Go Back  R/C Tech Forums > General Forums > Electric On-Road
Silver Can Motor Tips/Tricks >

Silver Can Motor Tips/Tricks

Like Tree3Likes

Silver Can Motor Tips/Tricks

Old 03-14-2007, 01:27 PM
  #346  
Tech Fanatic
 
muahdib4's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: Raymore
Posts: 863
Default

Originally Posted by loopedeloop
Apparently they are easy to open but very difficult to put back together without leaving signs that it has been opened.
Its easy to advance timing but also easy to check current draw on a motor checker.
Over here we are enforcing a 1.7A max current unloaded at 8 volts.
If your motor draws close to the limit it is subject to a 2nd test in reverse direction. If the current draw is different the tech person can disqualify you as this points to the motor being "timed".

Best just to leave it alone and run it in properly for the best performance.

You will spend the rest of your life trying to shake off the label "CHEATER"

It just aint worth it
I had and have NO intention of doing it. When I suggested silvercan as a good beginner type racing I was told that cheating with them is extremely easy and everyone does it now and simply would do it in the future. They prefer coming up with a voltage limiter that someone would have to invent to go between the motor and ESC or going to 4-5 cells in a battery pack...both of which would cost racers more money then just buying a good silvercan and race.
muahdib4 is offline  
Old 03-14-2007, 01:37 PM
  #347  
Tech Regular
 
loopedeloop's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Whangarei Newzealand
Posts: 490
Default

I guess cheating is easy but it's also easy to bust these W***ers with a simple tech test.
Silver can is THE best form of spec and entry level racing.
The 1.7A current limit keeps things even, simple as that.
loopedeloop is offline  
Old 03-14-2007, 01:41 PM
  #348  
Tech Fanatic
 
muahdib4's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: Raymore
Posts: 863
Default

Originally Posted by loopedeloop
I guess cheating is easy but it's also easy to bust these W***ers with a simple tech test.
Silver can is THE best form of spec and entry level racing.
The 1.7A current limit keeps things even, simple as that.
That's what I thought too, but they'd rather complicate things. I think Canada TCS has a 1.3A current limit and I'd be fine with any of that.
muahdib4 is offline  
Old 03-14-2007, 01:44 PM
  #349  
Tech Elite
iTrader: (74)
 
Customworksking's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: Springfield ILLINOIS
Posts: 3,665
Trader Rating: 74 (100%+)
Default

anything over 2amps will over heat if u run a 20 tooth pinion just buy motors til u get a good 1
Customworksking is offline  
Old 03-14-2007, 01:49 PM
  #350  
Tech Regular
 
loopedeloop's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Whangarei Newzealand
Posts: 490
Default

Originally Posted by muahdib4
That's what I thought too, but they'd rather complicate things. I think Canada TCS has a 1.3A current limit and I'd be fine with any of that.
Just keep the pressure on. There seems to be a bias in rc against the use of these motors. I cant understand it as the silver can classes over here are the best supported and most competitive we race.
Not to mention the cheapest to run both in setup cost and running costs/wear and tear.

Just check out the success of this grade at any club that runs them. It speaks for itself.
loopedeloop is offline  
Old 03-14-2007, 01:51 PM
  #351  
Tech Champion
iTrader: (108)
 
Core Creations's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2001
Location: Back in the booth
Posts: 6,283
Trader Rating: 108 (100%+)
Default

So that makes me wonder if some are cranking a small amount at a time to get a performance gain without going over the amp limit? I guess I am in the dark as to how it's done, and plan on keeping it that way. But this summer with our mini class I will be teching motors including my own to keep all things fair. I guess as long as their is opportunity to cheat, some will

I'd love to start a GT3 class this summer too!!
Core Creations is offline  
Old 03-14-2007, 02:10 PM
  #352  
Tech Regular
 
loopedeloop's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Whangarei Newzealand
Posts: 490
Default

The cranking small amounts of timing should be shown up by a reverse direction test. If the current draw is less in reverse it would lead you to suspect timing has been applied.
loopedeloop is offline  
Old 03-14-2007, 02:34 PM
  #353  
Tech Fanatic
 
muahdib4's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: Raymore
Posts: 863
Default

Originally Posted by Core Creations
So that makes me wonder if some are cranking a small amount at a time to get a performance gain without going over the amp limit? I guess I am in the dark as to how it's done, and plan on keeping it that way. But this summer with our mini class I will be teching motors including my own to keep all things fair. I guess as long as their is opportunity to cheat, some will

