17.5 Blinky, too fast for beginners?
11-12-2014, 05:29 PM
#46
I run 17.5 locally (no slower sedan classes was offered at the time) but raced VTA and USGT during our texas events. Won those classes and eventually moved up to 17.5 at the events after developing my driving and setup. A properly setup car makes racing more fun, consistent, and competitive.
The thing is when I started winning and running up front I moved away from the slower class after the season was over. I believe doing so will hopefully provide more growth for others running those classes instead of blowing them out everytime I race. Gives them a chance to run and front and be competitive amongst each other. Now I'm running 17.5 again my level is mid pack and I can work may way up hopefully.
The thing is when I started winning and running up front I moved away from the slower class after the season was over. I believe doing so will hopefully provide more growth for others running those classes instead of blowing them out everytime I race. Gives them a chance to run and front and be competitive amongst each other. Now I'm running 17.5 again my level is mid pack and I can work may way up hopefully.
11-12-2014, 05:35 PM
#47
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11-12-2014, 05:56 PM
#48
I disagree with the assertion that 17.5 is too fast for a beginner. Its too fast if they want to treat the throttle like a switch, or just drive with it pinned wide open and steer like a video game, but it is not that fast. People forget how fast we went on cells and brushed motors.
On road racing is less popular than offroad for three reasons. 1, it is hard, you can literally make your car undrivable through poor tuning. 2, you can only drive on road on a prepared or semi-prepared surface, no bashing in the ditch and throwing dirt around the back yard. And 3, we lack the novelty of having 5-10 semi- controlled crashes a lap known as jumps. That's why. Its hard, lacks novelty, and no backyard bashing. I know, I raced offroad for years before I ever drove a road car.
On road racing is less popular than offroad for three reasons. 1, it is hard, you can literally make your car undrivable through poor tuning. 2, you can only drive on road on a prepared or semi-prepared surface, no bashing in the ditch and throwing dirt around the back yard. And 3, we lack the novelty of having 5-10 semi- controlled crashes a lap known as jumps. That's why. Its hard, lacks novelty, and no backyard bashing. I know, I raced offroad for years before I ever drove a road car.
11-12-2014, 06:12 PM
#49
Keep in mind beginners have little issue driving a 2 sp pull start nitro car that is capable of 60-70km/hr out of the box but hand the same person a high torque 17.5T TC and they will struggle and frequently crash.
11-12-2014, 06:25 PM
#50
Reading this thread is illuminating. A bunch of "man up" responses, a few who only see to the end of their pit table, and some suggestions of what has worked for them.
I have been doing this a long time, and the only constant is the cars getting faster. 17.5 is too fast for the average new person.
I won't even try to answer what solution is needed. I do know when cars were slower there were more participants, and that goes from modified to 27t stock motors.
I have been doing this a long time, and the only constant is the cars getting faster. 17.5 is too fast for the average new person.
I won't even try to answer what solution is needed. I do know when cars were slower there were more participants, and that goes from modified to 27t stock motors.
11-12-2014, 06:32 PM
#51
Tech Regular
Reading this thread is illuminating. A bunch of "man up" responses, a few who only see to the end of their pit table, and some suggestions of what has worked for them.
I have been doing this a long time, and the only constant is the cars getting faster. 17.5 is too fast for the average new person.
I won't even try to answer what solution is needed. I do know when cars were slower there were more participants, and that goes from modified to 27t stock motors.
I have been doing this a long time, and the only constant is the cars getting faster. 17.5 is too fast for the average new person.
I won't even try to answer what solution is needed. I do know when cars were slower there were more participants, and that goes from modified to 27t stock motors.
11-12-2014, 06:50 PM
#52
Back in the day we raced because cars were fast and it was fun... Now people only want to race if the cars are so slow that anyone can drive them? Times have changed I guess.... Used to be racers filled with desire to be good rather than creating more classes that are so slow anyone can drive them.
11-12-2014, 06:54 PM
#53
Tech Adept
Reading this thread is illuminating. A bunch of "man up" responses, a few who only see to the end of their pit table, and some suggestions of what has worked for them.
I have been doing this a long time, and the only constant is the cars getting faster. 17.5 is too fast for the average new person.
I won't even try to answer what solution is needed. I do know when cars were slower there were more participants, and that goes from modified to 27t stock motors.
I have been doing this a long time, and the only constant is the cars getting faster. 17.5 is too fast for the average new person.
I won't even try to answer what solution is needed. I do know when cars were slower there were more participants, and that goes from modified to 27t stock motors.
11-12-2014, 07:05 PM
#54
Back in the day we raced because cars were fast and it was fun... Now people only want to race if the cars are so slow that anyone can drive them? Times have changed I guess.... Used to be racers filled with desire to be good rather than creating more classes that are so slow anyone can drive them.
Essentially, we changed over to 7 cell racing.
11-12-2014, 07:07 PM
#55
Back in the day we raced because cars were fast and it was fun... Now people only want to race if the cars are so slow that anyone can drive them? Times have changed I guess.... Used to be racers filled with desire to be good rather than creating more classes that are so slow anyone can drive them.
11-12-2014, 07:22 PM
#56
What can we do as a hobby to make it less intimidating to race on-road? A decent 17.5 motor running in blinky mode can be a handful for a unskilled or beginning driver. It sure seem my cars are running way faster with brushless stock now than they were running 27 turn brushed motors a few years ago.
What would it take to make 21.5 turn brushless the entry level? Even an older driver with decreasing reactions doesn’t always need to run the fastest class. Currently we have a couple of the SoCal tracks running GT10 classes that are Stock Sedan with different bodies and spoked wheels. The speeds and setup are pretty much the same as Stock.
Anyone else out there think a 21.5 GT class could work? VTA cars welcome too. Basically just a 21.5 blinky class. All skill levels welcome but a slightly slower race.
