News Flash Indoor tracks droppin' like flies
07-01-2007, 01:11 PM
#109
Every one keeps blaming the online shops but I don't think they are the problem. All these problems just seems to be with onroad sedan and just the atmosphere in Sedan racing especially at permanent tracks.
My suggestion Keep it simple and try to promote fun on a weekly basis vs treating club races like it is a National event.
For the people that have ran nitro offroad they can attest that it's not much cheaper but the people just know how to have more fun. JMHO.
My suggestion Keep it simple and try to promote fun on a weekly basis vs treating club races like it is a National event.
For the people that have ran nitro offroad they can attest that it's not much cheaper but the people just know how to have more fun. JMHO.
07-01-2007, 01:30 PM
#111
Why racing cant be what you make of it. If you want to be the most competitive person on the planet then that is what is fun for you. You can also be laid back and just have fun if thats what you want to do. The problem is no one wants to be in the D main. Having an ill handling slow car isn't fun either. Every beginner thinks they have to go out and buy the best equipment from the start. Before they can drive 2 laps without wrecking people have sponsorships and thousand dollar cars. There are many problems with every hobby, people will come and go but the best everyone can do is be nice to help out beginners. Don't turn people off when they are just starting, answer questions and be informative and make it sound fun when talking about it.
You cant blame it solely on online shops, many of them started as brick and mortar hobby shops and have expanded. Tower has been around since I picked up my first RC magazine. Shops need to realize that trying to make 10 dollar on every set of tires will not work anymore. Sell 20 sets of tires at a 5 dollar profit instead of 2 sets at a 10 dollar profit. Keep items in stock that are used on raceday and make them priced to sell. Every non sponsored person should want to buy that stuff at your track. Batteries, motors and tires, bodies, brushes, should all be priced slightly above online so it makes it worth it to buy those things there. Us racers consume tons of the aforementioned items. These items should always be in stock, I should not walk into the hobby shop and not be able to buy the tires that everyone runs. If this happens you will not make it in this business.
You cant blame it solely on online shops, many of them started as brick and mortar hobby shops and have expanded. Tower has been around since I picked up my first RC magazine. Shops need to realize that trying to make 10 dollar on every set of tires will not work anymore. Sell 20 sets of tires at a 5 dollar profit instead of 2 sets at a 10 dollar profit. Keep items in stock that are used on raceday and make them priced to sell. Every non sponsored person should want to buy that stuff at your track. Batteries, motors and tires, bodies, brushes, should all be priced slightly above online so it makes it worth it to buy those things there. Us racers consume tons of the aforementioned items. These items should always be in stock, I should not walk into the hobby shop and not be able to buy the tires that everyone runs. If this happens you will not make it in this business.
07-01-2007, 06:46 PM
#112
[QUOTE=billjacobs;3441871]Most tracks run on a shoestring budget anyway. Several hicups come along and they are gone. The shops that are hobby stores with other product lines are not susceptible to these hicups. These hobby stores are in retail locations and get exposure from the other product lines. Racing has rarely made money and I feel sorry financially for those who put in their time, effort and MONEY into tracks so that others can race for a few dollars. They subsidize racing for everyone else. WHY SHOULD THEY DO THIS?
It is time that tracks stop acting like charities and start acting like businesses. This means:
1) use handout motors for racing
2) use handout tires for racing
3) charge everyone for racing/practice. No one gets a freebie.
4) Raise the price to race to $20 and practice to $10, and make everyone pay it.
QUOTE]
I have been saying this for years, racing is actually cheap, you spend a whole day at a shop using up electricity, water, chair space, carpet, computer system and lighting, and all you pay is $12, thats crazy...for tracks to remain, pricing needs to be re-evaluated. If you race an entire day someplace, how can you not think $20-$35 is a fair price to pay.
It is time that tracks stop acting like charities and start acting like businesses. This means:
1) use handout motors for racing
2) use handout tires for racing
3) charge everyone for racing/practice. No one gets a freebie.
4) Raise the price to race to $20 and practice to $10, and make everyone pay it.
QUOTE]
I have been saying this for years, racing is actually cheap, you spend a whole day at a shop using up electricity, water, chair space, carpet, computer system and lighting, and all you pay is $12, thats crazy...for tracks to remain, pricing needs to be re-evaluated. If you race an entire day someplace, how can you not think $20-$35 is a fair price to pay.
07-01-2007, 08:08 PM
#114
Like forcing me to bump up to 19t for winning stock. Our rules locally are more run what you brung type. Maybe I should run mod but I like stock and how I can get by in a season on 1 set of tires, 1 motor, the same batteries, etc. . . I hate mod mainly because everything gets torn up and needs to be replaced often. I enjoy working on my cars, not having to buy new stuff every week and being able to race with my friends & buddies during race days. Besides guys that run stock with me are always asking questions in how to be more competitive, which not only elevates their game but mine as well.
First I'm not taking issue what you are pointing out here... but I do have something for you to think about....
