Shaner74

iTrader: (1)

Just trying to brainstorm for ideas.
Do you think this is doable?
Would this grow the hobby?
Would you race a class like this?
Make it a payout class?



The purpose of the class:
1. Grow the hobby
2. Lower cost of racing (put an enforcable spend cap on a class)
3. Easy access for beginners to race
4. Put low cost quality race vehicles on the shelves of hobby shops
5. Create a level playing field
6. Create a profit point for hobby shops
7. Entice manufactures to eventually design and build for the class

Rules:
1. All podium vehicles are impounded and put on consignment (silent auction*) in the hobby shop for a predefined amount ($350+) after the completion of race. Vehicles will be available for sale for 5 days. If not sold returned to owner.
2. Race vehicles must be available in a RTR form and be priced under the predetermined dollar amount ($350 in this example).
3.









*anything over base price goes to a prize fund or hobby shop


I've spent enough time at our local hobby shop track to see numerous potential future racers get sticker shock at the price of entry into a race worthy ride.
Any recommendations?

loaba

iTrader: (1)

I would never race for pinks, but I could perhaps be interested in a genuine, 100%, box-stock race series.

You buy a box from your LHS that contains the car, motor/ESC, servo, battery and track-specific rubber. The only thing you can change is NOTHING. Transmitter and transponder are provided by the racer, but If you want to go for total control, I guess you could specify that stuff too.

Something like this would have to be run as a kind of Club Points Series and there would need to be prizes at the end etc.

Now, I'm given to understand that this is not a new concept and that generally speaking, people chafe at the inability to customize and modify their cars. So I really don't see something like this happening where I race, just thought I'd throw it out there for you.

Billy Kelly

iTrader: (8)

If you want a simple basic cheap starter class. Go with 1/18 brushed Dromida vehicles. Around $100. Box stock.

The idea of having to sell a car after a race will never fly in this hobby. Forget trying to get brands involved. I would not be surprised to see more dropping their pro teams in the future.

Shaner74

iTrader: (1)

A box stock or close to box stock class is the basis for the class.
Lets say a decision has been made to set the buy out at $350. You can run any RTR that is readily available. You could in theory make money if you are running a vehicle that you have less than $350 invested. The buy out part of the class is to keep it honest.

For example Amain has a Serpant Spyder SRX-2 for sale for $330. You race it box stock and win. Your rival thinks you have spent big money making faster so he decides to buy it out. Now you turn around and buy a new Serpant Spyder for $330 to race next week. You just made $20 on top of winning.

Now next week a guy shows up with a really fast Serpant Spyder. He has spent $100 on a new faster motor. He wins and his car is put up for sale. You decide to buy it out for $350. You now have a Serpant Spyder ($330) + New faster motor ($100) worth $430. He loses $80 and you come out $80 ahead.

This is just a basic example. The idea is just to put an enforceable spending cap on the class. If you decide winning is more important than money than so be it. The reason for impounding and a silent auction style sale is to avoid conflict. It also would be a clear way to get someone new into a race proven vehicle while at the same time financing the replacement car.

It would also allow for multiple brands and models to compete in a class together. In theory a best bang for the buck combo of car would eventually emerge. If you could get this type of spending cap racing to be readily adopted by racers and tracks, the manufactures might take note and hopefully begin to design for it.

It's just a thought and I don't really expect this to happen. But maybe just maybe it might be the foundation for a style of racing that is fun, fair, cheap, and welcoming to people who would never spend $1000+ to race RC cars.

I would love to hear some other ideas that would have the same result of a fun, fair, cheap, and easy way to race.

roadrashracing

iTrader: (76)

I would never do something like this, so you buy a vehicle and it cost $350 and it sells for $275, that racer would have to rebuy the kit at full price again?

Shaner74

iTrader: (1)

No. The other way around. Buy out is $350. You get $350 exactly. No more no less. If for some reason it sells for more the difference could go towards a prize fund, pizza next week in the pits, or hobby shop. You would only participate in the class if you are willing to sell your car for the buyout number. Basically don't bring a $1000 car into that race. Bring a competitive car that you have less than $350 invested. This keeps the spending cap honest and enforceable.

Ideally no cars ever change hands. It is just a way to keep people honest and under the spending cap.

gigaplex

iTrader: (2)

Why would people even be allowed to run aftermarket motors etc in a box-stock RTR class? I don't see how someone would bring a $1000 car and still pass tech.

Speed Chaser

iTrader: (4)

I dont think i could ever race in this style i get attached to my rc cars

Shaner74

iTrader: (1)

I've been in RC since 85 and one thing you can count on in a spec class is people trying to game the system.
So this would not be not a box stock class because that is near impossible to enforce. I'm only trying to figure out a class with a way to incentivize leaving a car as close to box stock (spending wise) as possible and keep costs down. So the only rule is a forced buyout/sellout at a set price. There is no tech and if you wanted to bring a $1000 car (bad idea) you could, but you would literally be throwing away the $650 (in a $350 class) because you can be assured I or someone else would snatch that up.
The whole point of the class is to race a car that cost less than the buyout/sellout.

