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Old 06-21-2010, 05:55 PM
  #13666  
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Talking RE: "My opinion" whatever thats worth!

Originally Posted by BP SHADOW
I really feel for you, only seven full test days left to find a setup.
Hopefully you realize how absurd that sounds.
How about the guys that will fly in on Thursday night and have only Friday and an hour of tracktime on Saturday to get things figured out?
No one, including Tamiya is holding a gun to your head and forcing you to run GT3, its a choice that all of you guys are making. And I might add that you have no one to blame but yourselves, you started the speedo war and now you have to deal with the fallout from it.
As I said before, Scotty outlawed the 203 software for his race , and while the Tekin crowd had to scramble to figure out gearing and timing for the 200 software, the racing was very even.
It wouldnt take an act of god to implement a similar rule for Nats.
Whether the rules change or change classes based on the rules, the TA locals will still have an advantage at that track, and that is fine, I am not moving to Cali so that I can become a local, just not in the cards for me.
Again, I am holding out hope that I can make it out there for this years race, but at the moment it is not looking good
Miracles do happen though
BP shadow,
I think you give me way too much credit that me and all the Tamiya locals are somehow to blame for starting the speedo wars. Tekin has every right to improve their product and Fred has every right to limit the improvement on the speedo settings, for whatever reason he didn't want to do that!
All of us locals know that until Fred makes a decision on which class winners go to Japan there is no telling which three he will select and yes it would be my fault to assume the Gt-2 class is one of those. We all make an educated guess on which one will go and be ready to compete when he decides. If we choose wrong then we do have to decide if we want to switch classes.
If I had a dollar for everytime someone says the locals have an advantage I would be a milllionare. The whole point of spec racing is that there is "not" an advantage dispite everyones view otherwise but thats a whole other topic for discussion.
If you choose to come out and race the Nationals and compete for the trip then the more power too you and I just hope nobody put a gun to your head to buy a ticket for hotel and fly out and only have 2 practice day to prepare. If that's true then I feel your pain! This too is absurd!
Just my 2$
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Old 06-21-2010, 06:32 PM
  #13667  
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Originally Posted by maxepower
BP shadow,
I think you give me way too much credit that me and all the Tamiya locals are somehow to blame for starting the speedo wars. Tekin has every right to improve their product and Fred has every right to limit the improvement on the speedo settings, for whatever reason he didn't want to do that!
All of us locals know that until Fred makes a decision on which class winners go to Japan there is no telling which three he will select and yes it would be my fault to assume the Gt-2 class is one of those. We all make an educated guess on which one will go and be ready to compete when he decides. If we choose wrong then we do have to decide if we want to switch classes.
If I had a dollar for everytime someone says the locals have an advantage I would be a milllionare. The whole point of spec racing is that there is "not" an advantage dispite everyones view otherwise but thats a whole other topic for discussion.
If you choose to come out and race the Nationals and compete for the trip then the more power too you and I just hope nobody put a gun to your head to buy a ticket for hotel and fly out and only have 2 practice day to prepare. If that's true then I feel your pain! This too is absurd!
Just my 2$
No , no one holds a gun to my head to make me come out and race, I make that decision on my own.
I am currently unemployed, so my employment status will determine my location come the end of August.
When I say you have yourselves to blame, it may not be all of you, and you are right, Tekin has every right to improve their product. However, the way they went about it was very irresponsible and did a fair bit of damage to the hobby.
Maybe the Tekin is more like a parasite, one gets into the system, and then another until they over run it.
And Erik is not lying about the Trackside TCS, more than one motor went up in smoke on the 200 software, and I might add that Scotty limited the profile on the SPX's too. Those two speedos may still have had an advantage, but the gap wasnt quite as big. I run KO BMC's myself in my GT2 cars, but I would be running F1 anyways.
And if you think running at TA every weekend doesnt give you an advantage, you are delusional.
Anyone that shows up there the week of the nats spends most of the time trying to get the car to go around the track without spinning, or at least finding a usable amount of grip. If you are lucky you might be able to work on lines the last half of Friday and a little on Saturday morning.
Lee Passehl is a perfect example. He was always fast out there, but it wasn't till he became a local that he became champ, why? Because he was able to find that last couple of percent that put him ahead. I know that not every past champ has come from SoCal, but there are quite a few. I myself have not been to the nats in 3 years, so anything that I knew about the track is pretty much useless at this point
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Old 06-21-2010, 08:44 PM
  #13668  
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I am a relative newbie to TCS compared to many of you, so could anyone tell me who determines the Japan trip winners. Does Fred do it???? Or is it someone else like corporate in Japan??? I never gave it much thought as not being talented enough to go, it was immaterial to me. All the long, long posts made me curious tho.
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Old 06-21-2010, 08:48 PM
  #13669  
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Originally Posted by Granpa
I am a relative newbie to TCS compared to many of you, so could anyone tell me who determines the Japan trip winners. Does Fred do it???? Or is it someone else like corporate in Japan??? I never gave it much thought as not being talented enough to go, it was immaterial to me. All the long, long posts made me curious tho.
Granpa,
From what I know Japan sets the classes that are run at the worlds, then it is up to Fred to find the best fit for the 3 classes. F1 and Mini are no brainers, but the GT classes are a bit different over there in regards to the motor and battery selection
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Old 06-21-2010, 09:19 PM
  #13670  
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Is there any active discussions or sale threads for those who are local? I want to buy a TB Evo IV from tamiya on closeout but I am having a hard time figuring out how this will do as a first on road car?

