Modding a motor
11-25-2009, 11:37 AM
#16
Honestly, I would run it stock. You're not losing races due to lack of horsepower, you probably just need to practice a little more. None of the top level team drivers are running modified engines - they're all stock except for the occasional prototype test parts they run.
Everyone who modifies engines will tell you that you get more of everything, but my experience tells me otherwise in most cases. Set-up the engine properly and tune it well and you'll be able to compete with anyone as long as your driving skills are sharp enough. And don't expect more horsepower to help make up for the mistakes - in fact it's usually a contributing factor that leads to more mistakes.
I've been doing this for Nearly 30 years, and I haven't seen a modified engine win a big off-road event since the advent of CNC where those special features that used to be too expensive in the hand-mill era are now standard and easy for the engine manufacturer to implement with a CNC machine.
Modifying an engine is tricky business, and the ones that do it correctly will do so in a manner that you can't even see the work that's been done. Not because they're trying to hide it, but it involves modifications that are not visible to an untrained eye. All the polishing and extra "fangs" in the sleeves are mostly window dressing except for engines that can REALLY use some flow work, but even then the gains are hardly measurable. Polishing is even detrimental to the performance of the engine because it causes fuel to "stick" and flow less smoothly. In the case of the sleeve it loosens the fit between it and the block, which causes a loss of performance. The modifications that produce really good "numbers" are much more precise and require some pretty sophisticated equipment to measure and map out effective changes.
The long and the short if it is, there are far more people that do it wrong - you can count the ones that really do it right all around the world on one hand. More importantly, you already have enough power to win races. There's no amount of horsepower that will beat good driving skills.
Everyone who modifies engines will tell you that you get more of everything, but my experience tells me otherwise in most cases. Set-up the engine properly and tune it well and you'll be able to compete with anyone as long as your driving skills are sharp enough. And don't expect more horsepower to help make up for the mistakes - in fact it's usually a contributing factor that leads to more mistakes.
I've been doing this for Nearly 30 years, and I haven't seen a modified engine win a big off-road event since the advent of CNC where those special features that used to be too expensive in the hand-mill era are now standard and easy for the engine manufacturer to implement with a CNC machine.
Modifying an engine is tricky business, and the ones that do it correctly will do so in a manner that you can't even see the work that's been done. Not because they're trying to hide it, but it involves modifications that are not visible to an untrained eye. All the polishing and extra "fangs" in the sleeves are mostly window dressing except for engines that can REALLY use some flow work, but even then the gains are hardly measurable. Polishing is even detrimental to the performance of the engine because it causes fuel to "stick" and flow less smoothly. In the case of the sleeve it loosens the fit between it and the block, which causes a loss of performance. The modifications that produce really good "numbers" are much more precise and require some pretty sophisticated equipment to measure and map out effective changes.
The long and the short if it is, there are far more people that do it wrong - you can count the ones that really do it right all around the world on one hand. More importantly, you already have enough power to win races. There's no amount of horsepower that will beat good driving skills.
Even tho I am a engine modder I do agree with much if what your saying here......More power isn't going to magically make someone win races, most stock engines will do the job quite fine...And I also agree the most effective mods are not visible to eye unless you really know what to look for, the visible flow mods do help, but in a very minor way compared to timing and port changes...... I do definitely do some flow work to my engines, but I focus way more attention to altering ports and timing...
However with that being said there are many reasons to want a modified engine that go far beyond just track performance... Believe it or not but not everybody who goes to the track is there to win, some guys are there just to hang out and have fun and play with their toys......There is no question in my mind that a powerful engine is alot more fun to drive then a weak engine... There is nothing cooler then unleashing a monster of engine, it may not make someone a faster racer, in some cases it will make you a slower racer, but you will be smiling the entire time...... My modified engines are pretty dam fun to drive, they are fast and nasty and will definitely stand out out on a track full of stockers... They have a totally different exhaust note that will have everyone asking what your running.. Every time you squeeze the trigger your going to be smiling, that I promise....... I wont make any claims that my engines will make someone a faster racer, I will however guarantee a big increase in power and RPM without losing any fuel economy over stock, in most cases the modifieds get better mileage anyways ..... With that being said my engines still have set many track records, and placed very well at many events over the years......In the end if someone wants a bitchin fast engine I can help them out !
