Community
Wiki Posts
Search

Pinch too TIGHT!

Thread Tools
 
Search this Thread
 
Old 01-20-2008 | 06:21 PM
  #16  
CKmaxx's Avatar
Tech Regular
iTrader: (1)
 
Joined: Sep 2005
Posts: 486
From: Sask, Canada
Default

Originally Posted by TomB
no i'm not. if this does not fix it, then it's possible that the piston and sleeve is a very bad match, and something went terribly wrong when it was assembled in the factory. might be one of those 1 in 5000 type scenarios.
Still, pinch has nothing to do with head shims. If an engine is getting stuck at TDC, more head shims is not going to help this situation. The engine just needs to be run in more. Sometimes you have to fight with high quality engines before they run right but in the end will still be worth it.
CKmaxx is offline  
Old 01-21-2008 | 03:50 PM
  #17  
MugenDrew's Avatar
Tech Elite
iTrader: (36)
 
Joined: Aug 2006
Posts: 2,157
From: Apollo Beach, Florida
Default

Brand new piston and Sleeve. The slime/gunk is from Castor re-forming. Castor provides Superior protection when used in 2-cycle applications due to the fact that when it is brought under extreme pressure (generated by friction/ or by extreme heat) its molecules reform/transform/combine into larger ones there by keeping expanding parts from making contact with each other. The draw back is the residue that becomes baked onto the hot spots. So based on this slime issue; yes you have excessive pinch and the engine is being run rich enough that your not "Baking the Castor" but getting close.
So maybe the guy running the synchronizer sneezed and in the process knocked over a couple of p.s. sets and the pistons fell out of there respective sleeves. Being that he is paid "piece work" he put back together which ever one was closest to the other. Somewhere out there, there is a person who just replaced his piston and sleeve. 1 gallon threw there engine its worn out.
You have not mentioned the manufacture? I have a piston and sleeve new in the bag that has never been opened. The reason is the piston is past the top of the sleeve to the point that the entire wrist pin bore is visible. Took pictures and called the importer...Sorry for the book.
MugenDrew is offline  
Old 01-22-2008 | 04:48 AM
  #18  
rcfoolz's Avatar
Thread Starter
Tech Elite
iTrader: (22)
 
Joined: Sep 2003
Posts: 3,327
Default

it is a nova based engine. X12 Mugen engine.
rcfoolz is offline  
Old 01-22-2008 | 05:27 AM
  #19  
Speedypeterb's Avatar
Tech Fanatic
iTrader: (16)
 
Joined: Oct 2002
Posts: 775
From: Pompano Beach FL.
Default tight

either return the engine or start honing the piston down with super fine sand paper. I know edward used to have a honing sleeve
Speedypeterb is offline  
Old 01-22-2008 | 07:17 AM
  #20  
MugenDrew's Avatar
Tech Elite
iTrader: (36)
 
Joined: Aug 2006
Posts: 2,157
From: Apollo Beach, Florida
Default

LOL, then maybe I have your piston! I would return it. The old K&b outboard engines had to be lapped. We used extra fine valve lapping compound and worked the piston in and out in a figure 8 pattern until the bottom of the wrist pin hole was just visible at the top of the exhaust port. I would return it...
MugenDrew is offline  
Old 02-17-2008 | 06:12 PM
  #21  
xray_guy's Avatar
Tech Initiate
iTrader: (1)
 
Joined: Jan 2008
Posts: 21
Default

A very tight pinch can be caused by by a sleeve that is "egg shapped". This is not very common from the factory but it is very common from having a resize done. Pull your engine down and put the piston through the sleeve unitl it is tight. Shine a flashlight into the bottm of the sleeve. Now look at the top of sleeve and see if there is any small gaps between the piston and sleeve. I know there was batch of Novarossi and Mugen .12 engines with this issue a few years ago.
xray_guy is offline  
Old 02-17-2008 | 06:23 PM
  #22  
Taylorm's Avatar
Tech Master
 
Joined: Nov 2006
Posts: 1,659
From: Monclova, Ohio
Default

Originally Posted by TomB
dude man, pritty obvious, if it's this tight, put more headshims man
........so if he adds 1 inch of head shims the pinch will not be as tight?????????....the heads shims will only lower the compression slightly..........the pinch will still be there.........
Taylorm is offline  
Old 02-18-2008 | 12:16 AM
  #23  
V for Victory's Avatar
Tech Addict
 