I won't race it I don't think but I would like to put in some fast fun laps at the Aliso track....
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Old 06-22-2010, 12:01 AM
  #13671  
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do Tamiya Europe and Tamiya Asia have these problems in the GT classes? Tekin is sold worldwide. How do they handle the brushless situation?
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Old 06-22-2010, 12:37 AM
  #13672  
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Originally Posted by BP SHADOW
No , no one holds a gun to my head to make me come out and race, I make that decision on my own.
I am currently unemployed, so my employment status will determine my location come the end of August.
When I say you have yourselves to blame, it may not be all of you, and you are right, Tekin has every right to improve their product. However, the way they went about it was very irresponsible and did a fair bit of damage to the hobby.
Maybe the Tekin is more like a parasite, one gets into the system, and then another until they over run it.
And Erik is not lying about the Trackside TCS, more than one motor went up in smoke on the 200 software, and I might add that Scotty limited the profile on the SPX's too. Those two speedos may still have had an advantage, but the gap wasnt quite as big. I run KO BMC's myself in my GT2 cars, but I would be running F1 anyways.
And if you think running at TA every weekend doesnt give you an advantage, you are delusional.
Anyone that shows up there the week of the nats spends most of the time trying to get the car to go around the track without spinning, or at least finding a usable amount of grip. If you are lucky you might be able to work on lines the last half of Friday and a little on Saturday morning.
Lee Passehl is a perfect example. He was always fast out there, but it wasn't till he became a local that he became champ, why? Because he was able to find that last couple of percent that put him ahead. I know that not every past champ has come from SoCal, but there are quite a few. I myself have not been to the nats in 3 years, so anything that I knew about the track is pretty much useless at this point
technically speaking.. the Black Diamond is to blame. They started the whole "boost" thing. Tekin just played catch up.
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Old 06-22-2010, 12:42 AM
  #13673  
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Cool "Disclaimer on the Disclaimer"

