STOCK motor forum
06-03-2004, 07:41 PM
#1576
Tech Master
Thank you 
06-04-2004, 11:18 PM
#1577
Tech Addict
iTrader: (4)
Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: Getting practice 1/10 stock onroad
Posts: 670
Trader Rating: 4 (100%+)
epic binary
any tips on how to hand tune a epic binary?
06-05-2004, 05:46 AM
#1578
any tips on how to hand tune a epic binary?
Run purple(pos) and Red(neg) springs
Polish shaft bushings
align hoods,
cut comm
try 25mm roll out on a large track, Australian size,
you will need less then that on smaller american and indoor tracks.
06-05-2004, 06:59 PM
#1579
I got a binary 2 at the track today for $6(what a craving for smokes will do to people). SICK DEAL! 
Yep purple spring+ and red-. I had to run a 27 rollout to get it to open up, but once I did it flew and didn't get too hot. It was catching other cars running binary 2's on the straight. I had an old pair of 4505's in it(didn't have any new brushes). Unfortunately I wasn't very lucky during qualifying(lap traffic) and screwed up before the main (forgot to re-seat my brushes after a cut), it was stuttering big time on throttle so I pulled it off. Top end is definately faster then my monster but it has a little less punch.
That is without any work done on it, no hood alignment done yet, no polishing, no new brushes...
A pic of the track size is below but it's not of the current setup(the setup is techniqual but fast if run well, incorporates a straight that runs all the way around 3 sides of the track.
http://www.rctrack.com/images/facility/track1.jpg
Yep purple spring+ and red-. I had to run a 27 rollout to get it to open up, but once I did it flew and didn't get too hot. It was catching other cars running binary 2's on the straight. I had an old pair of 4505's in it(didn't have any new brushes). Unfortunately I wasn't very lucky during qualifying(lap traffic) and screwed up before the main (forgot to re-seat my brushes after a cut), it was stuttering big time on throttle so I pulled it off. Top end is definately faster then my monster but it has a little less punch.That is without any work done on it, no hood alignment done yet, no polishing, no new brushes...
A pic of the track size is below but it's not of the current setup(the setup is techniqual but fast if run well, incorporates a straight that runs all the way around 3 sides of the track.
http://www.rctrack.com/images/facility/track1.jpg
Last edited by fatdoggy; 06-05-2004 at 07:17 PM.
06-05-2004, 07:16 PM
#1580
Originally posted by Brian McGreevy
Fatdoggy,
Might think about trying a Binary stock. Geared right, a decent binary will beat a decent monster any day...that's what I've seen even on very, very tight/technical indoor layouts.
Fatdoggy,
Might think about trying a Binary stock. Geared right, a decent binary will beat a decent monster any day...that's what I've seen even on very, very tight/technical indoor layouts.
Got any tips you'd like to share for the binary?
Other then golds or 2152's.
06-05-2004, 07:34 PM
#1581
Tech Addict
iTrader: (4)
Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: Getting practice 1/10 stock onroad
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nice layout 4 carpet
most of the racers i race wit either run fantom r monster motors. man i run a p2k2 motor not tuned, just cut and new brushes.man even powering out of turns i have more punch than the other racers, and man on the straight and half straights i either pass them r come right on the side of them r right on there bumper. so im goin to polish the bushings and comm/ cut the comm, so it should be a little faster.woohoo but i cant wait till this binary comes. so ny tips 4 a p2k2 r binary would be really helpful.
nice carpet layout fatdoggy
heres a site to my track/live webcam of the track i race on. www.mikeshobbyshop.com
Ty
Steven
nice carpet layout fatdoggy
heres a site to my track/live webcam of the track i race on. www.mikeshobbyshop.com
Ty
Steven
06-05-2004, 07:39 PM
#1582
Tech Addict
iTrader: (4)
Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: Getting practice 1/10 stock onroad
Posts: 670
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motor in water??
o ya wat is this i hear about runnin ur motor in water?does it make it better?if so wat do i do?
