happywing

iTrader: (93)

Nice thread. The forums are supposed to be about helping people out. It's not a challenge to see who is the smartest...or thinks they're the smartest. It's not about boasting about your great purchase or cutting someone else down for a bad choice. IT'S ABOUT HELPING EACH OTHER!

Scenario:
Guy A: "I bought a Novak and it doesn't work right."
Guy B: " Novak sucks, that's why. My ESC-X is better"

Guy B was very helpful, wasn't he? I see a lot of that here. What's the point? Look, the guy is having an unusual problem. Others are having the same problem. There may be something useful to discover here. This could be a very informational thread. Instead, it's a pissing match.

plummers

hi the club i race at bought 15 novak bl systems and sold them all. last week one went pop as you describe.driver moved front wheels with battery connected but turned off. would the advice be DONT turn the steering while the battery is connected at least until novak come up with something or at least admit theres a problem?? i think its only a matter of time before they are forced to do something.im sorry to here of all your problems with something that is supposed to be maintanance free not bloody hard work and worry. its a pain in the arse here in the uk as it takes ages for the importer to help!! plummers

Turbo Joe

iTrader: (41)

I have a bunch of them to "test" and I'd be happy to run any other reasonable trials you're not able to do with your super-bitchin' generic servo. The only thing I don't have here are off-brand servos.

I have 2 SS GTBs, 2 standard (one Lipo version), plenty of lipos, plenty of Spektrum receivers and I'm not the least bit afraid of blowing any of it up. I tried your experiment on my GTX as well...no smoke there, either.

Like I said up front...short circuit. Reversed polarity will do it like you described...but I'm sure that could never happen to YOU. You're much to smart to ever have that happen...me OTOH...LOL

blackbird

Hi Joe,
could you clarify what short circuit (short circuit on the servo or on the esc?) as has been explained in several posts on here the servos in question have been tried elsewhere and worked ok.

Also reverse polarity of what? servo control? or esc?

JimmyMac

iTrader: (2)

Hey TeQ, what were your speed controller settings? Was it in Lipo cutoff mode? Just curious. I never run mine in lipo mode. Also, I've never heard of your servo before (DS1015). So I looked it up. It's from Thunder Tiger. Made for 1/8 scale buggies. Draws more power from your battery pack because of the high torque. Well I'm sure Novak will figure it out.

TeQ

Jim,

The first GTB I popped it was on Lipo Cutoff, but the battery was fully charged regardless. The second time, it was just the stock settings.

The DS1015 is the same servo that all the Team drivers for Associated run in their B44's. It's made by ACE/Thunder Tiger. This is what I wanted to run in my B44, so I got it. To call it off brand or cheap is pretty silly, perhaps just ignorant.

Peace!

Alltapdout

iTrader: (2)

I tried this to my GTB system last night, luckally nothing released on me. You said that your running your servo in another vehicle now? What kinda system is that running on? There are no problems there huh? Do you know if the ESC would have popped if you didn't have a battery pluged in?

N E reply from novak on this one yet?

TeQ

It's sitting in an 8ight at the moment.

In regards to servo shorting, I've done that before and it pops the RX first. Why would a short servo effect an ESC that is turned off?

You didn't mention if your GTB was SS or not. Please let me know. Thanks

Nothing from Novak yet. I'm going to give them a call and see what they think.

Alltapdout

iTrader: (2)

See thats what I was thinking. Why would the ESC pop, when its hooked through the receiver first. Plus the RX shouldn't have power on it either.
Weird
Good luck.

Turbo Joe

iTrader: (41)

Reverse the battery leads...it's pretty easy to do when you have 4800 and 3200 batteries. The Orions have a fuse link that burns off when you do it, but not before it blows up the ESC. It will for sure let the smoke out on an XBR or GTX and probably on a GTB (haven't done it yet. LOL A regular lipo or NiMh doesn't have a fuse, so it's a pretty safe bet that the ESC is going to lose.

Basically, FETs (transistors) act like diodes. When the ESC gets reversed polarity, they have nearly zero resistance going the opposite way. It basically blows the FETs off the board.

I think he has something acting like a short in the servo...maybe shorting across the BEC or signal wires It has a BEC that supplies 5 amps...so I really don't think it's likely that running a tiny little motor in reverse at a pretty low RPM could possibly generate enough current to damage the board. It's never going to make even a small fraction of the same current that it takes to make the same motor move (maybe 1 amp) as a motor. A electric motor *is* a generator, but not a very good one.