The difference in lap time between stock to 19T is about .5 seconds, and 19T to Mod, is .5 seconds, so that is only a 1 second difference between stock on Mod. Not at the local level, but the difference is what it could be...
So 19T is not really that much harder on someone and the equipment... or... you have Stock as you know it as Pro stock, and start a econ class, stick batteries (3300), silver can motor, 32 tires.... for the new person... they could get in to R/C at a good price, and it is cheap to run, and they are learning about the setups.... then move up... My point, the top guys need to get out of Stock at the club level, they are killing the newbie... who the hell wants to go to a track and get their butt hand to them weekend after weekend.... very few people..... and low price class would help them have fun.... That is my point....
I do agree with you on the comments about the wear and tear that mod does... and I can understand you not wanting to run it... In fact in my area, mod is not a class that runs.... It is stock, stock or stock.... (Nitro also) But we need to break up the fast guys from the newbies... so 19T was one idea... but maybe go the other way... a slower stock for them....
07-01-2007, 09:13 PM
#116
...before we complained about 'ONLINE' stores killing R/C, it was the oldschool MAIL ORDER that was killing R/C...and that was 20+ years ago.
STORMER (My old favorite shop of the 90's) is still going strong...from MONTANA?
YOU KEEP UP - or GET LOST
There has been a LOT of HobbyShops open and close in the 22+ years I've been in R/C - and I haven't seen 2 of them give me a reason to BUY from them.
They(At least if they are business smart) KNOW what their competitors prices are..and THIS INCLUDES MAIL ORDER and ONLINE STORES.
If you give the right pricing - order quickly - get the stuff RIGHT when ordered..and have a fair and friendly staff... I see not why a LOCAL store can't compete... PROBLEM IS - too many STORES have TOO much Unwanted/Un-Needed CRAP in their stores that they get screwed with (Like old 3300, 3600, 3700, 3800 batteries....and LAST Weeks Chassis' and Tires and Motors...etc. WHO Buys this OLD CRAP to get it out of the stores...especially when the LHS still wants FULL RETAIL For this old obsolete CRAP?
STORMER (My old favorite shop of the 90's) is still going strong...from MONTANA?
YOU KEEP UP - or GET LOST
There has been a LOT of HobbyShops open and close in the 22+ years I've been in R/C - and I haven't seen 2 of them give me a reason to BUY from them.
They(At least if they are business smart) KNOW what their competitors prices are..and THIS INCLUDES MAIL ORDER and ONLINE STORES.
If you give the right pricing - order quickly - get the stuff RIGHT when ordered..and have a fair and friendly staff... I see not why a LOCAL store can't compete... PROBLEM IS - too many STORES have TOO much Unwanted/Un-Needed CRAP in their stores that they get screwed with (Like old 3300, 3600, 3700, 3800 batteries....and LAST Weeks Chassis' and Tires and Motors...etc. WHO Buys this OLD CRAP to get it out of the stores...especially when the LHS still wants FULL RETAIL For this old obsolete CRAP?
07-01-2007, 09:14 PM
#117
Bumping up does not mean you have to run a different motor it just means you cant exceed a motor. And that your skill level is higher. Or maybe its about the win.?
Bumping down means you have to change to a slower motor.
Bumping up means your good enough to do better for all above and below.
I say run brushless lipo and trade motor and battery cost for parts cost.
Go Fast And Try Not To Crash.!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Its the same thing we all do with a stock motor. Just easier to go faster.
Bumping down means you have to change to a slower motor.
Bumping up means your good enough to do better for all above and below.
I say run brushless lipo and trade motor and battery cost for parts cost.
Go Fast And Try Not To Crash.!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Its the same thing we all do with a stock motor. Just easier to go faster.
07-01-2007, 09:23 PM
#118
EA
07-01-2007, 09:30 PM
#119
Eric,
You da man~ I agree 100% about the LOCAL deal and lapping the field..etc... unfortuanately for SOME the LOCAL race IS the big deal race to them (which I way it's awesome when they can actually win - but conviencing a TOP level driver that's the best for R/C instead of what's best for HIM is a hard sell)
A little confidence goes a long with in this hobby - sometimes it may be a false confidence - but if a LOCAL guy beats the socalled "SPONSORED" driver - and acts like a JERK over it - you can bet...IT WON'T HAPPEN AGAIN!~
You da man~ I agree 100% about the LOCAL deal and lapping the field..etc... unfortuanately for SOME the LOCAL race IS the big deal race to them (which I way it's awesome when they can actually win - but conviencing a TOP level driver that's the best for R/C instead of what's best for HIM is a hard sell)
A little confidence goes a long with in this hobby - sometimes it may be a false confidence - but if a LOCAL guy beats the socalled "SPONSORED" driver - and acts like a JERK over it - you can bet...IT WON'T HAPPEN AGAIN!~
07-01-2007, 11:48 PM
#120
Let me apologize right now if this gets a little long-winded, and also let me apologize if this idea has been kicked around already...
