143LikesAwesomatix EP Touring Car (A700 Shaft Drive)
03-11-2014, 06:55 PM
#5912
Last edited by Magnet Top; 03-11-2014 at 07:21 PM.
03-11-2014, 07:10 PM
#5915
03-12-2014, 05:11 AM
#5916
Here's how I consider the operation and set up of the Awesomatix dampers.
The damper and spring are a unit. The damping value is fixed by the oil viscosity within the damper. The spring value is variable, we can change it by altering the B value which I call the spring gap. Changing the B value changes the effective leaf spring length. The shorter the leaf spring the stiffer it becomes, we can validate this by holding a ruler (leaf spring) over the edge of a table and pressing down on it whilst altering it's length.
The A value then changes the leverage applied to the whole unit. More leverage is achieved with a smaller A value and the greater the leverage the softer the spring and damping will feel. I guess this is more synonymous with moving conventional shocks in and out on the lower arm than it is laying them down on the shock tower.
The way I think the set up sheet works is that it produces a wheel rate based on the leaf spring length and lever length acting on that leaf spring. It does not include the resistance felt from damping. So when setting the shocks so the wheel rate is the same but damping is different does produce a different feeling shock, due to the different resistance from different damping. Perhaps a way to validate this is to remove the spring and feel only the damping at different A values.
Hanulec - I get what you are saying, I guess all I disagree with is that I'd expect them to feel different with different damping values at the same spring rate. I have big respect for you if you can push down on a car and then translate that feel onto your own car. It's something I tried for many hours when I got my first Awesomatix, as I wanted to match it to my xray but I could never get there. Very interesting to see how different people take different approaches and ways of thinking of things, hopefully there is something for everyone =]
The damper and spring are a unit. The damping value is fixed by the oil viscosity within the damper. The spring value is variable, we can change it by altering the B value which I call the spring gap. Changing the B value changes the effective leaf spring length. The shorter the leaf spring the stiffer it becomes, we can validate this by holding a ruler (leaf spring) over the edge of a table and pressing down on it whilst altering it's length.
The A value then changes the leverage applied to the whole unit. More leverage is achieved with a smaller A value and the greater the leverage the softer the spring and damping will feel. I guess this is more synonymous with moving conventional shocks in and out on the lower arm than it is laying them down on the shock tower.
The way I think the set up sheet works is that it produces a wheel rate based on the leaf spring length and lever length acting on that leaf spring. It does not include the resistance felt from damping. So when setting the shocks so the wheel rate is the same but damping is different does produce a different feeling shock, due to the different resistance from different damping. Perhaps a way to validate this is to remove the spring and feel only the damping at different A values.
Hanulec - I get what you are saying, I guess all I disagree with is that I'd expect them to feel different with different damping values at the same spring rate. I have big respect for you if you can push down on a car and then translate that feel onto your own car. It's something I tried for many hours when I got my first Awesomatix, as I wanted to match it to my xray but I could never get there. Very interesting to see how different people take different approaches and ways of thinking of things, hopefully there is something for everyone =]
03-12-2014, 06:50 AM
#5917
It maybe hard to feel a small difference when you are in the range and close, but I realized my car was setup in the stiffer range, but I had put on the softer range settings by doing the press test on JerryPs car. I didn't have time to swap the screws, so I set it by feel to get close, and the spring was almost maxed out.
03-12-2014, 10:46 AM
#5918
Setup sheets from 17.5T ROAR National Champion Kyle Klingforth now available-
http://www.awesomatixusa.com/p/setup-sheets.html
http://www.awesomatixusa.com/p/setup-sheets.html
03-12-2014, 11:43 AM
#5919
I was thinking the same at first, but when you move A in or out, the distance on B or the "hook" does not change.
However, if you look these 2 pictures. The first one shows B = 3mm A = 3mm making the spring rate = 108.4 gf/mm
If you just change the A to 4mm that now makes the spring rate 117.6 gf/mm
Now if you want to increase A but keep the same spring rate you would also need to change B to 3.9mm. (I know .9 is not an option with the gauges but this is just for demonstration.)
However, if you look these 2 pictures. The first one shows B = 3mm A = 3mm making the spring rate = 108.4 gf/mm
If you just change the A to 4mm that now makes the spring rate 117.6 gf/mm
Now if you want to increase A but keep the same spring rate you would also need to change B to 3.9mm. (I know .9 is not an option with the gauges but this is just for demonstration.)
" B " is a "passenger" of " A " ( the carrier ).