What would it take to make 21.5 turn brushless the entry level? Even an older driver with decreasing reactions doesn’t always need to run the fastest class. Currently we have a couple of the SoCal tracks running GT10 classes that are Stock Sedan with different bodies and spoked wheels. The speeds and setup are pretty much the same as Stock.
Anyone else out there think a 21.5 GT class could work? VTA cars welcome too. Basically just a 21.5 blinky class. All skill levels welcome but a slightly slower race.
We've had great success growing new racers in Seattle. On the TC side, we offer the tandem of Stock (17.5/blinky) and Mod. But our foundation class is Scale Spec, a VTA/USGT combo. Deep fields every race meeting, a fine mix of newbs and established talent, and good times across the board. I'll emphasize it's not a Novice class. We offer Novice most nights as well. But Scale Spec is where our new racers make their bones.
Scale Spec: 1/10th scale electric chassis. 5mm minimum ride height. Tamiya 540 silver can motor or Novak SS Pro 25.5t (PN: 3425V), Ballistic 25.5t (PN: 3625V), and Ballistic Boss VTA Edition (PN: 3626V) brushless motors. 12.3mm rotors only. No restriction on endbell timing. ROAR-approved Non-Timing ESC for brushless motors. HPI D Compound tires. Realistic, scale bodies must be run on all chassis. VTA bodies may run included rear-deck spoilers. GT bodies may run included wings, or option wing sets that emphasize scale appearance. Maximum 6-cell NiMH or NiCd batteries or maximum 7.4v 2S lithium technology batteries. Lithium technology batteries must be in hard case. 4wd: 1450g minimum weight. FWD: No minimum weight. M-Chassis: No minimum weight. Open tire on Mini rims. The spirit of Scale Spec is reasonable cost, scale-appearance, even, competitive racing. Scale livery is encouraged. Drivers are encouraged to operate both within the letter and spirit of the rules.
Scale Spec: 1/10th scale electric chassis. 5mm minimum ride height. Tamiya 540 silver can motor or Novak SS Pro 25.5t (PN: 3425V), Ballistic 25.5t (PN: 3625V), and Ballistic Boss VTA Edition (PN: 3626V) brushless motors. 12.3mm rotors only. No restriction on endbell timing. ROAR-approved Non-Timing ESC for brushless motors. HPI D Compound tires. Realistic, scale bodies must be run on all chassis. VTA bodies may run included rear-deck spoilers. GT bodies may run included wings, or option wing sets that emphasize scale appearance. Maximum 6-cell NiMH or NiCd batteries or maximum 7.4v 2S lithium technology batteries. Lithium technology batteries must be in hard case. 4wd: 1450g minimum weight. FWD: No minimum weight. M-Chassis: No minimum weight. Open tire on Mini rims. The spirit of Scale Spec is reasonable cost, scale-appearance, even, competitive racing. Scale livery is encouraged. Drivers are encouraged to operate both within the letter and spirit of the rules.
Moose, when you visited Seattle last year (or very early this year, I can't remember), I loaned you my Scale Spec car for a race night at the Hanger. I'm pretty sure you enjoyed yourself.
-Mike
11-12-2014, 07:54 PM
#57
I disagree with the assertion that 17.5 is too fast for a beginner. Its too fast if they want to treat the throttle like a switch, or just drive with it pinned wide open and steer like a video game, but it is not that fast. People forget how fast we went on cells and brushed motors.
On road racing is less popular than offroad for three reasons. 1, it is hard, you can literally make your car undrivable through poor tuning. 2, you can only drive on road on a prepared or semi-prepared surface, no bashing in the ditch and throwing dirt around the back yard. And 3, we lack the novelty of having 5-10 semi- controlled crashes a lap known as jumps. That's why. Its hard, lacks novelty, and no backyard bashing. I know, I raced offroad for years before I ever drove a road car.
On road racing is less popular than offroad for three reasons. 1, it is hard, you can literally make your car undrivable through poor tuning. 2, you can only drive on road on a prepared or semi-prepared surface, no bashing in the ditch and throwing dirt around the back yard. And 3, we lack the novelty of having 5-10 semi- controlled crashes a lap known as jumps. That's why. Its hard, lacks novelty, and no backyard bashing. I know, I raced offroad for years before I ever drove a road car.
It's (off vs. on-road) not much different than Supercross vs. Superbike. Off-road is just more popular.. has nothing to do with attitudes.
17.5 is too fast for a guy that has never wheeled a car at all. Beyond that, yeah speeds are up these days, but so are the quality of the cars we are strapping the motors into. Modern cars put the power down and stay stable to a much higher degree.
Legends- hey, thumbs up. Cheap and mad easy to wheel with foam tires and very low HP. Not a bad choice for any club. I've been watching them run lately and might even build one myself to run with the locals...
11-12-2014, 07:55 PM
#58
I disagree with the assertion that 17.5 is too fast for a beginner. Its too fast if they want to treat the throttle like a switch, or just drive with it pinned wide open and steer like a video game, but it is not that fast. People forget how fast we went on cells and brushed
Anybody have dyno slips from brushed motors? A 27t was what, 40-50 watts or something like that? A good 17.5 is 150+ watts now.
Watch this vid. This is 19t back in the day. Thats maybe 17.5 speed now. The cars have gotten much faster, but all the racers have gotten better over time as well and dont realize how much...
| + YouTube Video | |
11-12-2014, 08:18 PM
#60
This post sums up this whole thread the best!!! Some of the ones that are now the "experts" and "pros" have forgotten the days when they were the newbie and guys with the attitudes like they have now were the ones complaining about the slow, erratic new racers in the way, messing up laps times and podium finishes. How soon some forget..........