Originally Posted by
waitwhat
The thing is, in rc racing there are regulations set forth by the governing body. Some rules are put in place as cost control measures. If one company comes out with a system that is integrated, and that system works so much better, it creates a "must run this to win" situation. It would also force other manufacturers to try and do the same thing, thus ballooning the cost of being competitive. This already played out when one esc manufacturer (advanced electronics) had the only esc that could do a timing ramp. The esc was $600 and was a clear on track advantage. Funny thing happened. The first really big race where that esc was used was a week long race. By the time the qualifying started, Tekin had a free software release that did the exact same thing.
Shortly after that it became a two tier system of those who had an esc with timing advance and those who didn't. Other esc's with timing advance started to come out, but the added complexity of the timing adjustments made it even easier to screw up a setting and cause the magic smoke to come out of something. In the end they just said spec classes must run blinky.
The other pitfall if integration is when something fails. If your esc and receiver are one unit and the receiver part fails, you are now out an esc too.
Ultimately, it comes down to the fact that your track let's you run timing in your esc and active data acquisition. Both of these things would be against the rules at ROAR sanctioned events. I feel that it should be allowed to run the next highest wind motor with esc timing in blinky classes as the power levels work out to be close to the same, and you don't have to push the motor so hard like you do in a blinky class.
I think you feel the car is slower because it actually is. This means it is easier for you to make less driving errors, which results in an overall faster lap time for you. Spec racing is about carrying corner speed and slowing down as little as possible for the corners. If you over drive your car, more power will make you go slower, not faster. Put your 17.5 blinky setup back in and I bet you will go just as fast or faster. If so, the change in lap times is likely your improved driving ability.
I also suspect you race somewhere with very few entries in each class. This means there is a very high likelihood that nobody you race with is that close to the physical limit of what a 17.5 tc could actually do. Is there one guy that is a couple laps faster than everyone else? If so, those are the lap times you should be working towards. Have you ever been to a race with 50+ people in one class? There you would find about 5 people who can drive at the limit. In that case, having a car with 2-3% more power only means something if you can get everything out of your car. 95% of 100 is still faster than 85% of 103.
It's great that you get enjoyment out of the development side of the hobby, but for the vast majority of people, that is just not what they enjoy. Our hobby is dying out because it is difficult, and too many people want it to be easy. An integrated system is good for decreasing complexity, but it also becomes a limiting factor. What if someone running the Sanwa esc/receiver wants to run 1/8th scale stuff too? Now because Sanwa doesn't make an 1/8th scale esc they have to buy a normal receiver and esc. What if that new esc has features that the Sanwa combo doesn't. Now that person may be compelled to try a different esc from their integrated combo, which means taking a step backwards in terms of integration.
I appreciate you sir. Very good information. The integrated system has whole host of benefits and drawbacks. The best integrated systems come after the initial battle. If sanctioning bodies are selective in the limits the impose...realistic improvements will happen. The boutiques that know one part of the system extremely well release much better products after the initial onslaught of mildly exciting integrated systems. There are business casualties before the stability though.
we get 5 or 10 guys per class if we are lucky. I have to run Blinky too. The point in the dynamic boost is to develop the math for the thermals and it also generates a profile to pick a Blinky timing value that both I and the car are comfortable with. The 21.5 dynamic or 17.5 Blinky fits with my car/track and current capability. I agree with you on the motor comparison. My 21.5 running dynamic is fast and comfortable with fixed timing 17.5s but a bunch of people running around trying to understand dynamic timing probably wont take. However i could program a routine that would teach the esc everything it needs to know to setup aggressive or conservative parameters automatically after a couple laps but its not really necessary. im at my limit with a 17.5 Blinky or 21.5 dynamic. They feel really similar. The 21.5 is just a little less responsive so it forces me to use allot more electronic features.
i ran laps with the dynamic 17.5 very close (not better) to the dynamic 21.5 but it was allot more work and thought (today). If you look at the 17.5 curve it has some minor artifacts but massive power difference. The efficiency curve had a huge self induced artifact that we suspected may unsettle thing it was minor. I’ll force myself to drive the power curve for practice because i have no choice but to be completely focused and it will improve my skills and setup. But the efficiency curve was allot easier to drive. Its still a handful compared to a 17.5 Blinky. In either case i couldnt predict corrections because it all happened way to fast if i drifted a hair out of my groove. These are the same observations i made when i first started and then they faded away. Im hoping i can rinse and repeat.
there are a couple guys that are 1 or 2 seconds a lap faster than everyone and they drive completely different than me or anyone else. I drive a smooth balanced car. One of these guys is on and off throttle like a computer. The front of the car completely understeers on the brakes and then Wildly oversteers on throttle. He steers digitally always neutral or at the extreme. It seems like all of his steering comes from his throttle.
i have fun with the mortals in Blinky and but make no mistake. im focused on learning to beat the immortal. im taking the driving skills and setup path while investigating some things that are simple for me.
I didnt change the FDR on my first Frey into 17.5 dynamic land today. In Blinky that means I can run 40 laps as hard as i can at 70c on the motor. I triggered dynamic which took allot more concentration to get similar laps but the motor came off at 40c. It had too much torque and too much top end. If i didnt view it as a challenge it would be easy to say it was too much motor. i had to set my punch to 10% of what i normally use or it would loop. I’ll check the diff and balance. It will force me Practice and tweak better and my hopes are the 2 efforts will converge at some point. 21.5 Blinky gets boring but forces me to refine my lines. maybe 17.5 Blinky will get boring. At one point 21.5 Blinky was allot of work.
dynamic timing is like racing a class higher and pushes my comfort. I dont hit things anymore. Im cheap and that is why buying an expensive car forced me to drive reasonably. I know how unreasonable that might sound but a little self coercion never hurt anyone. Everyone talks of the delicate awesomatix. i never broke a single part.