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Tamiya Championship Series

Old 10-17-2010, 04:00 PM
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Originally Posted by Tom Slick
Tamiya is a business. They are in business to sell product, not to please a bunch of inveterate hobbyists by creating a series to allow 15-year old product to remain competetive with the latest. Note that they are releasing a new TRF all-mod-cons sedan chassis, the 417, and a TA05IFSV2-R (That's a mouthful), and an M06 rear-drive Mini. And a F104W, which might actually work better than the F104 on foams.
So they are trying to sell product. The classes for the next TCS series have been chosen to...sell product.
And you, a veteran racer/producer of motors for sale, are saying you don't understand? I gotta admit, Doc, I'm surprised.
Tom,
I couldn't have said it any better, but you have a case of mistaken identity. Doc Mertes didn't make that post.
On another note. If anyone truly believes that TCS will fade away because they don't race it, they need to get over themselves. Sure Tamiya wants people to come to the races, that's why they hold them, but if you think that Tamiya is gonna rewrite all the rules because one or two guys threaten not to show, thats a pretty big ego at work.
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Old 10-17-2010, 05:28 PM
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Like Brad says, Tom, that wasn't my post. Frankly, I've been laying off posting anything on this topic because I've been trying to figure out the reasoning behind Tamiya's move.

I like the idea behind the rules, but am surprised that Tamiya didn't come out with what appears to be the current 'standard' BL motor setup: 21.5, 17.5 and 13.5. That's what people are racing all over the USA, and although I'm not really plugged into the overseas BL scene, from what I've heard it's pretty much the same on the other side of the water in both directions. So, while I can understand mandating use of their product now that they have it to sell (and I think that's a SMART biz move), I'm a little perplexicated as to why they didn't align themselves with the rest of the racing community.

Heck, I'm surprised that they didn't take the opportunity to come out with some super-whiz-bang great BL ESC that simply can't be tweaked but runs better than everything else out there for the locked-down spec type BL classes that are becoming so popular. Then they would sell stuff to the non-Tamiya crowd. Imagine that.

I'm not concerned about the silver can stuff- heck, my US business is a fraction of what we sell to the rest of the world, and more and more US race directors are buying matched 15K's from us for their local series- but I'm not sure that Tamiya hasn't missed an opportunity here.
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Old 10-17-2010, 05:43 PM
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I don't ever think Tamiya is a follower, they have always done there own thing and that is what makes them Tamiya. They innovate things not imitate. We might not always understand that philosophy and might not always be successful. But over all I believe they are doing pretty well than most. I can't wait to have a Tamiya branded brushless esc and motor. That is always bling bling in my book.
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Old 10-17-2010, 05:46 PM
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Originally Posted by Tom Slick
Tamiya is a business. They are in business to sell product, not to please a bunch of inveterate hobbyists by creating a series to allow 15-year old product to remain competetive with the latest. Note that they are releasing a new TRF all-mod-cons sedan chassis, the 417, and a TA05IFSV2-R (That's a mouthful), and an M06 rear-drive Mini. And a F104W, which might actually work better than the F104 on foams.
So they are trying to sell product. The classes for the next TCS series have been chosen to...sell product.
And you, a veteran racer/producer of motors for sale, are saying you don't understand? I gotta admit, Doc, I'm surprised.
Hey Doc, Just hit them in the head with a Hand Tuned RedDot Brushless Motor and Keep it moving.

Last edited by T.MARSHALL; 10-17-2010 at 05:58 PM.
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Old 10-17-2010, 06:41 PM
  #14480  
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Originally Posted by rccardr
Like Brad says, Tom, that wasn't my post. Frankly, I've been laying off posting anything on this topic because I've been trying to figure out the reasoning behind Tamiya's move.

I like the idea behind the rules, but am surprised that Tamiya didn't come out with what appears to be the current 'standard' BL motor setup: 21.5, 17.5 and 13.5. That's what people are racing all over the USA, and although I'm not really plugged into the overseas BL scene, from what I've heard it's pretty much the same on the other side of the water in both directions. So, while I can understand mandating use of their product now that they have it to sell (and I think that's a SMART biz move), I'm a little perplexicated as to why they didn't align themselves with the rest of the racing community.

Heck, I'm surprised that they didn't take the opportunity to come out with some super-whiz-bang great BL ESC that simply can't be tweaked but runs better than everything else out there for the locked-down spec type BL classes that are becoming so popular. Then they would sell stuff to the non-Tamiya crowd. Imagine that.

I'm not concerned about the silver can stuff- heck, my US business is a fraction of what we sell to the rest of the world, and more and more US race directors are buying matched 15K's from us for their local series- but I'm not sure that Tamiya hasn't missed an opportunity here.
It has to do with the mentality or mind set. You know, the inscrutable Oriental mind. That may not be PC, so if not, my apologies. I grew up in the days of the Charlie Chan movies and loved them in spite of the what now would be racial stereotypes. I do believe they predate even you, Doc.
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Old 10-17-2010, 07:04 PM
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If the Tamiya ESC is does not have timing advance, it will work fine for a number of other classes (ROAR 17.5 sportsman, USVTA, etc). Now you may be stuck with a weirdo 16t motor or whatever, but that's not bad since they are committing to a minimum 2 year life.

