Xray copies
11-01-2008, 10:56 AM
#122
If it bothers you you could do it by your self or you could pay 300 $ more and get a XRAY 008.It's very simple.
11-01-2008, 09:24 PM
#124
I have a little "experiement" for you guys to conduct if you guys want to.
Go to the local supermarket, Buy some Lucky Charms, cheerio's, etc,
Then buy some purina dog chow (or your favorite flavor, whatever...).
Finally, buy the generic "equivilent" of that cereal you chose beforehand.
Open the generic cereal, and open the dogfood,
The smell of the low quality grains, etc, are EXTREMELY simular between the two items, and if you are not convinced that the two (the generic and the name brand cereal) are very different, simply do a side by side taste test.
Now, i'd assume the same applies to cars,
Think about it, would you rather buy a huge bag of dog fo- i mean cereal, or, would you rather spend the bit extra for something that preforms.
This analogy may not be the exact case, but it is simular. I wouldn't mind buying one, only to beat the crap outta it, but at the price and from the materials it is made of, don't expect it to be a fraction of the xray quality wise, regardless of price.
Go to the local supermarket, Buy some Lucky Charms, cheerio's, etc,
Then buy some purina dog chow (or your favorite flavor, whatever...).
Finally, buy the generic "equivilent" of that cereal you chose beforehand.
Open the generic cereal, and open the dogfood,
The smell of the low quality grains, etc, are EXTREMELY simular between the two items, and if you are not convinced that the two (the generic and the name brand cereal) are very different, simply do a side by side taste test.
Now, i'd assume the same applies to cars,
Think about it, would you rather buy a huge bag of dog fo- i mean cereal, or, would you rather spend the bit extra for something that preforms.
This analogy may not be the exact case, but it is simular. I wouldn't mind buying one, only to beat the crap outta it, but at the price and from the materials it is made of, don't expect it to be a fraction of the xray quality wise, regardless of price.
the only thing wrong with eating dog food is it says "dog food" on the label.
along time ago, in a land far away, i used to deliver meat and meat "products" to a butcher shop to make sausage, hot dogs, and various others goodies, once you watch them make some of that stuff, dry dog food ain't so bad
11-01-2008, 09:26 PM
#125
True, the reason the economy is in the crapper is too many people diving too deep into the cookie jar without thinking about anyone else. On the one hand side we want more more more and on the other we wants to pay less less less. If you win that battle it means one or more people have lost and the system, eventually, falls down.
These kinds of reverse engineering activities are no different. The net result will eventually be that companies such as XRay will not be able to survive. Their R&D and focus on quality quite simply cost money. If others then simply copy that and put it on the market much cheaper (quite easy, the R&D cost alone is staggering) then the problems begin. While I agree it is not really ethical to buy such "copy's" (or download illegal DVD copies, music, etc.), in today's world this has become so commonplace that "if you can't beat them join them" and "don't be a thief of your own pocket" play in many consumers minds.
While you can have an ethical debate about the consumers responsibilities and find fault, personally I cannot blame consumers for doing exactly what the "big boys" are doing millions of times over: benefit.
These kinds of reverse engineering activities are no different. The net result will eventually be that companies such as XRay will not be able to survive. Their R&D and focus on quality quite simply cost money. If others then simply copy that and put it on the market much cheaper (quite easy, the R&D cost alone is staggering) then the problems begin. While I agree it is not really ethical to buy such "copy's" (or download illegal DVD copies, music, etc.), in today's world this has become so commonplace that "if you can't beat them join them" and "don't be a thief of your own pocket" play in many consumers minds.
While you can have an ethical debate about the consumers responsibilities and find fault, personally I cannot blame consumers for doing exactly what the "big boys" are doing millions of times over: benefit.
long story short, GREED, but hey, everyones trying to make a profit in this world, so its all good.
11-01-2008, 11:15 PM
#126
I know very well Xray didn't do that for fun.I know also this car is a copy and not an original 008 and costs the 1/3 the XRAY price.And i think with a little work everybody could grind out the chassis so this is not such a problem.The problem is that this car -being a copy- bothers many people here.Come on guys.You didn't find anything positive on this car.Absolutely nothing?Be onest.
11-02-2008, 04:01 AM
#127
I know its a long shot, but take this situation....
''Well Known Company'' makes a high end car. Very fast, wins races around the globe. Lots and lots and lots of hours invested in the design, research and manufacture of the car. As a result, demand is high, and the company puts on extra shifts, and hires local people to fill the orders. To ensure that quality is kept to a maximum, they hire guys to check, check and triple check everything to make sure its all 100% before being packaged (by more employees). For all this financial investment and security offered by ''Well Known Company'', they ask $400 for the car.
''Random guy in another country'' wants to make some money. He sees ''Well Known Company'' charging $400 for a 'toy car', and manages to get hold of one. He thinks he can copy/rip off/steal all the sizes and dimensions of the car, change a couple of materials and sell it at a much lower price. A quick measurement with his verniers and.....hey presto, ''Random guy in another country'' is a car manufacturer. He charges $150 for his version of ''Well Known Company''s car.