Andy Haynes

I am curious to see if possibly they have a faulty circuit in the off switch of the speedo. I don't see why it would matter a bit if you turn the wheels with the speedo off and how that would be caused by the servo.

Turbo Joe

iTrader: (41)

Dude...LOL...again...they make the torque with GEARS. They gear the servo lower.

Turbo Joe

iTrader: (41)

The RX power terminals (black and red) are just a straight through connection. All the terminals on the outside are common to each other and all the terminals in the middle are common. Only the inner terminals are separate. Essentially, the servo is powered directly from the ESC...the RX isn't really part of the power circuit, aside from functioning like a piece of wire.

If there was a large enough surge coming from the "wonder servo", it would go through the RX to the ESC...and probably burn the terminals and/or connectors along the way...but it who knows...LOL

I really wish I could see your ESC...it's pretty easy to tell what happened by where it burned. If the FETs are blown, you hooked it up backwards or had a motor problem. If it's the BEC that's burned up, then it's a servo/RX problem.

FYI -- I have a very early SS GTB (first batch or two, I had a pre-order) as well as a pretty recent one. I did the experiment on the early one...I can try it on the later one.

Look...I'm not saying that you can't blow up a GTB or any other speed control. I'm just saying that it's silly to think that passively turning a servo motor can generate enough current to do it. There would be thousands and thousands of blown ESCs if that was the case...people do it all the time as a matter of normal routine behavior.

They're very complicated little devices that get abused...sometimes they fail...sometimes it's a defect...a product defect...or a customer defect...or a servo defect...but there isn't any magical super-efficient servo motor technology coming out of Thunder Tiger...or they would be making magical hybrid 1:1 cars with them.

And TT/ACE *is* Taiwan knock-off stuff. Sometimes you can get decent knock-off parts, but it's still knock-off any way you cut it. It's like a "Cucci" bag or a "Folex". They copy someone else's stuff and hopefully get it right. Sometimes they do, sometimes they don't. If you're happy...good for you..you saved $10. Just don't go waving your "Folex" around like it's something super cool.

Scott Fisher

iTrader: (28)

Joe:

You are somewhat ignorant in the finality of your posts.

1st: The Ace servos are good servos. Just because they are made in Taiwan doesn't mean they are off-brand. Every brand has to start somewhere and it turns out these servos are pretty darn good.

2nd: I agree that gears make torque. That is taking the assumption you are using the same motor. If you think that every servo uses the same motor you are wrong. Different magnets, different winding count, different gauge of wire on the armature, brush material, etc, etc.. all will make a difference in the perfomance of any motor or servo. Obviously these things will also change the electrical usage of the motor. I really did need to point all this out as you already knew all this, but had just forgotten it when writing your condescending post..... None of this dismisses the possibility that some of these people may have faulty equipment, but the evidence is mounting that there might be an issue with the design of the speedo.

To everyone else... it is rough being the only person who truly knows everything.... a burden, but I am holding up well.

Turbo Joe

iTrader: (41)

Everyone has their cross to bear.

I know that there are people out there that use Ace servos...and I know that there are other name-brand servos made there. There's just nothing special about them and nothing that makes them magically super-efficient enough to blow up a speed control. Motors just don't work that way, even if they are in an uber-cool Ace servo.

On the motor thing...if you really think they have different motors in each servo...then how would you explain the fact that when you looks at the specs for servos in the same family (say 359/360 Airtronics)...one gets more torque and slower, while the other gets more speed and loses torque?

If they really had a faster motor for this one and a slower/toque-biased one for that one...why would it be slower? If you think that each one has been uniquely designed...you haven't been around much manufacturing...LOL Lesse...the torque one would need this controller...the speed one..that...different motors...more different components...or just do it with gears and call it good.

Two guys who blew up GTBs is not "mounting evidence". I ate Doritos once and then I got a bad flu...and threw them up. If that ever happened to anyone else, there would then be "mounting evidence" that Doritos cause the flu and nausea.


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Correla...mply_causation

Didn't eat Doritos for a long time after that...but they didn't really make me sick.

Again...I'm ready and willing to try out any other reasonable theories you guys can think up.