Originally Posted by BP SHADOW
No , no one holds a gun to my head to make me come out and race, I make that decision on my own.
I am currently unemployed, so my employment status will determine my location come the end of August.
When I say you have yourselves to blame, it may not be all of you, and you are right, Tekin has every right to improve their product. However, the way they went about it was very irresponsible and did a fair bit of damage to the hobby.
Maybe the Tekin is more like a parasite, one gets into the system, and then another until they over run it.
And Erik is not lying about the Trackside TCS, more than one motor went up in smoke on the 200 software, and I might add that Scotty limited the profile on the SPX's too. Those two speedos may still have had an advantage, but the gap wasnt quite as big. I run KO BMC's myself in my GT2 cars, but I would be running F1 anyways.
And if you think running at TA every weekend doesnt give you an advantage, you are delusional.
Anyone that shows up there the week of the nats spends most of the time trying to get the car to go around the track without spinning, or at least finding a usable amount of grip. If you are lucky you might be able to work on lines the last half of Friday and a little on Saturday morning.
Lee Passehl is a perfect example. He was always fast out there, but it wasn't till he became a local that he became champ, why? Because he was able to find that last couple of percent that put him ahead. I know that not every past champ has come from SoCal, but there are quite a few. I myself have not been to the nats in 3 years, so anything that I knew about the track is pretty much useless at this point
If you are completely and truly positive that only locals who have the set-up right and practice there every weekend have total advantage. I probably won't be able to convince you otherwise and I wouldn't even try.
I could give you a list of past champs for the last 10 years and at best 50% will be locals but that also may not make any difference to you.
If you want to believe that Lee would not have been able to ever win if he didn't move to So.Cal. then you are not doing him justice.
Lee just finished qualifying 3rd in 17.5 at the Reedy and he is not a local there. I don't think you give him enough credit that he and his Dad have reached a skill level in driving and set-up with any car and not just at the Tamiya track but I guess that won't change your mind either. Believe whatever you want to believe, but believe this, Lee and his Dad are that good!
Please don't drag good people like Lee and Don into this rediculous pissing match and this conversation of who is right and wrong or dilusional or not and who can have the last word to feel good about themselves is pointless.
I'm sorry your unemployed and I have a few friends in So.Cal that are in the same situation.
Be that as it may, lets end this conversation so we can agree to disagree. Live long and prosper!
The END
no 2$

Last edited by maxepower; 06-22-2010 at 12:54 AM.
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Old 06-22-2010, 03:29 AM
  #13674  
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Originally Posted by Hebiki
technically speaking.. the Black Diamond is to blame. They started the whole "boost" thing. Tekin just played catch up.
and passed Black Diamond
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Old 06-22-2010, 06:36 AM
  #13675  
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Originally Posted by maxepower
If you are completely and truly positive that only locals who have the set-up right and practice there every weekend have total advantage. I probably won't be able to convince you otherwise and I wouldn't even try.
I could give you a list of past champs for the last 10 years and at best 50% will be locals but that also may not make any difference to you.
If you want to believe that Lee would not have been able to ever win if he didn't move to So.Cal. then you are not doing him justice.
Lee just finished qualifying 3rd in 17.5 at the Reedy and he is not a local there. I don't think you give him enough credit that he and his Dad have reached a skill level in driving and set-up with any car and not just at the Tamiya track but I guess that won't change your mind either. Believe whatever you want to believe, but believe this, Lee and his Dad are that good!
Please don't drag good people like Lee and Don into this rediculous pissing match and this conversation of who is right and wrong or dilusional or not and who can have the last word to feel good about themselves is pointless.
I'm sorry your unemployed and I have a few friends in So.Cal that are in the same situation.
Be that as it may, lets end this conversation so we can agree to disagree. Live long and prosper!
The END
no 2$
Ok, first of all I am not dragging Lee and Don into anything, they are friends of mine who I have raced with and against for many years. I have the utmost respect for them as competitors and human beings. I was merely stating that Lee had run at the top of his class many times at the Nats only to come up just a bit short, until he moved out there.
And I know that he is fast at other venues besides TA, and I also know that there are National Champs from other states besides California. I have raced at TA since it opened back in 1994,I have had some decent runs there and some horrible ones. If you spend enough time out there to understand how the track changes in any or all conditions, then you will be fast. How do you do this? Well living in close proximity and being able to try all kinds of different car setups cant hurt now can it?
Not saying that it is impossible to win as an out of towner, but the deck is not stacked in our favor either.
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Old 06-22-2010, 07:19 AM
  #13676  
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So is ANYONE going to run GT2 at the Nats now that the trip class was chosen to be GT3? I was looking to run GT2 and GT4 if I am able to swing the trip out there, but from the forum chatter I get the impression there may not be a GT2 class. I'm one of those weird guys that runs for fun, not for a trip to Japan (not that I've got a chance either, LOL).

[Flame suit on] - Not trying to stir the pot, but home track advantage cannot be ignored, not matter where the venue. And in my experience running TCS events all over the country, the greatest advantage seems to be at the T/A track. In general carpet is carpet (I do not have a home carpet track), and most of the other venues are parking lot surfaces that tend to be similar from location to location. But Aliso is a special track, and it takes a while to figure out the setup (including inserts).

