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Old 03-28-2005, 12:23 AM   #1
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Default how do i make a tc3 competive on carpet?

i have a tc3 factory team and it seems like everyone has the xray and they are always beating me. i just got a bmi chasis for my tc3 but havent run it. what else can i do to help my little tc3 on carpet or should i just give up and spring for an xray
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Old 03-28-2005, 02:55 AM   #2
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Oh boy...here we go.

You got the BMI chassis. Good. Now nobody online keyboard racing can complain that your car isn't "stiff" enough.

Get everything assembled. Now go to about 80wt oil on all 4 corners. Now go stiff springs all around and gear properly. Slap on some swaybars and tune proper camber/caster and you'll be just as fast as any Xray.

If you're being beaten all the time, it isn't your chassis. It's your level of driving, batts, motor tuning, etc.

I see more consistant C-main drivers with Xrays than any other car. All because they've been brainwashed into thinking pretty cars make then fast.

Of course in the A-main, you find a motley crew of cars. Some BMI TC3s / 4s, Losi XXXS's, a couple Xrays and alot of Yokomos.

The point being, learn your car and THEN you'll be fast.
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Old 03-28-2005, 06:02 AM   #3
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the tc3's are still great on the rug. infact, even the tub chassis w/o a top deck is still as a competitive as anything. you've got to find a setup that works with level of grip you have at your facility, and with the tire selection that you have made.

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Old 03-28-2005, 07:32 AM   #4
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I've tried some weird things lately with my BMI TC3 and the most consistant my car has ever felt was with this setup. It has worked at 4 tracks so far.

Front Shocks:
60Wt oil
#2 pistons
Purple springs

Rear shocks:
50Wt oil
#2 pistons
Copper springs

Front end:
(rear tower on front)
Shocks, middle hole on tower, inner hole on arm
camber link upper outside hole
F-0 block
TC4 knuckle in outer ackerman hole or losi knuckle(same)
4 degree c-hubs
.055 swaybar
1/2 degree toe out
1.5 degree camber

Standard steering rack with camber link ballstuds spaced out .010

Rear end:
Shocks, Middle hole on tower, outer hole on arm
camber link upper inside hole
r-2-2 block with F block in place of R block
TC4 rear carrier in outer hole(Really long link)
2.5 degree camber

Droop:
5 front, 3 rear

Ride height:
4.5mm front and rear

Tires:
Jaco Dbl pink orange(F)/ Dbl pink(R)

Usually gear 33/100 through 38/100, it depends on the motor and tire size. With 58mm tires and a binary, I geared 33/100 this weekend and was very fast.

Protoform stratus 3.0 body

Paragon ground effects traction compound.


I am posting this because 5 different people have driven my car and have commented on how well it handles. It can be driven smooth and it can carve a corner like a Pro 4 or an X-ray if you need it to.

Hope this helps.

Tim
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Old 03-28-2005, 07:38 AM   #5
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Gotta agree with Soviet...Learn to drive you vehicle before crying about not being competitive against xrays...Look at how the fast guys drive - betcha money they are hitting the same spots each and every lap...and their times are within .5 second each time

Just becuase there is a huge bandwagon jumping on an xray, don't mean that's the best way for you....

And there are more xray's sitting in the lower mains, than those in the top mains...Its all about driving style and Practice, practice, practice
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Old 03-28-2005, 07:48 AM   #6
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tim - that setup is very close to mine (which is always changing ), and almost spot on to another racer at the gate, who has one the best tc3's around.

fjm - with the exception of droop , i highly suggest using this setup for a start.
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Old 03-28-2005, 08:06 AM   #7
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How about a good setup for asphalt? Should I go back to the graphite chassis for outdoor racing?
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Old 03-28-2005, 08:27 AM   #8
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Quote:
Originally posted by seaball
tim - that setup is very close to mine (which is always changing ), and almost spot on to another racer at the gate, who has one the best tc3's around.

fjm - with the exception of droop , i highly suggest using this setup for a start.
I usually set droop based on ride height. Bring the springs up to the perch in the rear and bring them up to the perch in the front and put a half a turn of pre-load on them. Those numbers were with the 28mm tires. How and where would you measure the droop. That's the last thing that I am having issues with getting set right with the car.

I usually race 1/12th scale and touring car isn't my thing. Although I am getting pretty good with it.

I haven't tried this car outdoors on asphalt yet. We have a indoor asphalt track here and the setup stays the same, the tires change to twister 37 shore.

I have a good setup that someone sent me a while back. I will find it and post it.