I raced primarily at South Shore in Coram, NY. Over the years, I've noticed a trend happening there (I don't get around to a whole lot of tracks, so this situation might be unique here...
Years ago, you raced at the track, you bought stuff at the track on race day if you didn't have it with you, or you bought stuff at your local shop if you lived near one. THe last couple of years, it seems that many of the shops in the area surrounding South Shore Raceway (NYC Hobbies Ridgewood, Brooklyn Hobbies in Brooklyn, Fordham Hobbies in the Bronx, and a few others started sponsoring big teams of racers. I'm all fine with manufacturers sponsoring racers, but the stores sponsoring racers seemed to be taking a big bite out of sales at the track... how many people are going to buy at retail or near retail pricing at the track when they can get everything at cost or less from their sponsoring local shop? Ninety-nine percent of these shop-sponsored racers aren't pros, they're regular guys on a budget who happen to drive real well at the local level.
How can a track/store hope to stay afloat in that sort of environment? Then it occurred to me (while watching an old Honeymooners rerun, the one where Ralph says to Ed "you don't have enough money to get a new TV, and I don't have enough money to get a new TV, but if we put our money together we can get a GREAT TV") that none of these shops that are sponsoring racers are trying to support a track... and maybe none of them could on their own, given the current climate... but suppose a track opened without a store attached, which would be supported by ALL of the local stores working together? Every store that was part of the deal would be able to set up and do retail business at the track on race days, and any shortfalls that race fees and food concession stuff, etc. couldn't cover for the track would be assessed equally to all the shops participating...
It seems like it would be in these shops best interest to all pitch in on something along these lines, and while I won't be so naive as to say everyone will just get along wonderfully, I'd think that there'd be enough benefit to all to set fair priciing guidelines and some sort of way could be found for everyone to benefit.
Maybe I'm a little punchy given the late hour along with the prospect of no carpet racing this winter, but does anyone else think something like this could actually work? I really don't see how any one business can be profitable as a track/hobby shop in this area, but cooperatively, it just might be possible for ALL the shops to get together, overcome their competitive differences and make somoething like this work... or like I said, maybe I'm just talking crazy here... that old Honeymooners episode didn't work out very well for Ralph and Ed and their new TV after all...
I'm currently guessing I'll be making the 1.5 hour drive to Speedzone in Connecticut on Sundays this carpet season, but I'd very much prefer a track right here in the NYC area...
Feel free to discuss or bash away...
David F.
I raced primarily at South Shore in Coram, NY. Over the years, I've noticed a trend happening there (I don't get around to a whole lot of tracks, so this situation might be unique here...
Years ago, you raced at the track, you bought stuff at the track on race day if you didn't have it with you, or you bought stuff at your local shop if you lived near one. THe last couple of years, it seems that many of the shops in the area surrounding South Shore Raceway (NYC Hobbies Ridgewood, Brooklyn Hobbies in Brooklyn, Fordham Hobbies in the Bronx, and a few others started sponsoring big teams of racers. I'm all fine with manufacturers sponsoring racers, but the stores sponsoring racers seemed to be taking a big bite out of sales at the track... how many people are going to buy at retail or near retail pricing at the track when they can get everything at cost or less from their sponsoring local shop? Ninety-nine percent of these shop-sponsored racers aren't pros, they're regular guys on a budget who happen to drive real well at the local level.
How can a track/store hope to stay afloat in that sort of environment? Then it occurred to me (while watching an old Honeymooners rerun, the one where Ralph says to Ed "you don't have enough money to get a new TV, and I don't have enough money to get a new TV, but if we put our money together we can get a GREAT TV") that none of these shops that are sponsoring racers are trying to support a track... and maybe none of them could on their own, given the current climate... but suppose a track opened without a store attached, which would be supported by ALL of the local stores working together? Every store that was part of the deal would be able to set up and do retail business at the track on race days, and any shortfalls that race fees and food concession stuff, etc. couldn't cover for the track would be assessed equally to all the shops participating...
It seems like it would be in these shops best interest to all pitch in on something along these lines, and while I won't be so naive as to say everyone will just get along wonderfully, I'd think that there'd be enough benefit to all to set fair priciing guidelines and some sort of way could be found for everyone to benefit.
Maybe I'm a little punchy given the late hour along with the prospect of no carpet racing this winter, but does anyone else think something like this could actually work? I really don't see how any one business can be profitable as a track/hobby shop in this area, but cooperatively, it just might be possible for ALL the shops to get together, overcome their competitive differences and make somoething like this work... or like I said, maybe I'm just talking crazy here... that old Honeymooners episode didn't work out very well for Ralph and Ed and their new TV after all...
I'm currently guessing I'll be making the 1.5 hour drive to Speedzone in Connecticut on Sundays this carpet season, but I'd very much prefer a track right here in the NYC area...
Feel free to discuss or bash away...
David F.