I'd love to start a GT3 class this summer too!!
Cool, tech mine...I barely know what to do with the ones I have other than plug them in and go. Also, I thought Johnson motors were suppled with most, if not all, Tamiya kits...I was putting my Swift together last night and there was a Mabuchi in there?!?!? If you could get people to run a GT3 class, I'd give it a shot. I still have my TA05 though no motor in it but I've got a good assortment of silvercans to play with.
muahdib4 is offline  
Old 03-14-2007, 02:45 PM
  #354  
Tech Champion
iTrader: (108)
 
Core Creations's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2001
Location: Back in the booth
Posts: 6,283
Trader Rating: 108 (100%+)
Default

My Swift came with a Mabuchi too.
Core Creations is offline  
Old 03-14-2007, 02:45 PM
  #355  
Tech Adept
iTrader: (1)
 
darkfox's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: Regina, SK, Canada
Posts: 211
Trader Rating: 1 (100%+)
Default

I've heard of guys using a vice and then a high torque drill to tighten the winds slightly to get 20-23,000 rpms at 7.2volts. other ones I've heard are using a Dremel to break in the motor rather than a battery, you tighten the Dremel to the armature and then spin it in a glass of water at max speed for a couple seconds (usually 30,000rpms) and the motor will then spin 25,000 at 7.2.

Another trick I've actually seen is someone put a silver-can into their magnet zapper before a race. Actually works well for the first three minutes or so if you can manage to drive a clean line you can try and put laps on everyone until the zap wears down.

PS: Silver cans come as Mubashi OR Johnson. Depends on the model and where it comes from.
darkfox is offline  
Old 03-14-2007, 05:07 PM
  #356  
Tech Elite
iTrader: (8)
 
rccardr's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2003
Location: The Secret Underground Laboratory
Posts: 2,353
Trader Rating: 8 (100%+)
Default

1) It is not possible to open a modern silver can motor and put it back together without it being very obvious. Period.
2) It is not possible to crank a modern silver can motor (advance the timing) without killing it due to the cam lock installed when it is manufactured. Period.
3) It is possible to advance the timing slightly on a modern silver can motor using a magnet zapper, but while RPM goes up, torque goes waaaaaay down.

Take it from someone who's been there for a long time (check out the avatar): if you want a fast silver can motor, buy A LOT OF THEM, test them all, water dip and break in the fastest ones, and sell the rest to the kids in the neighborhood. Ask pretty much anyone in TCS: my silver cans ROCK...and they are legal. Including the amp draw thing.
rccardr is offline  
Old 03-14-2007, 05:09 PM
  #357  
Tech Elite
iTrader: (114)
 
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: Janesville, Wisconsin
Posts: 2,919
Trader Rating: 114 (100%+)
Default

rccardr, "silver cans that rock"
He is Right!
Wise Tamiya Man!
Dave
dragracer72nova is offline  
Old 03-15-2007, 03:04 AM
  #358  
Tech Elite
 
sosidge's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2001
Location: Bristol, UK
Posts: 4,435
Default

Are the Tamiya-supplied silvercans with a black metal endbell (assume it is a Johnson) KNOWN to be faster than the current grey-endbell motors?

Someone at the local club dug a black-endbell motor out of an old buggy and reckons it kicks the grey endbell motors on the motor checker.
sosidge is offline  
Old 03-15-2007, 04:04 AM
  #359  
Tech Master
iTrader: (6)
 
ford_racing's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: Canberra
Posts: 1,480
Trader Rating: 6 (100%+)
Default

Originally Posted by darkfox
other ones I've heard are using a Dremel to break in the motor rather than a battery, you tighten the Dremel to the armature and then spin it in a glass of water at max speed for a couple seconds (usually 30,000rpms) and the motor will then spin 25,000 at 7.2.
I might have to try that one out, do you know how long you do it for?
ford_racing is offline  
Old 03-15-2007, 07:21 AM
  #360  
Tech Adept
iTrader: (1)
 
darkfox's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: Regina, SK, Canada
Posts: 211
Trader Rating: 1 (100%+)
Default

For a couple seconds. The thought pattern behind this seems to be two-fold. First, that you're excellerating the break-in for a silver can, silver cans just run better and better with time. Second, some will argue that the speed you're pushing into the motor will tighten the winds around the armature because the motor was never meant to spin more than 20,000rpm. Either way, any silver can I've seen this happen two do two things. Go fast and draw over 11amps. Technically it's not cheating, but drawing that many amps out of a silver can is against TCS rules.
darkfox is offline  

Thread Tools
Search this Thread

Contact Us - Archive - Advertising - Cookie Policy - Privacy Statement - Terms of Service -

Copyright © 2024 MH Sub I, LLC dba Internet Brands. All rights reserved. Use of this site indicates your consent to the Terms of Use.