Tim
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Old 03-28-2005, 09:35 AM   #9
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Quote:
Originally posted by Tim Stamper
I usually set droop based on ride height. Bring the springs up to the perch in the rear and bring them up to the perch in the front and put a half a turn of pre-load on them.
tim, that's exactly how i set droop! people often forget that droop is relative to r/h (spring collars), or that they need to translate together. so with your settings, your up travel should be maybe 2mm front, and almost none in the rear? i usually go 1/4 turn in the rear and 1/2 ish in the front, since the rear shocks are mounted out further on the car. whatever it takes to yield 1.5mm uptravel front, and 1.5 to 3 in the rear, depending on the conditions.
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Old 03-28-2005, 10:51 AM   #10
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thanks for your help guys, ill try some of the sugesstions on setting up my car.
if people have more, please keep them coming every little bit of input helps
for the batteries and motor issue, i have a highly tuned epic bi and some of the best batteries at my track so thats not it.
driving wise i know i do still have room for imporvement seeing how i have only been racing on-road for a month. mainly its my throttle control to keep momentum up in a stock motor

but WOW with my CF Tub chasis that my factory team came with i run 35 wt shock oil and blue spring all around. is the bmi really that much better?!?!

so once again thanks for the imput, and please keep it coming because i am still looking for the right set up on carpet with my bmi and i every segguestion you give me, gives me another set up to play with!
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Old 03-28-2005, 11:02 AM   #11
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Quote:
Originally posted by fjm9898
thanks for your help guys, ill try some of the sugesstions on setting up my car.
if people have more, please keep them coming every little bit of input helps
for the batteries and motor issue, i have a highly tuned epic bi and some of the best batteries at my track so thats not it.
driving wise i know i do still have room for imporvement seeing how i have only been racing on-road for a month. mainly its my throttle control to keep momentum up in a stock motor

but WOW with my CF Tub chasis that my factory team came with i run 35 wt shock oil and blue spring all around. is the bmi really that much better?!?!

so once again thanks for the imput, and please keep it coming because i am still looking for the right set up on carpet with my bmi and i every segguestion you give me, gives me another set up to play with!
Remember though, just buying the most tuned stock and best batteries doesn't guarantee much either. A lack of care and maintenance will turn even then best motors into [email protected] fairly quickly.

If you are running foams on carpet, then your setup is way too soft. The idea with carpet foam racing is that you really don't need to setup your car for much overall bite, as the carpet provides increasing traction as the race day progresses. So, with 35wt and blues all around, your car is swaying like a boat and scrubbing off a lot of speed in the corners.

As for driving strategies, you want to try and keep a steady driving rhythm around the track, avoiding much braking and keeping the momentum going. So, don't worry about having the fastest electronics and spend time on set-ups, driving, and having fun.
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Old 03-28-2005, 11:06 AM   #12
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Quote:
Originally posted by seaball
tim, that's exactly how i set droop! people often forget that droop is relative to r/h (spring collars), or that they need to translate together. so with your settings, your up travel should be maybe 2mm front, and almost none in the rear? i usually go 1/4 turn in the rear and 1/2 ish in the front, since the rear shocks are mounted out further on the car. whatever it takes to yield 1.5mm uptravel front, and 1.5 to 3 in the rear, depending on the conditions.
Thanks.

That explains it a little better. I am able to get away with weird droop settings sometimes, but it was a little interesting this weekend. I was running against some tough competition and even though I finished 6 or 7 seconds behind the fastest guys, the car was still wonderful.

I am trying to work out a schedule for work so that I can go to the race at the gate next month. I haven't been able to make it down there yet, but I heard this will be a good race to go to. See ya there!

Tim
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Old 03-28-2005, 11:09 AM   #13
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we are not allowed to use foams in stock racing at our track (trying to keep cost of racing down)

i mainly use premounted tackoff 27s because they last a while
so if there were all made thinking of foam tires, then i really shouldnt use those set ups.

so let me know if those are good for foam or rubber tires
and once again keep tosing out set up ideas, i am sure other people are reading them and writing them down too!
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Old 03-28-2005, 11:17 AM   #14
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Heres a foam tire setup from one of the A-main drivers from novak with his FT tc3. But i have agree the tc3 is still a very competitive car, ive driven every car on the market and all the cars are about the same, some drivers my give them the upper hand, but setting them up and accually driving them i found the tc3 and losi to be the easies to work on. But each year when the novak race came around i some how ended up with a ft tc3 in my hands. but ya hope you like this setup.

Front:
70 wt AE
#2 Piston
Purple Spring
Rear tower on front, middle hole
Inner hole on arm
Upper Inner camber link
4 degree caster blocks - losi
losi steering knuckles
F and F-0
.062 (stock) swaybar
-1 camber (set so tires wear flat, so if you see one coning a little bit after a couple runs, adjust it)
1.5 mm droop over ride height

Rear:
50 wt
#2 piston
Copper spring
Middle hole on tower
Outer hole on arm
Upper Inner camber link
Losi 0 degree hubs, inside hole
R and R+2-0
-1.5 camber (same procedure as above)
1.5 mm droop over ride height
Middle wheelbase setting

4.5 mm ride height
Parma Alfa
Dbl Pink/Orange Fronts, Dbl Pink Rears

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Last edited by lazyboy; 03-28-2005 at 11:32 AM.
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Old 03-28-2005, 11:28 AM   #15
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thanks for the foam tire steup, ill probably be using that or somthing close in 19t

anyone have a good one for carpet, rubber tire, stock racing?
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