06-05-2004, 09:30 PM
#1583
Water dipping your motor used to be used with motors to break them i quicker, becuase the brushes were so hard(mabuchi, johnson 540). I've seen people do it with motors still but... 
I don't know, it may be a bit hard on the brushes but it would break them in quicker.
crACkeD ChaSsiS - Your track looks pretty good too.
I don't know, it may be a bit hard on the brushes but it would break them in quicker.crACkeD ChaSsiS - Your track looks pretty good too.
Last edited by fatdoggy; 06-05-2004 at 09:35 PM.
06-08-2004, 10:15 AM
#1584
How do you go about selecting the right pinion for a given motor and track.
The two variables I hear mentioned are speed on the straight away and motor heat. I find it real difficult to determine at what point on the straight away the car reaches it top speed.
I read that monster stocksmotors should be geared about 7.0. I hear a guy at the track say he went down one tooth and the motor ran much cooler, then I read Big Jim say that on a given track there may be 5 tooth variance between the correct pinion for differnent motors all of the same model and configuration.
Is there a rough rule about gear ratios? What would be the minimum (small twisty track with no long straightaways), what would be the maximum large outdoor with a very long straighaway.
Do you have a technique for finding the right pinion. Start with high number of teeth and move down until motor runs cool?
look for top speed and not worry about heat?
The two variables I hear mentioned are speed on the straight away and motor heat. I find it real difficult to determine at what point on the straight away the car reaches it top speed.
I read that monster stocksmotors should be geared about 7.0. I hear a guy at the track say he went down one tooth and the motor ran much cooler, then I read Big Jim say that on a given track there may be 5 tooth variance between the correct pinion for differnent motors all of the same model and configuration.
Is there a rough rule about gear ratios? What would be the minimum (small twisty track with no long straightaways), what would be the maximum large outdoor with a very long straighaway.
Do you have a technique for finding the right pinion. Start with high number of teeth and move down until motor runs cool?
look for top speed and not worry about heat?
06-08-2004, 11:38 AM
#1585
Large tracks - Sometimes require below a 6.0 for a monster.
Small track - Sometimes require 8.0's or higher for a monster.
Basically it's an educated guess and then just fine tune from there. I know a conservative rollout for my local track is 25. That is my starting point. Start with less teeth then go up. For 64 pitch it easiest to check lap times to decide gearing, for 48 pitch you can see the difference(if you adjust the pinion) imo. Motor heat is important.
Small track - Sometimes require 8.0's or higher for a monster.
Basically it's an educated guess and then just fine tune from there. I know a conservative rollout for my local track is 25. That is my starting point. Start with less teeth then go up. For 64 pitch it easiest to check lap times to decide gearing, for 48 pitch you can see the difference(if you adjust the pinion) imo. Motor heat is important.
06-08-2004, 12:59 PM
#1587
Tech Master
Originally posted by mafiaracers
Also, as long as you're not getting soft, heat should be the least of your worries.
Also, as long as you're not getting soft, heat should be the least of your worries.
06-08-2004, 01:31 PM
#1588
Tech Initiate
Originally posted by imjonah On the longest straitaway mark a reference point coming onto it, at the end of the straightaway make another reference point. Take a stopwatch and clock your car from point to point, gear up until your time falls off, then go back one tooth, this should get you pretty close if you have a starting point.
How do you go about selecting the right pinion for a given motor and track.
The two variables I hear mentioned are speed on the straight away and motor heat. I find it real difficult to determine at what point on the straight away the car reaches it top speed.
I read that monster stocksmotors should be geared about 7.0. I hear a guy at the track say he went down one tooth and the motor ran much cooler, then I read Big Jim say that on a given track there may be 5 tooth variance between the correct pinion for differnent motors all of the same model and configuration.
Is there a rough rule about gear ratios? What would be the minimum (small twisty track with no long straightaways), what would be the maximum large outdoor with a very long straighaway.
Do you have a technique for finding the right pinion. Start with high number of teeth and move down until motor runs cool?
look for top speed and not worry about heat?
