rcgerber

iTrader: (8)

You don't have to run out and get the 20 mm blocks if the servo boxes worked for you. The whole point of the blocks is to have a repeatable chassis height to make the toe and camber adjustments from. My guess is the blocks set the arms level (not a 20mm ride height) when using their station. So when you put on the tires any further ride height adjustments are minor therefore would not change the other settings to much. So in your case speedy, your arms would be into the droop a little and you will have a touch more camber when you put on the tires and set your ride height if going by the standard US -1 to -3 camber . Just adjust your settings accordingly ie a little less camber (depending on you camber gain) per the system and such. It's all about repeat ability for YOU.

Speedychris22

iTrader: (68)

Makes sense, Thanks for the input

Graphitedust

Bent: Thank you for your informative posts. I bought a 1/10 Hudy Off-Road station and used it last night and found considerable error because I was not using blocks. A factor not mentioned, which you touched indirectly, is the stiction in off-road shocks. They seldom end up in the exact same location when dropping the car onto the table to set ride height. I bottomed the car out and let it rebound and got one reading, then dropped the car weight, loading the suspension from above and got a different reading. Not a lot of difference, but difference just the same.
Using blocks would solve this. I am one of the few who actually read the manual and saw the reference to the blocks, which brought me to this thread today. My old eyes are getting tired and this set up station is a tool to keep my set-ups spot on!

Lee Caldwell
TLR USA

lyons238

iTrader: (15)

im going to bump this thread for a couple reasons...

1. wouldnt using blocks in coordination with DE setup wheels be a happy compromise? this would allow for a consistent measuring point, as well as be a cheap option for consistently and fairly accurately measuring setup...thoughts?

2. i think bent should have worded better the 20mm blocks not acting as if its the best most accurate setup. but rather the most repeatable and designed around the toold hudy made. hudy is smart. they made a setup system and tools that you MUST have in order to use THEIR system...which is not necessarily the most accurate as Captain pointed out. i think Captain kind of shut Bent down because Captain is technically 100% correct. Bent is correct only in being repeatable and shareable with Hudy's way and Hudy's way only. i just thought bent could have handled that better instead of saying "you need to go to school son" when in fact Captain is 100% right, but it was just a miscommunication.

im tossing up the idea of getting DE setup wheels and support blocks for my measurements with the RMP toe gauge, camber gauge, and ride height gauge.

OR

buck up and get the Hudy system. does anyone know which pit board and Hudy decal works with 1/10 off road (buggies)?

AMessy

iTrader: (39)

I have the Hudy 1/10 off-road setup station and really like it. I use it was 2 & 4wd buggies as well as stadium trucks w/ the 1/8 off-road top plate. I tend to use it only after new builds and or major overhauls.

I use a pair of Ghea ride height gauges to set my desired ride height with the car in a ready to drive condition. I then remove the tires and put the car in the setup station using the Ghea ride height gauges front and rear as my base points for setting camber and toe.

My reasoning behind this is that I don't bring my setup station to the track. I only bring a set of setup wheels, ride height gauge, ruler, & camber gauge with me. I don't race much and tend to travel light to the open practice days. These items are already in my toolbox so I leave the setup station home. Using my set ride height as a base on the setup station allows me to directly compare to my settings when I measure at the track with a camber gauge. I do know that I could bring the same 20mm droop blocks with me and measure with them, but it's just another thing I have to haul.

I completely understand the reasoning behind basing setup on a common base point like the x-Ray setups use, but my system works fine as I don't really share setups.

Bottom line is the Hudy setup station works very well and I am more than happy with mine. I don't do much on-road (no racing just practice) but I'm going to eventually get one of the 1/10 on-road setup stations based on my sarisfaction with my off-road one.

lyons238

iTrader: (15)

well i think my plan is to get 2x those GHEA ride height gauges and use those as my blocks so i adjust camber and toe and droop based on my ACTUAL height, rather than the base line of 20mm despite actual ride height.

however, i think im going to get all the gauges, and setup wheels first and just setup that way because i don't want to drop $350 right now on the hudy system and all the necessary tools, adapters etc. STUPID it doesnt come with all the things you actually need to use it at $150, it should come with wheel adapters, wheel nuts, setup board and decal. i can understand if the gauges aren't included but at least those things...

JAE

iTrader: (30)

I now understand Hudy (Xray's) reasoning for using a standard 20mm guage for repeatable results. Am I correct in my assumption then, that their toe, camber, et cetera for 1/10 buggy is all based on 20mm ride height? Then, whichever ride height you choose to run, you will need to incrementally re-adjust? based on what you run. So, effectively everything 1/10th scale, if using their setup sheets, is based on 20mm ride height and not actual? Makes sense as this provides a point of reference, but how do you get back to say -2 camber at 22mm ride height? Do you take the buggy off, put wheels on, measure camber with a hand tool and see how far off you are then put back on the setup system and make that incremental adjustment?