Here's one of my customers having a blast with his engine
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i5qi_ImnmgI
11-25-2009, 12:56 PM
#17
Honestly, I would run it stock. You're not losing races due to lack of horsepower, you probably just need to practice a little more. None of the top level team drivers are running modified engines - they're all stock except for the occasional prototype test parts they run.
Everyone who modifies engines will tell you that you get more of everything, but my experience tells me otherwise in most cases. Set-up the engine properly and tune it well and you'll be able to compete with anyone as long as your driving skills are sharp enough. And don't expect more horsepower to help make up for the mistakes - in fact it's usually a contributing factor that leads to more mistakes.
I've been doing this for Nearly 30 years, and I haven't seen a modified engine win a big off-road event since the advent of CNC where those special features that used to be too expensive in the hand-mill era are now standard and easy for the engine manufacturer to implement with a CNC machine.
Modifying an engine is tricky business, and the ones that do it correctly will do so in a manner that you can't even see the work that's been done. Not because they're trying to hide it, but it involves modifications that are not visible to an untrained eye. All the polishing and extra "fangs" in the sleeves are mostly window dressing except for engines that can REALLY use some flow work, but even then the gains are hardly measurable. Polishing is even detrimental to the performance of the engine because it causes fuel to "stick" and flow less smoothly. In the case of the sleeve it loosens the fit between it and the block, which causes a loss of performance. The modifications that produce really good "numbers" are much more precise and require some pretty sophisticated equipment to measure and map out effective changes.
The long and the short if it is, there are far more people that do it wrong - you can count the ones that really do it right all around the world on one hand. More importantly, you already have enough power to win races. There's no amount of horsepower that will beat good driving skills.
Everyone who modifies engines will tell you that you get more of everything, but my experience tells me otherwise in most cases. Set-up the engine properly and tune it well and you'll be able to compete with anyone as long as your driving skills are sharp enough. And don't expect more horsepower to help make up for the mistakes - in fact it's usually a contributing factor that leads to more mistakes.
I've been doing this for Nearly 30 years, and I haven't seen a modified engine win a big off-road event since the advent of CNC where those special features that used to be too expensive in the hand-mill era are now standard and easy for the engine manufacturer to implement with a CNC machine.
Modifying an engine is tricky business, and the ones that do it correctly will do so in a manner that you can't even see the work that's been done. Not because they're trying to hide it, but it involves modifications that are not visible to an untrained eye. All the polishing and extra "fangs" in the sleeves are mostly window dressing except for engines that can REALLY use some flow work, but even then the gains are hardly measurable. Polishing is even detrimental to the performance of the engine because it causes fuel to "stick" and flow less smoothly. In the case of the sleeve it loosens the fit between it and the block, which causes a loss of performance. The modifications that produce really good "numbers" are much more precise and require some pretty sophisticated equipment to measure and map out effective changes.
The long and the short if it is, there are far more people that do it wrong - you can count the ones that really do it right all around the world on one hand. More importantly, you already have enough power to win races. There's no amount of horsepower that will beat good driving skills.
i agree with steve on the fact that there are "mods for looks" and then there are "mods that matter" . you got to know what you are doing for the modifications to do anything useful . modding to increase efficiency and making useable power are the two hardest things to do and most "modders" overdo it in every sense .
11-25-2009, 02:04 PM
#18
Steve and Houston I totally agree.
I have my guy (Murnan Modified) work on my motors strictly to increase fuel efficiency. Power is worthless if the tires are spinning! Granted MMM can do sick motors but they are of no use when racing if you can't put the power to the ground.
I have my guy (Murnan Modified) work on my motors strictly to increase fuel efficiency. Power is worthless if the tires are spinning! Granted MMM can do sick motors but they are of no use when racing if you can't put the power to the ground.
11-25-2009, 04:36 PM
#21
What's up rageworks? What is up with the disrespect brother? Who are you and what have you purchased and run from me that gives you justification to make your remarks? Is it one of those I heard from my mom who heard from her friend that heard from their sons wifes friend type things or did you actually purchase an engine from me? I hope you are not one of those, it doesn't look like everyone elses so it can't work type people. I have had a lot of those and most of them are now great customers. Do you want to be one? Its ok to try something different. Don't be shy.