How do you go about selecting the right pinion for a given motor and track.
The two variables I hear mentioned are speed on the straight away and motor heat. I find it real difficult to determine at what point on the straight away the car reaches it top speed.
I read that monster stocksmotors should be geared about 7.0. I hear a guy at the track say he went down one tooth and the motor ran much cooler, then I read Big Jim say that on a given track there may be 5 tooth variance between the correct pinion for differnent motors all of the same model and configuration.
Is there a rough rule about gear ratios? What would be the minimum (small twisty track with no long straightaways), what would be the maximum large outdoor with a very long straighaway.
Do you have a technique for finding the right pinion. Start with high number of teeth and move down until motor runs cool?
look for top speed and not worry about heat?
06-08-2004, 02:18 PM
#1589
Basically, there is no rule.
Each motor behaves differently, each track has different need.
With a Monster Stock (most popular at present), 8:1 is a good start on a small track, 6.5:1 on a big track.
From then on, it's basically trial and error, and with experience comes a gut feeling.
Better to keep going up a gear to see how the motor changes, rather than overgear the motor in the first place and go down on the pinion.
Top speed - you should be able to judge by the motor note - if you can hear it at constant revs from halfway down the straight, your undergeared. If the car feels sluggish on the throttle, you're over geared (motor will get hot when overgeared too).
You've also got the laptimes as a judge of whether the gearing is working, plus you can compare your speed to other racers - I'd rather have a car that is slightly sluggish on the infield, and fast on the straights, than a car that's slightly more rapid in the corners, but gets passed on the straights.
I've got a very clever device called an Eagle Tree Systems Car Data Recorder (our company imports them into the UK) that actually tells you exactly what revs you are pulling as you go around the track - you just look at the graphs to see whether you are peaking too early - takes the guesswork out of the equation.
Each motor behaves differently, each track has different need.
With a Monster Stock (most popular at present), 8:1 is a good start on a small track, 6.5:1 on a big track.
From then on, it's basically trial and error, and with experience comes a gut feeling.
Better to keep going up a gear to see how the motor changes, rather than overgear the motor in the first place and go down on the pinion.
Top speed - you should be able to judge by the motor note - if you can hear it at constant revs from halfway down the straight, your undergeared. If the car feels sluggish on the throttle, you're over geared (motor will get hot when overgeared too).
You've also got the laptimes as a judge of whether the gearing is working, plus you can compare your speed to other racers - I'd rather have a car that is slightly sluggish on the infield, and fast on the straights, than a car that's slightly more rapid in the corners, but gets passed on the straights.
I've got a very clever device called an Eagle Tree Systems Car Data Recorder (our company imports them into the UK) that actually tells you exactly what revs you are pulling as you go around the track - you just look at the graphs to see whether you are peaking too early - takes the guesswork out of the equation.
06-08-2004, 06:26 PM
#1590
Tech Addict
Expierment!
Take what everybody is running, try that or one or tow teeth lower and gear up one at a time. Everybody drives different, motors are different and cars are set up different. Get your car dialed, then change one tooth on the pinion at a time. When you hit it, you will know. It will seem extremly fast. I always think " I didnt think one tooth could make so much of a difference". When you get there, you are home free.
You should be able to hold you finger on the can for 2 seconds. If you can't, then smell the motor and gear down one or two. Lap time is the best way to tell as long as the motor doesn't smoke.
Unlike sosidge, I would rather have the power in the infield than win the drag race down the straight. Just my opinion. I think most races are won in the infield, not the straight (10% of the track).
Motor gets hot after 2 or 3 minutes, gear lower or stiffer brush springs.
You should be able to hold you finger on the can for 2 seconds. If you can't, then smell the motor and gear down one or two. Lap time is the best way to tell as long as the motor doesn't smoke.
Unlike sosidge, I would rather have the power in the infield than win the drag race down the straight. Just my opinion. I think most races are won in the infield, not the straight (10% of the track).
Motor gets hot after 2 or 3 minutes, gear lower or stiffer brush springs.