Phillip F

iTrader: (43)

Set your ride height last after all the adjustments.

lyons238

iTrader: (15)

the 20mm ride height is the point of reference for the hudy sheet. problem is not everyone that uploads those sheets use the 20mm blocks.

they use 20mm blocks because typically the lowest height will be around 17mm and the highest will be around 22mm, at least in my experience. so if you set everything at 20mm, no matter what your ride height actually is, it will be close enough to 20mm to not make a difference. the point is that its super repeatable.

however, i still prefer to use the actual ride height as my reference point. i use the ghea blocks and the hudy system now.

its stupid to me that everyone doesnt do this, Bent made the point earlier that it woud be stupid to say 3 deg camber at 18mm ride height. but the setup sheet says the ACTUAL ride height anyway, so one could just assume that its 3 degrees camber at the given ride height, i mean thats what we all assumed anyway. if anything the 20mm blocks make it more confusing to those that don't know the actual process.

i personally think this block system was just a good way to get everyone to buy their tools. think about it. if you need their 20mm blocks, and their 20mm based droop gauges. not to say i wouldn't buy them anyway because i love hudy, but it's just kind of annoying to me.

JAE

iTrader: (30)

Understood. Thx! I wish someone made a 15-25mm ghea type blocks. Sometimes I'm 18mm on hi bite and 23mm outdoors. This requires 4 additional tools.

lyons238

iTrader: (15)

i hear you! i had to 2x 15-20mm and 2x 20-30mm.

i think 15-25mm blocks would be hard to create because the overall unit can only be 25mm tall tops but has to get down to as low as 15mm. i think thats why maybe they have a 15-20mm because they can only fit 5mm of extension in that small of a unit, do you know what i mean?

but yeah im loving the hudy setup with the GHEA blocks. im doing it this way for now as i think its better than using just strictly the 20mm blocks. but we'll see if i continue to do it that way or adopt hudy's way.

ideally i wish everyone would just uset the setup sheets based on their ride height and not the 20mm blocks. just seems asinine and i can't totally wrap my head around the reason, since the setup sheet lists the ride height anyway. i don't see Bent's point about having to say 3* at 17mm ride height, since like i said, ride height is listed anyway so we could just assume those attributes (camber, toe, roll center, droop, ackermann, whatever) are all based on the given ride height.

Trickyii

Ive read the entire thread. Im trying to understand your post.

If I have a Associated B6D and want to get the Hudy 150$ setup kit and the GHEA gauges, are there MORE Hudy things I need just to make it function properly?

lyons238

iTrader: (15)

it depends how you want to use the station.

if you want to use the 20mm block setup than you need to purchase those and it could be helpful to have the droop gauge as well.. furthermore, if you want to get the hand wheel nuts, they dont come with those.

also you might want to get a pit board to have a flat setup area, and potentially the hudy 1/10 decal for measuring track width.

Zerodefect

Camber settings aren't an arbitrary number. 2,3, babnana, 4, whatever. You either need more, or you need less. It's that simple.

Setup your camber on the 20mm blocks. Drive the car. If it needs more, than give it more.

You only need to check camber again at actual ride height if you're copying someone elses setup, and he sets it after dropping the car. But now, his damper setup, and track temp can influence things.

Doesn't matter what the camber is at actual ride height. Ride height isn't constant. Can you tell me that dropping the car on a pit table is exactly the same ride height as the car coasting down the straight?

The reason for the block is to reduce error. You can exactly replicate your setup on another car, or bring your setup back exactly to where it was the weekend before. Without the blocks, you can only get close. Generally the idea is to set the car up on the track olde school style by feel. When the car is dialed in good. Toss it in the setup system to record everything and give it a good alignment.

My Hudy setup system for 1/8th scale also required the 30mm blocks, and the -1 to -30mm droop gauge. You don't have to use the blocks. You can use a chunk of wood that's 20mm or 19mm or 21mm, it doesn't matter. You can cut a block of wood exactly to your preffered ride ht if you want to. But the 20mm blocks go good with droop gauges.

I'll often dial in the cars suspension while the shocks are off and waiting for air to bubble out. Chassis resting on the blocks.

Zerodefect

I'm considering just drilling holes in my 1/8th setup system that are the same diameter as the XB4 axles. Might work, might not.