Shaner74

iTrader: (1)

This i understand because I do also. But if you keep the cars value under the buyout/ sellout you should be able to retain your car indefinitely. But if someone decides they want it they can over spend to have it and you can just replace it with a brand new one.

Shaner74

iTrader: (1)

Also for me part of that attachment stems from the fact I've spent countless hours (and $s) building and tunning on them. This is the reason behind the RTR recommendation. It would not be right to spend 5+ hours building a car to then have it sold out from under you. So only bring easily replaceable RTR's to the race. If it could catch on manufacturers might start selling quality, competitive, and inexpensive race worthy RTRs.

Think back to when the slash first came out. I've never before seen a more readily adopted class. It brought more new people to the track and hobby than any other car. It even made many veteran RC racers do the unthinkable and buy a RTR to race in a just for fun class. What if we could create a class like the old slash spec class, but eliminate the spec part (replaced with $ cap) and have manufactures competing for our business and dollars. The end result just might be an influx of new sub $350 RTRs that are of high quality.

The slash did just that. Manufacturers took note of the success of the slash and began selling quality race ready RTRs. For example the losi SCTE TEN RTR. That RTR was actually the gateway vehicle for me to return to racing after a 7yr break. Just recently I bought a b6 Club Racer that did the same thing, brought me back to racing after a break of a few years. Only problem with the Club Racer is that I was/am competing against $1000+ cars, and I now have a substantial amount of money invested in what is now a full on race proven b6d. I'm not complaining about this as I can afford to play and willingly look for ways to go faster regardless of cost. I'm an RC addict.

What we need is more gateway RTRs in the market!

Shaner74

iTrader: (1)

Think of it like this. You have a class that has a low cost of entry. A newbie comes into the hobby shop on race day and sees 10 guys on the drivers stand having a blast racing. His interest has been peaked. He then starts asking about the cars and racing. He's either told that those cars are all under $350 and come ready to race out of the box, or he's told those cars are all $1000+ and will require you to spend 5+ hrs to build if you can even build one. Which scenario is more likely to result in a sale and thus grow the hobby?

darksiede

iTrader: (2)

Already been said but- Dromida box stock class

When our oval season starts up we are kicking one or 2 classes of this off:
Brushed and brushless.. Brushed can be had new for $75 at the LHS and Brushless under $150 RTR..

Also going to require dromida lipo's just for keeping it in spec..

roadrashracing

iTrader: (76)

Here is something you might want to look at, engine claim instead, I've seen a few tracks do this with some pretty good rules, this might be a better choice vs losing your ride. People still put time in to setup etc, new people need to know that in the end it comes down to driving.