But hey, we "out of towners" go out there knowing that, and those that want to close the gap have flown out a week early back when they had speed week (which unfortunately is no longer an option). If I had a track like that near my house, I'd be running there every weekend too. You cannot beat the experience you gain by running on the same track pack after pack!
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Old 06-22-2010, 07:40 AM
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Originally Posted by minimadman2003
So is ANYONE going to run GT2 at the Nats now that the trip class was chosen to be GT3? I was looking to run GT2 and GT4 if I am able to swing the trip out there, but from the forum chatter I get the impression there may not be a GT2 class. I'm one of those weird guys that runs for fun, not for a trip to Japan (not that I've got a chance either, LOL).

[Flame suit on] - Not trying to stir the pot, but home track advantage cannot be ignored, not matter where the venue. And in my experience running TCS events all over the country, the greatest advantage seems to be at the T/A track. In general carpet is carpet (I do not have a home carpet track), and most of the other venues are parking lot surfaces that tend to be similar from location to location. But Aliso is a special track, and it takes a while to figure out the setup (including inserts).

But hey, we "out of towners" go out there knowing that, and those that want to close the gap have flown out a week early back when they had speed week (which unfortunately is no longer an option). If I had a track like that near my house, I'd be running there every weekend too. You cannot beat the experience you gain by running on the same track pack after pack!
Thank you Bill, you are a gentleman and a scholar
I'm thinking if I am able to make it that I might switch to GT2 , I might even buy a Tekin, and I have Lees TB03 and setup info ( I know he won it with the TA05) because hey , why not
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Old 06-22-2010, 08:51 AM
  #13678  
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Sorry Max, but locals do have an advantage. BUT, this year one of the big advantages that the locals had has been eliminated, especially in Mini. The spec tire has taken away all the "trick" insert combinations that the locals used to run. Tuning a Mini is no longer 80% tire, but working around one of least run tire and insert combinations for the local "gurus", of which I am not one.
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Old 06-22-2010, 09:09 AM
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OK let me climb the ladder to my enormous SOAP BOX. Here YEEE Here YEEEE
Problem one local guys have the advantage ok easy fix - Move to socal plus our weather is better then yours anyways and the chicks are hotter too.
Problem two - Tekin, Boost, Tire Inserts, GT1 ?, GT2 ?, sell all of your sedan stuff and run Mini problem solved
Problem three - No problem !!! I spent $00.00 on entry fees at Tamiya, Its more exciting and has more drama then any other series. I run it for fun and get to relax and forget about all of my real problems I have for a few days. Its kinda like chicken soup for the RC Racer's soul.
Fred made some good decisions based on what was the general concensus and he is not taking sides but merely keeping this amazing series alive and kicking.
The mini tires thing ?????? well I would have given us the s grips and type B's premounted and let us figure a setup everyone knows that you dont run the same four tires with inserts in a mini but thats ok rules a rule and I will find some way to have a legal advantage come Nats.
Last Problem - When do we interview the trophy girls to see which one will be handing me my ticket at Nats. Unless its Laurel

Peace in the Hood
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Old 06-22-2010, 09:41 AM
  #13680  
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Originally Posted by SirSwiftAlot
OK let me climb the ladder to my enormous SOAP BOX. Here YEEE Here YEEEE
Problem one local guys have the advantage ok easy fix - Move to socal plus our weather is better then yours anyways and the chicks are hotter too.
Problem two - Tekin, Boost, Tire Inserts, GT1 ?, GT2 ?, sell all of your sedan stuff and run Mini problem solved
Problem three - No problem !!! I spent $00.00 on entry fees at Tamiya, Its more exciting and has more drama then any other series. I run it for fun and get to relax and forget about all of my real problems I have for a few days. Its kinda like chicken soup for the RC Racer's soul.
Fred made some good decisions based on what was the general concensus and he is not taking sides but merely keeping this amazing series alive and kicking.
The mini tires thing ?????? well I would have given us the s grips and type B's premounted and let us figure a setup everyone knows that you dont run the same four tires with inserts in a mini but thats ok rules a rule and I will find some way to have a legal advantage come Nats.
Last Problem - When do we interview the trophy girls to see which one will be handing me my ticket at Nats. Unless its Laurel

Peace in the Hood
Eloquent as usual
I might dispute the chick part of it, but SoCal does have an abundance of Bettys!!!
As far as the trophy girl how about this one?


And she already has her own Tamiya shirt!!!!
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