Just wish F1 was BL as well...why not?????
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Old 10-17-2010, 07:12 PM
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Tom Slick - Many of the "inveterate"hobbyists you refer to have been buying Tamiya products for years and have supported the TCS. I understand that Tamiya wants to use this series to promote and sell products. But, I don't see how these rules accomplish that goal with the motors that they offer. I don't see how wiping out your third most popular class does that. As a world wide company I'm sure there are reasons I don't understand. But, one of the bests ways to promote your product is by word of mouth. So the more people who participate the more they promote. In the Midwest 20 years ago every hobby shop carried lots of Tamiya products and parts. The opposite is the case now. I hope the TCS continues to grow, but I'm not sure this accomplishes that goal.
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Old 10-17-2010, 08:08 PM
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Thumbs up BL Ruling..

Only way to make sure no funny business is happening in the brushless world is to eliminate 'options'.

Everyone knows there are 'spec' brushless motor systems and/or brushless systems with a 'spec' setting.. Question is, when you look at all the 'spec' settings (software) for each different model/manufacturer, do they all have identical 'spec' software/code.. I highly doubt it, however small the difference. This variation starts the search for the speedo with that lil bit better feel, punch, top end, grunt, brakes.. Whatever..
Plus, there are some racers that buy equipment from 'factory drivers'.. On occasion, factory drivers get special equipment. Therefore it is possible that special equipment can make a showing in a 'spec' race. Not pointing fingers in particular, but I know it's possible.

Answer to these few problems?? One make, one model.. Thanks Tamiya. . Bringin spec back to spec racing.. Buy now or buy later, come Nats-time we will all have the same 'fast' system... what's so bad about that?



Answer to the problem??? i think it is.. i like it!!

Last edited by OSherman; 10-17-2010 at 11:55 PM.
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Old 10-17-2010, 08:11 PM
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Originally Posted by Granpa
It has to do with the mentality or mind set. You know, the inscrutable Oriental mind. That may not be PC, so if not, my apologies. I grew up in the days of the Charlie Chan movies and loved them in spite of the what now would be racial stereotypes. I do believe they predate even you, Doc.
Asian granpa, asian oriental is for rugs
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Old 10-17-2010, 08:16 PM
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Originally Posted by robk
If the Tamiya ESC is does not have timing advance, it will work fine for a number of other classes (ROAR 17.5 sportsman, USVTA, etc). Now you may be stuck with a weirdo 16t motor or whatever, but that's not bad since they are committing to a minimum 2 year life.

Just wish F1 was BL as well...why not?????
And who's to say that it will only last 2 years?
If this all works well, why would they mess with it?
Look at how long we have been using silvercans
This could be the new silvercan racing
Now if Tamiya would just finish developing the COT for TCS, complete with a spec rotary resistor, we could put this discussion to bed
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Old 10-17-2010, 08:17 PM
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Forget about the rules.......What I want to know is WHICH VENUES WILL BE RUNNING OFF-ROAD?
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Old 10-17-2010, 08:50 PM
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Exclamation The future of TCS!

Well, we all finally got what we wanted, an equal playing field. What's that saying "be careful what you wish for".
Seriously, I appreciate that Tamiya is trying to keep up with technology. When me and my son went to Japan, all the technology was still brushed motors and Nimh batteries. Now that they entered the 20th Century they go all in and want all the GT classes to run brushless. Don't forget Fred wanted to go non-sensored system for the Nationals but a K.O. controller issue came in play.
Now the big, big ,big question is cost and customer service.
I've been running Novak motors since they started brushless and have been lucky to have great customer service. I gone through many smoking motors and not all were my fault but they still allowed us to exchange for a reasonable fee. This customer service have saved me and I'm sure several racers big bucks for replacement.
Is Tamiya going to do the same? Is replacement of ESC's or motors going to break the bank? I'm all for equal racing and improved ESC/ Motors but at what cost if they don't stand behind their product?
This is a very big "IF" but I believe this needs to be addressed!
Don't forget there are fathers and sons racing TCS also and if costs and services are not put into the mix, there will be a steep price to pay!
I hope TCS doesn't turn into an Elite Class of Racing for people with deep pockets!

Just my 2$
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Old 10-17-2010, 09:39 PM
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Originally Posted by BP SHADOW
Asian granpa, asian oriental is for rugs
Aaahhh, I see grasshopper, You too young to see Charlie Chan movie. I, veddy, veddy old Oriental man. Asian for young. Asian mind not inscrutable. Oriental mind different.

Hope you remember the old Kung fu series.
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Old 10-17-2010, 09:42 PM
  #14489  
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Originally Posted by rccardr
Like Brad says, Tom, that wasn't my post. Frankly, I've been laying off posting anything on this topic because I've been trying to figure out the reasoning behind Tamiya's move..
Sorry, Doc. As the crazed Italian violinist sang in the fifth series (Mr. Neutron) episode of Monty Python's Flying Circus, "My Mistake/ I have made a mistake."
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Old 10-17-2010, 10:30 PM
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Default Wait and see...

I bet that for every one of the die-hard silver can devotees who will boycott TCS there are three racers like me who will finally race TCS largely because silver cans are out of the picture...


Not trollin'....just sayin'.
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