Serpent 720
03-13-2007, 11:10 PM
#2116
Tech Adept
I received the above sheet with my 720 and emailed Serpent with a question regarding endplay (to which they never responded). Everywhere else I've read on this subject says that the end play should be minimal. To me 0.5mm (1/2 mm), or thereabouts depending on the engine, is not minimal. I am curious if I am mistaken or do not understand what was written. I set mine to 0.05mm for an OS engine using a dial indicator (assuming the number was correct but a decimel point off).
03-13-2007, 11:57 PM
#2117
Tech Regular
Originally Posted by calvin
I received the above sheet with my 720 and emailed Serpent with a question regarding endplay (to which they never responded). Everywhere else I've read on this subject says that the end play should be minimal. To me 0.5mm (1/2 mm), or thereabouts depending on the engine, is not minimal. I am curious if I am mistaken or do not understand what was written. I set mine to 0.05mm for an OS engine using a dial indicator (assuming the number was correct but a decimel point off).
What grease do you guys use on the thrust bearing, do you guys use the ceramic one?
03-14-2007, 12:06 AM
#2118
I use Tamiya Moblydenum (not sure about spelling) grease.. It's the black grease and I'm happy with it..
Asil
Asil
03-14-2007, 01:49 AM
#2119
Originally Posted by rcpanama
Hi Julius, I tested the 3rd one way and new chassis on Sunday, the result was excellent, the 3rd one-way was unnoticed, it didn’t really affected my driving, braking was as normal as always, the benefit was that the difference between the front and rear tire was minimal, I started with a 1.5mm lower in the front than the rear, after 20 minutes of raising I had a 1.5 to 2mm difference between the rear and front, not any more the difference was lest than 1mm.
The new chassis in my track was better with the carbon plate install, I always had traction roll, not at all with the new chassis the combination of 3rd one way and new chassis was excellent I Think Serpent had a AAA with this options.
I have a technical question in regards to my Set Up, the set up I am showing is the normal set up I am using, our track (Parking lot) has a low to mid traction, with two fast turns and two hair pins, I am having some problem getting read of a excess Over steer in Conner Exit on Throttle:
What will be the area I should change most to correct it with out affecting to much the performance of the car. (This is most to happen went the traction of the track is low)
SET UP I HAVE
SPUR
59/56
Pinion
17/23
Front Axle
Ball Diff with Alu Collar
Rear Axle
Diff with 10,000
Front Shock
Three (3) holes 35 Red Spring
Rear Shocks
Two (2) holes 35 Red Spring
Front Anti Roll Bar
45°
Rear Anti Roll Bar
o.o mm
Front Tyres
40 Jaco Serpent 63.5mm
Rear Tures
40 Jaco Serpent 65mm
Engine
Novarossi Plus 12 3CT Murnan Headshim 0.4mm
Pipe
Novarossi 2630 six fins
Body
Stratus 3.1 (34 mm)
Front Roll Center
Top
Rear Roll Center
Mid Upper
Rear Camber Link Position
Bottom
Rear Camber Rise Position
Outer
Front Shocks Mounting
Second lowest
Rear Shock Mounting
Lowest
Front down Stop
0 mm
Rear down Stop
7.0 mm
Front Camber
2° Left & Right
Rear Camber
3° Left & Right
Front Toe out
1
Rear Toe in
2.5
Side Pulley 22t
Servo Saver
Long
Thanks
RCPANAMA
The new chassis in my track was better with the carbon plate install, I always had traction roll, not at all with the new chassis the combination of 3rd one way and new chassis was excellent I Think Serpent had a AAA with this options.
I have a technical question in regards to my Set Up, the set up I am showing is the normal set up I am using, our track (Parking lot) has a low to mid traction, with two fast turns and two hair pins, I am having some problem getting read of a excess Over steer in Conner Exit on Throttle:
What will be the area I should change most to correct it with out affecting to much the performance of the car. (This is most to happen went the traction of the track is low)
SET UP I HAVE
SPUR
59/56
Pinion
17/23
Front Axle
Ball Diff with Alu Collar
Rear Axle
Diff with 10,000
Front Shock
Three (3) holes 35 Red Spring
Rear Shocks
Two (2) holes 35 Red Spring
Front Anti Roll Bar
45°
Rear Anti Roll Bar
o.o mm
Front Tyres
40 Jaco Serpent 63.5mm
Rear Tures
40 Jaco Serpent 65mm
Engine
Novarossi Plus 12 3CT Murnan Headshim 0.4mm
Pipe
Novarossi 2630 six fins
Body
Stratus 3.1 (34 mm)
Front Roll Center
Top
Rear Roll Center
Mid Upper
Rear Camber Link Position
Bottom
Rear Camber Rise Position
Outer
Front Shocks Mounting
Second lowest
Rear Shock Mounting
Lowest
Front down Stop
0 mm
Rear down Stop
7.0 mm
Front Camber
2° Left & Right
Rear Camber
3° Left & Right
Front Toe out
1
Rear Toe in
2.5
Side Pulley 22t
Servo Saver
Long
Thanks
RCPANAMA
Let me help if I may....
Looks as if you have no front droop(front downstop) to create some weight transfer to the rear under power. Maybe start with 2 or 3mm and go from there. Easy adjustment with no disassembly.