All classes must use a 6 cell NIMH or 2 cell Lipo battery. Lipo batteries must have a hard case and be ROAR approved.
Street Stock
 Any 10th scale buggy chassis – front & rear arms must be equal length on both sides of vehicle. Mid motor or rear motor configuration allowed if offered by manufacturer.
 Buggy wheels & tires – 2WD front tires and wheels only for front
 2WD transmission only - must be from same manufacturer as chassis
 ROAR approved 21.5 brushless motor
 ROAR approved ESC in zero timing (blinky) mode
 Full fendered street stock bodies designed for buggy chassis. No modifications to body. No additional spoilers. No openings or holes other than those needed for mounting body and wheel well opening.
 Maximum width – 10.25”
 Maximum wheelbase – 11.5”
360 Sprint
 DODC rules for chassis, wheels, tires, etc
 ROAR approved 13.5T motors with maximum 12.5mm diameter; 2 pole rotor.
 Motors will be inspected for resistance. Minimum allowable resistance at 77 deg will be 25 milliohms. Temperature adjusted reading on the track milliohm meter is final.
 ROAR approved ESC in zero timing (blinky) mode
410 Sprint
 DODC rules for chassis, wheels, tires, etc
 ROAR approved 540 sized motors of any wind
Late Model
 DODC rules for chassis, wheels, tires, etc
 ROAR approved 10.5T motors with maximum 12.5mm diameter; 2 pole rotor
 Motors will be inspected for resistance. Minimum allowable resistance at 77 deg will be 15.5 milliohms. Temperature adjusted reading on the track milliohm meter is final.
 ROAR approved ESC in zero timing (blinky) mode.
Fastlane Raceway
2015 Dirt Oval Class Rules
Open SC Modified
 Any 2wd short course truck chassis. Must be original manufacturer SC chassis; no aftermarket, special designed oval type chassis allowed. Motor may be mid or rear engine only as provided by original manufacturer. Battery must be mounted down the center of the chassis. Electronics can be mounted anywhere within main chassis plate.
 Wheel base: 12.75”-13.5” Maximum Width: 11.75”
 After market shocks & springs allowed
 Only Short Course Wheels and Short Course Rubber tires will be allowed.
 Only 540 motors are allowed. Any wind Brushless Motor is allowed.
 Any ESC is allowed in any mode.
 BODY:
 Must look like USMTS, UMP, or IMCA dirt modified
 Must cover rear wheels but must expose the entire tire when viewed from the side
 Front wheels must remain open
 Rear spoiler allowed, not to exceed 1.5" off of deck
 End caps allowed (max 1.5”x3.0”), may run center support brace
 No other side dams or down force device allowed
 Max body dimensions: width 13”, height 8”
 Max overall length of body including spoiler 26 1/2”
 Rear bumpers are required. A front bumper is highly recommended. If no bumper is used, then the front nose must not be a sharp or pointy object and must be able to absorb contact
Slash Spec Modified
 2WD stock chassis only (no LCG chassis). No modifications to chassis allowed. All parts must be run in the stock location and orientation unless otherwise noted.
 Traxxas aluminum and RPM caster blocks, steering bell cranks, steering blocks, camber links, and rear axle carriers are allowed. RPM suspension arms, bumpers and shock towers are also allowed.
 Front bumper is optional but rear bumper (Traxxas or RPM) is required.
 Stock radio equipment and servo (along with servo saver) may be replaced.
 Body mounts may be modified as needed to fit modified style bodies.
 No locked or modified differentials allowed. No ball differentials. Must have normal differential action; motor must not turn when rotating one rear tire with both tires off the ground.
 Stock plastic shock bodies must be used. Any weight oil allowed. Aluminum shock caps allowed. Optional Traxxas TiN shafts allowed. Any Traxxas white progressive spring allowed but springs may not be altered or cut in any way. No sway bars. 2 stage pistons or any modification to separately tune compression and rebound not allowed.
 Any added weight must be placed within the main chassis plate area.
Fastlane Raceway
2015 Dirt Oval Class Rules
Slash Spec Modified (Cont’d)
 ESC, transponder and receiver may be mounted anywhere within main chassis area.
 12T Titan stock motor only with stock XL-5 ESC. No modifications allowed to the motor. Stock bullet connectors must be used between ESC and motor and may not be soldered.
 MOTOR CLAIM RULE: Any racer who makes the A Main on a given night may claim the motor of any other A Main competitor for a claim fee of $25 plus the motor used in the A Main by the racer making the claim. Claims must be made within 10 minutes of the end of the A Main. No racer may make a motor claim more than once during a points series. Any competitor who refuses to have his motor claimed will be banned from further competition in the Stock Slash class for the 2015 season.
 Battery must be mounted in center tray location within the stock boundaries. Traxxas connector between battery and ESC may be replaced with other style connectors but a connector must be used.
 Any 2.2/3.0 short course wheel that fits the Traxxas 12mm hex will be allowed. Each wheel may have two vent holes no larger than .350”. Additional lightening of the wheel will not be allowed. Must use same offset wheel on each side.
 Stock Traxxas Slash tires and compounds only. Choice of: Slash Spec, Kumho Venture, and BF Goodrich treads. S1 compound tires for any of the treads will not be allowed. Tires must have a minimum tread depth of .065" for all three tread styles.
 Grinding, cutting, or altering the inside of the tire in any way will not be allowed. No extra grooving, splicing, or siping of the outside tread of the tire. Gluing or taping the outside of the tire to help prevent traction rolling will be allowed.
 Must use the stock foam insert provided with tire. Altering the insert will not be permitted. One foam insert per tire only.
 BODY:
 Must look like USMTS, UMP, or IMCA dirt modified
 Must cover rear wheels but must expose the entire tire when viewed from the side
 Front wheels must remain exposed
 Rear spoiler allowed, not to exceed 1.5" off of deck
 End caps allowed (max 1.5”x3.0”), may run center support brace
 No other side dams or down force device allowed
 Center deck must be same width front to rear.
 Max body dimensions: width 13”, height 8”
 Max overall length of body including spoiler 26 1/2”
 Rear bumpers are required. A front bumper is highly recommended. If no bumper is used, then the front nose must not be a sharp or pointy object and must be able to absorb contact.

Shaner74

iTrader: (1)

This is where the idea comes from. It would just be a more simple rule set. Allow a run what you brung type race but you better not spend more than $350 on that ride.

I also understand the biggest hurdle is the losing your ride part. But if you are running a box stock ride and keeping good setup sheets it is not difficult to turn a few turnbuckles and maybe even rebuild a few shocks on a brand new replacement. The whole point is keeping cost low and putting new racers on the track. This is a price I would gladly pay to see a drivers stand full of newbies driving my old rides. And if they catch the RC bug they will eventually move up to higher classes and be spending the money to compete at a higher level.


It might even be fun for experienced racers to take a car that is way below the cost cap and see how they can do.