11-25-2009, 05:29 PM
#22
Tech Adept
iTrader: (8)
maximo post a link
Throw me a link to your order site I also wanna know do you do rebuilds I have a great running stock losi engine the .21 with the rtr I have about 4 gallons through it and was gonna rebuild it for kicks and buy something new I would like to get a litlle more bottom out of the losi and better fuel economy I am topping out at about 7-8 mins now What type of engine do you think I should get for you to mod for me nothing to top end I would like to spend under $300-350 for the engine I was thinking OS
11-25-2009, 05:42 PM
#23
Throw me a link to your order site I also wanna know do you do rebuilds I have a great running stock losi engine the .21 with the rtr I have about 4 gallons through it and was gonna rebuild it for kicks and buy something new I would like to get a litlle more bottom out of the losi and better fuel economy I am topping out at about 7-8 mins now What type of engine do you think I should get for you to mod for me nothing to top end I would like to spend under $300-350 for the engine I was thinking OS
PM him then call him....you'll be glad you did.
11-25-2009, 05:53 PM
#24
What's up rageworks? What is up with the disrespect brother? Who are you and what have you purchased and run from me that gives you justification to make your remarks? Is it one of those I heard from my mom who heard from her friend that heard from their sons wifes friend type things or did you actually purchase an engine from me? I hope you are not one of those, it doesn't look like everyone elses so it can't work type people. I have had a lot of those and most of them are now great customers. Do you want to be one? Its ok to try something different. Don't be shy.
i am sure,that he can't post his name!
he can only make posts for his buddies....
11-25-2009, 06:08 PM
#25
Tech Master
iTrader: (47)
What's up rageworks? What is up with the disrespect brother? Who are you and what have you purchased and run from me that gives you justification to make your remarks? Is it one of those I heard from my mom who heard from her friend that heard from their sons wifes friend type things or did you actually purchase an engine from me? I hope you are not one of those, it doesn't look like everyone elses so it can't work type people. I have had a lot of those and most of them are now great customers. Do you want to be one? Its ok to try something different. Don't be shy.
to you. I did like how you told me and a few others
how that Novarossi con rod would work as a direct
replacement in the GRP engines. Well it doesn't. It
was my luck that I had one on hand to try, instead
of, like others, went and bought one and found out
it wouldn't work. Sorry buddy, but if I don't feel like
I can trust your word, I can't bring myself to try your
work. I have never made a post that bad mouthed you
or Powerhouse Mods. Nuff said, no reply necessary.
11-25-2009, 06:21 PM
#27
Well I know first hand you can trust Mark and his work. Best modded mill I have ever had and he stands behind his work and so do I, used his modded mill and now he has a costumer for life. the comment you made is bad mouthing him
Ha! Ha! You gotta be kiddin me, right! LMAO!!!............
Not fair to post like that without actually using his mills,
Ha! Ha! You gotta be kiddin me, right! LMAO!!!............
Not fair to post like that without actually using his mills,
11-25-2009, 06:21 PM
#28
Last edited by Audiobahnaholic; 11-25-2009 at 09:40 PM.
11-25-2009, 06:29 PM
#29
I have never made a post that bad mouthed you
or Powerhouse Mods. Nuff said, no reply necessary.
Ha! Ha! You gotta be kiddin me, right! LMAO!!!............
ok!
you must be careful when you are writing.
and these fan boy,etc..to your friends pls!
or Powerhouse Mods. Nuff said, no reply necessary.
Ha! Ha! You gotta be kiddin me, right! LMAO!!!............
ok!
you must be careful when you are writing.
and these fan boy,etc..to your friends pls!
11-25-2009, 07:52 PM
#30
This however, is not the point - the point is, just about every engine has enough power to win races. There seems to be a hyper focus on modifying engines by people that would instead, greatly benefit from a whole lot more practice and would ironically be harmed by more power. If your intention is to have fun, pull wheelies and push out the biggest dirt rooster tail, then modified engines are great for all the non-racing reasons that Maximo mentioned. So are more powerful stock engines, but that's another debate. I'm simply offering an opinion/guidance ***Warning - resume dropping ahead*** "based on many decades of experience." There's nothing that says anyone has to act upon it - I'm just putting it out there for the OP and anyone else that might want an opinion on the subject from someone that will probably die from excess exposure to nitro fuel.