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 644
From: South Pasadena CA.
Default

Originally Posted by joe_jenkins
such as my murnand modified 35 plus 31 that god broke in half at the block
OUCHHHHHHH!!!!!!! WHAT THE DAMN HAPPENED!?!? LOL
V for Victory is offline  
Old 02-26-2008 | 11:25 AM
  #24  
Riketsu's Avatar
Tech Elite
iTrader: (34)
 
Joined: Aug 2004
Posts: 2,605
From: Florida
Default

Originally Posted by V for Victory
OUCHHHHHHH!!!!!!! WHAT THE DAMN HAPPENED!?!? LOL
Look at it this way... he didnt have to disassemble the engine nor clutch to check for bearing smoothness... .

That must really hurt man, see an engine go out like that
Riketsu is offline  
Old 03-10-2008 | 10:45 AM
  #25  
rcfoolz's Avatar
Thread Starter
Tech Elite
iTrader: (22)
 
Joined: Sep 2003
Posts: 3,327
Default

Well, back to this subject. The piston/sleeve checked out for being round...no piston slap or nothing like that. Just very very tight. I'll try lapping it with something, but I'm more likely to sell the thing before I ever run it again. Just afraid to snap the rod in it.
rcfoolz is offline  
Old 03-10-2008 | 06:05 PM
  #26  
Tech Champion
iTrader: (10)
 
Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 5,120
From: www.moorebankraceway.com
Default

Originally Posted by rcfoolz
Well, back to this subject. The piston/sleeve checked out for being round...no piston slap or nothing like that. Just very very tight. I'll try lapping it with something, but I'm more likely to sell the thing before I ever run it again. Just afraid to snap the rod in it.
you should never lapp a piston and sleeve. when you do this, you remove the cross hatching on the sleeve,
and ruin the fit and finish, also the cross hatching asists in allowing to oil to have better surface tension and
do it's job. it it has no cross hatching, it will be too smooth and the fuel will not work/movearound/and stick
to the piston sleeve surfaces as intended.

TomB is offline  
Old 03-11-2008 | 09:54 PM
  #27  
Francis M.'s Avatar
Tech Elite
iTrader: (2)
 
Joined: Apr 2002
Posts: 4,738
From: Yorba Linda, CA
Default

Originally Posted by TomB
you should never lapp a piston and sleeve. when you do this, you remove the cross hatching on the sleeve,
and ruin the fit and finish, also the cross hatching asists in allowing to oil to have better surface tension and
do it's job. it it has no cross hatching, it will be too smooth and the fuel will not work/movearound/and stick
to the piston sleeve surfaces as intended.

I have seen people lap the piston leaving enough room for some break in. I've seen p/s sets that are so tight that it either ruined the rod or there was hardly any chrome left on top of the sleeve to create a good seal... You do need to measure before lapping and make sure you don't lap too far down the piston.
Francis M. is offline  
Old 03-11-2008 | 10:58 PM
  #28  
EdwardN's Avatar
Tech Elite
iTrader: (1)
 
Joined: May 2003
Posts: 2,168
From: SoCal
Default

May I say something about lapping?
There is nothing wrong to lap piston sleeve as long as you use right tool and after lapping your parts are still round within tolerances (+/_ .002 mm).
Cross hatching is result of surface finish after using honning procedure and it is not intended to be there, just pricing of mirror finish is way to high to have it.
The oil will stay on the wall of sleeve/piston anyway without using cross hatching-it is happened on molecular level of chemestry and has nothing to do with cross hatching. One of the reason why castor oil in use in fuel is that forces between moleculas in castor oil are so great and way better then any known lubricant (with tech specs we need for running our engines).
Edward
EdwardN is offline  
Old 03-18-2008 | 04:41 AM
  #29  
cdelong's Avatar
Tech Master
iTrader: (12)
 
Joined: Jul 2004
Posts: 1,805
From: The Sunshine State
Default

Edward lapped a few of my engines and made break in much easier. The cross hatching is normally gone by the end of break in anyways and does nothing for the engine from a mechanical standpoint.

On regular gas burning engines with piston rings, cross hatching from honing helps seat the rings, but has no advantage with a ringless piston.
cdelong is offline  

Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are Off



Contact Us - Archive - Advertising - Cookie Policy - Privacy Statement - Terms of Service -

Copyright © 2026 MH Sub I, LLC dba Internet Brands. All rights reserved. Use of this site indicates your consent to the Terms of Use.