all tanks with piston down

then your done IMO
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Old 04-22-2003, 06:17 PM   #115
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Default Check this Out!

This guy sure sounds like he knows what he's doing!

Anyone tried these motors?


http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll...tem=3128309431
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Old 04-22-2003, 08:03 PM   #116
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Pat is a nice guy and does pretty good motors. But....

I will never forget watching one of Dennis's X15T modded motors pull hard on one of Pat's .21's at Crystal Park.
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Old 04-23-2003, 02:52 AM   #117
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Quote:
Originally posted by ChrisF
Pat is a nice guy and does pretty good motors. But....

I will never forget watching one of Dennis's X15T modded motors pull hard on one of Pat's .21's at Crystal Park.
Pat sure charges ALOT for his mod .12 engines now. It's like buying a race .21. Can all that (like real engines)shotpeening and lapped pistons be applied to RC too? Sounds like a DPR ad from back in my import racing days.
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Old 04-23-2003, 07:29 PM   #118
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So whose a good engine modifer or where can i get some modding tips i wanna mod my os tr
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Old 05-13-2003, 05:57 PM   #119
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Default Re: Check this Out!

Quote:
Originally posted by patelladragger
This guy sure sounds like he knows what he's doing!

Anyone tried these motors?

Pat Fox probably has more motors out there than many people realize. They are FAST and pat gives very good support with all of his work.


http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll...tem=3128309431
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Old 05-13-2003, 05:59 PM   #120
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Pat Fox probably has more motors out there than many people realize. They are FAST and pat gives very good support with all of his work.
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