Simply, for example : if the goal is to maintain spring rate but change damping rate : Move " A " some distance , then move " B " the equal distance but OPPOSITE direction.
( Note. " B " is the position of the RHS ( ride height screw ). The RHS acts as the leverage point on the "leaf" style spring that determines spring rate )
So if you move " A " 2mm East, then move " B " 2mm West. You have successfully changed your damping rate and kept your spring rate exactly the same as before you started.
The only issue comes up when you don't have enough adjustment range in "B". So you sometimes have to use SRS I or SRS II depending on what you are trying to accomplish. The difference between SRS I and SRS II is 4mm.
Jake D.
Simply, for example : if the goal is to maintain spring rate but change damping rate : Move " A " some distance , then move " B " the equal distance but OPPOSITE direction.
( Note. " B " is the position of the RHS ( ride height screw ). The RHS acts as the leverage point on the "leaf" style spring that determines spring rate )
So if you move " A " 2mm East, then move " B " 2mm West. You have successfully changed your damping rate and kept your spring rate exactly the same as before you started.
The only issue comes up when you don't have enough adjustment range in "B". So you sometimes have to use SRS I or SRS II depending on what you are trying to accomplish. The difference between SRS I and SRS II is 4mm.
Jake D.
03-13-2014, 06:20 AM
#5920
Just wanted to say another big thank you to awesomatixusa.com for shipping another order out to me in the UK. One of the few places in the US I order from as they are very efficient and have cool things I can't get in the UK like the BSR hard bumper. Also a great price on WTF fans. It is worth doing a bigger order though to make full use of the postage costs but if you aren't in the US and need some Awesomatix goodies don't overlook awesomatixusa.com =]
Not often I go around plugging rc shops but I'm always impressed with the service so thought I'd share the love <3
Not often I go around plugging rc shops but I'm always impressed with the service so thought I'd share the love <3
03-13-2014, 08:46 AM
#5921
Tech Fanatic
Congratulations for Simon Noton who TQ'd and won the 13.5 boosted class and for Jamie Holmes who was 2nd at the New Zealand National championships!
https://www.facebook.com/awesomatixRC
https://www.facebook.com/awesomatixRC
03-13-2014, 01:13 PM
#5922
Oleg, any availability date for the relase of the Awesomatix servo? I need a new one and will be interested in it ;-) what about its specs?
Are G07 and G08 the pinions for GD2 diff (and WA02 and WA03 the washers that suits the best for it)? So no need the Xray parts anymore if so?
Any other new items to come?
Cheers,
G-rem
Are G07 and G08 the pinions for GD2 diff (and WA02 and WA03 the washers that suits the best for it)? So no need the Xray parts anymore if so?
Any other new items to come?
Cheers,
G-rem
03-13-2014, 08:20 PM
#5923
" B " is a "passenger" of " A " ( the carrier ).
Simply, for example : if the goal is to maintain spring rate but change damping rate : Move " A " some distance , then move " B " the equal distance but OPPOSITE direction.
( Note. " B " is the position of the RHS ( ride height screw ). The RHS acts as the leverage point on the "leaf" style spring that determines spring rate )
So if you move " A " 2mm East, then move " B " 2mm West. You have successfully changed your damping rate and kept your spring rate exactly the same as before you started.
The only issue comes up when you don't have enough adjustment range in "B". So you sometimes have to use SRS I or SRS II depending on what you are trying to accomplish. The difference between SRS I and SRS II is 4mm.
Jake D.
Simply, for example : if the goal is to maintain spring rate but change damping rate : Move " A " some distance , then move " B " the equal distance but OPPOSITE direction.
( Note. " B " is the position of the RHS ( ride height screw ). The RHS acts as the leverage point on the "leaf" style spring that determines spring rate )
So if you move " A " 2mm East, then move " B " 2mm West. You have successfully changed your damping rate and kept your spring rate exactly the same as before you started.
The only issue comes up when you don't have enough adjustment range in "B". So you sometimes have to use SRS I or SRS II depending on what you are trying to accomplish. The difference between SRS I and SRS II is 4mm.
Jake D.
03-13-2014, 09:40 PM
#5925
Congratulations for Simon Noton who TQ'd and won the 13.5 boosted class and for Jamie Holmes who was 2nd at the New Zealand National championships!
https://www.facebook.com/awesomatixRC
https://www.facebook.com/awesomatixRC
Last edited by Magnet Top; 03-13-2014 at 10:40 PM.