Just wondering,you guys running the shorty packs in 17.5 class. Do you leave the weights in the rear? I run full packs now and I have ballast weight and 1/4 oz each rear triangle. I have tried removing the weights and the car just loses alot of traction. So I guess what I'm trying to say is the whole point of running the shorty is to reduce weight and improve handling right? So to me it wouldn't make sense to run the shorty without weights. As far as handling with the shorties,I don't think I can get my buggy to handle any better than it is now its awesome. Guess I should maybe try and borrow one and try for myself.