'Where is this leading?', I hear you ask...
''Joe Public'' is feeling the pinch of the credit crunch. He wants a new car as his 'LosociatPImo' is a few years old and doesn't cut the mustard at the track anymore. He spots ''Well Known Company''s car, but can't afford (or doesn't want to spend) $400, so he goes for ''Random guy in another country''s car.
All it takes is 4 or 5 people at every track to do the same as ''Joe Public'' and suddenly, ''Well Known Company''s sales are through the floor. They can't run those extra shifts as demand has plummeted. All the staff they took on have to be released as ''Well Known Company''s bank balance is now in the red, and the money isn't there to pay them. Eventually, the company folds.
Is there anything postive about someone stealing the design (and I mean stealing it 100%, same sizes, hole locations etc, not taking design cues and ideas) from a company?
Hell no.
11-02-2008, 06:34 AM
#128
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It's these chap replica kits I believe are ruining the hobby.
Beginners will see something like this and jump all over it. Their reasoning is always, "I just want to see if I like it first".
This car is a perfect example.
For starters, the customer is already being misled by the title of the sale it's being called a T2 008.
Then they see the price and think "A brand new T2 008 for $200? That's great". Forget about the fact the seller does mention it is "based" upon other name brand cars. Most buyers will glaze over that.
When they finally get the vehicle, they realize it's not all they expected it to be.
When it comes time to get parts or warranty service for these copy cat products, forget it. The customer may become disgusted with the hobby, sell the car, and never get back into the hobby.
I've seen this exact scenario played out too many times before. Any gearheads out there remember a certain tool company giving away what LOOKED like a T MAXX if you spent a ridiculous amount of money on tools?
Beginners will see something like this and jump all over it. Their reasoning is always, "I just want to see if I like it first".
This car is a perfect example.
For starters, the customer is already being misled by the title of the sale it's being called a T2 008.
Then they see the price and think "A brand new T2 008 for $200? That's great". Forget about the fact the seller does mention it is "based" upon other name brand cars. Most buyers will glaze over that.
When they finally get the vehicle, they realize it's not all they expected it to be.
When it comes time to get parts or warranty service for these copy cat products, forget it. The customer may become disgusted with the hobby, sell the car, and never get back into the hobby.
I've seen this exact scenario played out too many times before. Any gearheads out there remember a certain tool company giving away what LOOKED like a T MAXX if you spent a ridiculous amount of money on tools?
11-02-2008, 07:27 AM
#129
China and their government have no problem copying anything. As long as it helps their economy they are going to copy it. The safety of the public who buys it? They don't give a crap.
a 200 dollar xray copy may not be a big deal for anyone except XRays pocketbook however if you look at the bigger picture you can see how more harm can be done by creating a culture of copying products:
1) China produced Milk - added melamine (chemical to make plastic goods) to trick tests that it had more protein after they watered the real milk down.
Result- caused kidney stones/renal problems in >10000 infants and 5 deaths.
2) Copy prescription drugs - can you imagine your parent/grandparent getting a stroke because the cheaper blood pressure pills they bought were chinese imitation pills and the actual contents were really filled with something consistent with drywall?
3) Childrens toothpaste - that had consisted of the same ingredient as automotive antifreeze?
I try to stay away from all chinese products but thats practically impossible these days.
Not all Chinese products are bad, but throw in a few bad apples and it makes them all look bad.
a 200 dollar xray copy may not be a big deal for anyone except XRays pocketbook however if you look at the bigger picture you can see how more harm can be done by creating a culture of copying products:
1) China produced Milk - added melamine (chemical to make plastic goods) to trick tests that it had more protein after they watered the real milk down.
Result- caused kidney stones/renal problems in >10000 infants and 5 deaths.
2) Copy prescription drugs - can you imagine your parent/grandparent getting a stroke because the cheaper blood pressure pills they bought were chinese imitation pills and the actual contents were really filled with something consistent with drywall?
3) Childrens toothpaste - that had consisted of the same ingredient as automotive antifreeze?
I try to stay away from all chinese products but thats practically impossible these days.
Not all Chinese products are bad, but throw in a few bad apples and it makes them all look bad.
11-02-2008, 07:41 AM
#130
double post
Last edited by teabag; 11-02-2008 at 06:31 PM. Reason: double post
11-02-2008, 11:18 AM
#132
It's very funny.I don't see XRAY complaining about this ,only other rc drivers,proud xray owners or whatever.
11-02-2008, 11:29 AM
#134
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I think that's because since it's made in china they know there is nothing they can do about it.Just like the company named Iwaver producing copies of the kyosho mini-z mr-02.and I mean they are EXACT copies. all peices 100% interchangeable. And kyosho does nothing about it because the chinese government doesnt allow lawsuits from outside their country, they deal with everything internally. so Kyosho just lives with it and hopes that customers purchase their product based on quality.I am sure Xray is taking the same stance.Especially with the negative attitude towards the copies being shown on forums like this one.
11-02-2008, 11:59 AM
#135
I got a PM on the Xray forums comfirming that they will be taking legal action.