Please dont mind my lurking around these threads. Just observing cause i'm shopping for a new car
.
03-14-2007, 01:55 AM
#2120
Originally Posted by asil
I use Tamiya Moblydenum (not sure about spelling) grease.. It's the black grease and I'm happy with it..
Asil
Asil
same here, Tamiya Molybdenum grease. but i am not sure know how frequent should the grease be reapplied. is every hour of running just about right or is this practice too conservative?
03-14-2007, 02:13 AM
#2121
Originally Posted by FREAKAH
Let me help if I may....
Looks as if you have no front droop(front downstop) to create some weight transfer to the rear under power. Maybe start with 2 or 3mm and go from there. Easy adjustment with no disassembly.
Please dont mind my lurking around these threads. Just observing cause i'm shopping for a new car .
Looks as if you have no front droop(front downstop) to create some weight transfer to the rear under power. Maybe start with 2 or 3mm and go from there. Easy adjustment with no disassembly.
Please dont mind my lurking around these threads. Just observing cause i'm shopping for a new car
.But it might be an idea to try -1mm downstop to see if it helps. I would think the car will be more unpredictable in its line out of the corner though.
03-14-2007, 02:17 AM
#2122
Originally Posted by RevMaxx
same here, Tamiya Molybdenum grease. but i am not sure know how frequent should the grease be reapplied. is every hour of running just about right or is this practice too conservative?
In response to the questions of end play on the clutch.
- too much and the thrust bearing will get too much free movement and that is bad. Too little and when everything gets warm and expands, the bearing will be crushed.
I run about 0.2mm on all my engines. 0.5mm does seem a bit much.
To check if you're not running too little play, feel if there is play just after you've ran the car. Then all parts are warm and if there is still noticable play you're not too tight.
03-14-2007, 02:19 AM
#2123
Originally Posted by calvin
I received the above sheet with my 720 and emailed Serpent with a question regarding endplay (to which they never responded). Everywhere else I've read on this subject says that the end play should be minimal. To me 0.5mm (1/2 mm), or thereabouts depending on the engine, is not minimal. I am curious if I am mistaken or do not understand what was written. I set mine to 0.05mm for an OS engine using a dial indicator (assuming the number was correct but a decimel point off).
_cyclops_ : If you don't shim the endplay, your clutch bell will drag on the clutch shoe, which is very bad. Also, if the endplay is too large, you have too much movement of the clutch bell along the crankshaft, which causes hard engagement, which could potentially lead to thrust bearing failure.
03-14-2007, 02:21 AM
#2124
You are right Julius, 2-3mm may be a bit drastic. Like you said -1mm or even -.5mm would be a better starting point to see if it makes a difference.
03-14-2007, 02:21 AM
#2125
Hi Julius ~ Didn't see your post before I hit the submit button. 
03-14-2007, 02:38 AM
#2126
Originally Posted by buboy28
Julius, hope to race with you this coming Friday and do hope you enjoy your short stay in our country 
03-14-2007, 03:05 AM
#2127
Tech Regular
Thanks for clearing up the end-play story Julius and rmdhawaii.
It's not that i'm having trouble, i actually used only 1 thrust bearing in the last season. I don't measure the end-play, i just make sure it has a little end-play but not much, maximum of 0.3 i think... I use the Associated Black Grease. It's very smooth and stays on the bearing quite ok. I reapply the grease after about 2 hours of driving, 2 hours is tops though, better do it more often!
I used to use the *spitspit* supergrease, but that was to sticky, the car actually rolled when idling when i just applied the grease.. that stuff does work wonders in an endurance race i guess, it stays on there for ages!
It's not that i'm having trouble, i actually used only 1 thrust bearing in the last season. I don't measure the end-play, i just make sure it has a little end-play but not much, maximum of 0.3 i think... I use the Associated Black Grease. It's very smooth and stays on the bearing quite ok. I reapply the grease after about 2 hours of driving, 2 hours is tops though, better do it more often!
I used to use the *spitspit* supergrease, but that was to sticky, the car actually rolled when idling when i just applied the grease.. that stuff does work wonders in an endurance race i guess, it stays on there for ages!
03-14-2007, 03:59 AM
#2128
Originally Posted by RevMaxx
awesome... good to know you'll be joining with the 720, at least for now there will be 2 - 720 presence in the event. i'm still a newbie on touring and will be my 1st race so looking forward for the experience and hope to learn good tips 
doki-doki (keith) left for the US last month and i believe is now in florida, sadly he won't be able to join the event.... cool!!!
doki-doki (keith) left for the US last month and i believe is now in florida, sadly he won't be able to join the event.... cool!!!
i'm also a newbie here and hope i can learn some tips from Julius so that i can also share it with you 
03-14-2007, 04:00 AM
#2129
Originally Posted by Julius
I'm looking forward to it. Hope I can stay of the boards!
03-14-2007, 07:18 AM
#2130
Just some insite information on the clutch sheet. Not sure who wrote it but I will say the a lot of us drivers for Serpent USA like a very aggressive clutch. That calls for a little more end play. I do not use, as much as what was put, but I am almost as much. The less end play the smoother the clutches intial contact. The more travel, the more aggressive.